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First post, by borgie83

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Hi, I've got a problem with my new Pentium II rig. It's running Windows 98 SE. Whilst within windows, everything works as it should. Runs fantastic actually with no issues at all. My problem is within Dos 7. Navigating around dos is fine but as soon as I try to install any drivers eg sound blaster awe32 or GUS, the system hangs/freezes and I'm forced to reset the pc. Even if I go to run a game eg Hexen and set the sound to no sound the system hangs again. I cannot seem to run any software nor install any drivers within Dos. Everything just hangs when I either run the install.bat files or run the game executable file. Very strange as I've never encountered this before on my various dos rigs. I'm thinking my issue may be related to memory even though the memory has been tested in other rigs and works fine in those. I also can't seem to update the bios from P16 to P17. Give me an invalid disk error on boot up. Figured it might of been a bios issue but I honestly don't know unfortunately 🙁

The specs are as follows:

Intel SE440BX-2 Motherboard
Pentium II 450Mhz CPU
Kingston 384mb Ram (3x128mb)
Western Digital Caviar SE 120Gb IDE Hard Drive
TNT2 Ultra AGP Graphics Card
Voodoo 2 12mb in SLI
Diamond MX300 PCI Sound Card
Sound blaster AWE32 ISA Sound Card
Gravis Ultrasound Classic ISA Sound Card

Yes I'm aware there is 3 sound cards obviously, the MX300 is used only for windows whilst the 2 ISA sound cards are only for dos sound.

I should also note that I've tried running the pc with basically nothing loaded in the config.sys and autoexec.bat files except for the cdrom drive but still no luck. If I do load even a small bit extra I get memory issues when loading windows. Hence the reason I believe this is a memory issue.

Reply 1 of 13, by Jo22

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You can try Memtest86.
It's a diagnostic program and it checks the memory.
If it's ok, try Himem.sys with these parameters /cpuclock:on /machine:11 .
It may help a bit to stabilize your system.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

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Reply 2 of 13, by Mau1wurf1977

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That's the problem with playing DOS games inside Windows 98 SE: It quickly gets complicated 😀

Do you boot into DOS mode or do you run the games from within Windows?

You might be best off to get another hard drive and build a dedicated DOS installation. The problem then is that you might need different PnP BIOS options.

Either way it's not easy and I don't know how to help you across the Internet 😒

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Reply 3 of 13, by borgie83

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Jo22, as I said, I've tested the ram and it is definitely ok so my issue lays somewhere else unfortunately.

Mau1warf1977, I'm rebooting into dos from windows, not running dos within windows. I have tried running dos though within windows and also by booting directly into dos via the F8 function but didn't have any luck either way. You also stated about using another hard drive, do you believe my hard drive may be too large? I could always partition it. Or we're you referring to having a drive dedicated to Dos using just say dos 6.22? Again with that option I could dual boot.

I just find it strange how on one of my other rigs, I've got a 120gb hard drive dedicated to windows 98 se and that pc runs 1gb ddr400 ram (2x512mb) and it doesn't suffer from this issue at all.

Reply 4 of 13, by Dominus

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Maybe it's time you experiment with the sound cards, see if removing two of them helps (or removing all and then add one after the other to see if there is aproblem)

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Reply 5 of 13, by Jo22

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I'm sorry. I thought, you were clearly referring to memory issues..
And I have no idea how you tested your memory.
Would you please post your "basically nothing loaded in the config.sys and autoexec.bat" ? 😀
Btw, I'd also recommend a clean installation of MS-DOS 6.x for testing purposes.
Also write a checklist, and, as Dominus suggested, go on step by step.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 6 of 13, by borgie83

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Hi Jo22, I should've been more clear sorry. I firstly put the ram into another 2 older rigs that I have and it functioned ok and then I ran memtest and got no issues. So my issue is not the ram. Didn't think it would've been considering its brand new. Only took the sticks out of their packaging a few weeks ago.

In regards to the autoexec.bat and config.sys files, autoexec only had the mscdex cdrom driver loading whilst config.sys was loading the oakcdrom.sys driver. Nothing else was loaded besides this. I've since done a clean format and am going to try reinstall windows 98 se again and go from there. Don't really want to install Dos 6.22 as even if that does work I'm going to have to format again. Need this rig to work with 98 se which it should.

