Hello!
When looking eBay listings, how can I tell if its a 8500LE o a higher clocked 8500?
Both cards look the same, and have the same P/N (109-85700-00).
The card I saw doesn't have labels at the back.
They do look identical as far as I remember and ATI's old part number database is long gone. Programs often identify them as the same thing too. 8500/8500LE.
Check if the board has faster RAM chips installed.
All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder
True 8500LE usually lacked the second RAMDAC. It's a small chip located near the GPU.
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The Serpent Rider wrote on 2023-12-27, 02:08:True 8500LE usually lacked the second RAMDAC. It's a small chip located near the GPU.
Theatre? I don't think that is a good clue, nor ramdac.
Putas wrote on 2023-12-27, 05:12:Theatre? I don't think that is a good clue, nor ramdac.
Radeon 8500 has additional external RAMDAC. All "proper" cost-reduced LE variants don't have that chip and are loaded with 4ns memory. All reference design cards with RAMDAC present are practically normal Radeon 8500 cards, with the only difference being default clock speed.
The only exception should be the BGA GDDR 128 Mb variant, which had better rated memory: https://www.anandtech.com/show/899/2
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
gdjacobs wrote on 2023-12-26, 23:48:Check if the board has faster RAM chips installed.
Has 3.6ns Hynix TSOP chips.
But Ive seen LE's with 3.3ns chips too... so I guess faster RAM is not an indicator of a real 8500.
But are those faster 3.3ns chips Etrontech or something else? I have one 8500 non-LE with 3.6ns Hynix.
3.6ns was the standard for Radeon 8500.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
I have both and they looks identical tbh
https://retro.user-unfriendly.net/Pictures/Ra … %20vs%208500LE/
The good thing is that LE can generally match the non LE speeds
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My collection (not up to date)
Cant trust any Ebay listings. All 3 of my 8500s I got off of there many years ago were all listed as 8500LEs and in fact they were all 8500s.
If they have a VGA port, S-video port and DVI port they are most likely (but not always) 8500s. Funny thing is the cards I got all had their paper labels on the back and they all said 8500 (no LE on them) and yet they were all listed as 8500LEs which was good as they were cheap.
Just dont get any that have mem chips higher than 3.6ns
I got two 64mb tsop variants and one 128mb bga.
SPiKA85 wrote on 2023-12-27, 13:16:gdjacobs wrote on 2023-12-26, 23:48:Check if the board has faster RAM chips installed.
Has 3.6ns Hynix TSOP chips.
But Ive seen LE's with 3.3ns chips too... so I guess faster RAM is not an indicator of a real 8500.
The faster RAM can potentially support the 275 mhz mem clock of non LE cards. Non LE cards won't come with 4ns RAM.
All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder
By the way - are there any 128MB R8500 (275 MHz, non-LE). I have never seen one, only 128MB LEs and R9100.
HW museum.cz - my collection of PC hardware
havli wrote on 2024-01-07, 10:28:By the way - are there any 128MB R8500 (275 MHz, non-LE). I have never seen one, only 128MB LEs and R9100.
I just bought a AIW 8500 128Mb today .. its 275/275 and not a LE or DV model, I was after a normal 8500 but they seem to be pretty damn rare on Evil Bay or stupidly expensive like the $350 AUD one up there right now. (The one I got is a PAL model so it might be useful as a capture card)
havli wrote on 2024-01-07, 10:28:By the way - are there any 128MB R8500 (275 MHz, non-LE). I have never seen one, only 128MB LEs and R9100.
It's not a proper 8500, but the FireGL 8800 may be the fastest R200 card, I have one clocked at 300/300 with 3.3ns BGA RAM. In Win98 it's easy to use it like a 8500 installing the 8500 drivers.
Hoping wrote on 2024-01-07, 12:02:It's not a proper 8500, but the FireGL 8800 may be the fastest R200 card, I have one clocked at 300/300 with 3.3ns BGA RAM. In Win98 it's easy to use it like a 8500 installing the 8500 drivers.
My experience is that everything but opengl works ok with the 8500 drivers, GL performance though is weird as in it either works and tanks FPS or it doesn't work.
I could never resolve the issue with the drivers I had, perhaps some modded drivers are required, the Fire GL drivers though OpenGL worked fine but D3D was garbage, so its 6 of one and half dozen of the other.
Trashbytes wrote on 2024-01-07, 13:10:Hoping wrote on 2024-01-07, 12:02:It's not a proper 8500, but the FireGL 8800 may be the fastest R200 card, I have one clocked at 300/300 with 3.3ns BGA RAM. In Win98 it's easy to use it like a 8500 installing the 8500 drivers.
My experience is that everything but opengl works ok with the 8500 drivers, GL performance though is weird as in it either works and tanks FPS or it doesn't work.
I could never resolve the issue with the drivers I had, perhaps some modded drivers are required, the Fire GL drivers though OpenGL worked fine but D3D was garbage, so its 6 of one and half dozen of the other.
The fireGL worked perfectly for me in Windows 98 with the 8500 drivers,D3D and OpenGL, in XP I also could not get good results with it.
In Windows 98, even Truform worked, tested it with Serious Sam with it's balloon shaped objects.😀
It makes me want to do tests again with the FireGL 8800, but I currently have the computer in which that graphics card is in storage.
Hoping wrote on 2024-01-07, 13:26:The fireGL worked perfectly for me in Windows 98 with the 8500 drivers,D3D and OpenGL, in XP I also could not get good results w […]
Trashbytes wrote on 2024-01-07, 13:10:Hoping wrote on 2024-01-07, 12:02:It's not a proper 8500, but the FireGL 8800 may be the fastest R200 card, I have one clocked at 300/300 with 3.3ns BGA RAM. In Win98 it's easy to use it like a 8500 installing the 8500 drivers.
My experience is that everything but opengl works ok with the 8500 drivers, GL performance though is weird as in it either works and tanks FPS or it doesn't work.
I could never resolve the issue with the drivers I had, perhaps some modded drivers are required, the Fire GL drivers though OpenGL worked fine but D3D was garbage, so its 6 of one and half dozen of the other.
The fireGL worked perfectly for me in Windows 98 with the 8500 drivers,D3D and OpenGL, in XP I also could not get good results with it.
In Windows 98, even Truform worked, tested it with Serious Sam with it's balloon shaped objects.😀
It makes me want to do tests again with the FireGL 8800, but I currently have the computer in which that graphics card is in storage.
Hmmm, I missed the 98 part, I was trying to get it working good under XP but if 98 works fine then it would be a great card for that OS.
Im guessing the Opengl issue under XP is driver related.
havli wrote on 2024-01-07, 10:28:By the way - are there any 128MB R8500 (275 MHz, non-LE). I have never seen one, only 128MB LEs and R9100.
Most prominent are:
Hercules 3D Prophet 8500
Gigabyte MAYA AP128DG-H RADEON 8500 Deluxe - https://www.ixbt.com/video2/any-r200-5-p1.shtml
Gigabyte MAYA AP128DG-H3, which is RADEON 8500XT (300/600) variation of the card above.
Trashbytes wrote on 2024-01-07, 13:42:Im guessing the Opengl issue under XP is driver related.
To be fair, Radeon 8500/Fire GL 8800 are not really well-suited cards for XP era. There is a workaround which involves using Omega drivers. Or you can use two separate Windows XP installs to play Direct3D or OpenGL games.
I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.