I've also removed my MX300 and Gus sound cards as instructed only leaving the AWE32 in there. Will see how I go with this setup after the reinstallation.

I'm also going to try update the bios via cdrom instead of floppy to see if the bios has something to do with my issue.

Reply 7 of 13, by borgie83

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Ok, so I took the GUS and MX300 out, reinstalled windows 98. Loaded the windows and dos drivers for the AWE32 and Bam! Everything (in dos) works fine now. Must've had something to do with the extra sound cards being installed. My issue now is that I'm getting a blue screen error when I try to load windows. I've attached a photo of the blue screen error for your referance. I believe this is due to the fact that I let windows install the awe32 drivers for me instead of using the creative drivers instead, mainly due to the windows drivers being made in 1999 as opposed to the awe32 drivers being made in 1994. Stupid mistake which I'll have to try rectify within the next few days. After that I'm going to attempt to put the GUS back in. I'm thinking that the MX300 was the cause of my issues as it automatically loads it's dos emulation drivers everytime. Even though I specifically said on install for the dos drivers not to be installed. And yes I tried uninstalling the dos emulation through device manager. Kept adding its lines to my autoexec.bat file anyway. Might try using a SBLive PCI card instead for windows sound.

Any comments on the blue screen error would be greatly appreciated 😀

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Reply 8 of 13, by Dominus

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Soooo... You did have more than the mscdex drivers in the autoexec.bat
We did ask specifically and now you write it was always added...

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Reply 9 of 13, by chinny22

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If win9x is blue screening due to drivers and it sounds like it is, usually its just better to do another clean install. The early versions weren't known for their great undo ability if something went wrong.
It'll probably take a few reinstalls of windows to find the perfect combination of drivers but once you do with the hardware you have it should be pretty stable.
Think your on the right track, I'd recommend installing the drivers from earliest to latest. EG Awe32 first as they will be quite old. The Mx300 will have the latest released drivers so do that last. Are you applying any updates or unofficial service packs? I wouldn't bother myself on a games machine as that will change system files all over the place.

As you got dos working now, I'd copy the autoexec/config.sys and the folder where the drivers are all installed somewhere as you have a working config. be shame for something to change and loose all that work

Reply 10 of 13, by borgie83

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Dominus, to be honest I did forget to mention it so yes your right. I don't believe that was the issue though because for some reason those drivers were only loaded when restarting in msdos mode from windows. When I booted directly to dos these drivers were not loaded nor were the lines added to my autoexec.bat file. But the issue was still there regardless, hence the reason I stated only the mscdex and oakcdrom.sys were loaded.

Chinny22, yeah I'm going to reinstall windows soon and see how we go from there. 2 questions for you though...firstly, yes I was using the unofficial service pack 3. Do you believe this would have caused dos issues as I thought it would've only affected windows? Lastly, do you know what the last official awe32 drivers were and if so, could you provide a download link? Taking into consideration, my awe32 is a CT3900 with a genuine OPL chip not a vibra chip and DSP 4.13. My drivers are dated 1994.

Reply 11 of 13, by borgie83

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Chinny22, sorry just remembered...yes I was using the unofficial service pack 3 when the issue of nothing working in dos was occurring but after I did a complete format and got the sound working in dos I did not reinstall the unofficial service pack the second time round so my blue screen error won't have anything to do with the unofficial service pack.

Reply 12 of 13, by chinny22

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Nah cant see the service pack making changes to the Dos drivers but can see it easily causing Windows to bluescreen. Up until XP It wasn't uncommon for a driver to make a change to a shared dll which would cause side affects when something else tried to use the same dll, or worse still try to make a modification of its own Think this is what's happened to you.

Add in official updates that change files all over the place and then the unofficial SP which adds kernel updates to allow you to run newer programs things can get very confusing for a poor simple OS like 98.

Personally I go the other way and try to run a lite OS, cutting out things like IE which are never going to be used on a PC only used to play games. Its never going to go on the internet so would rather an OS with big security holes then bog it down with all the security patch's and still have a unsecure OS at the end of the day.
Case in point My 98 machine shuts down fine without the shutdown patches. Its only when I start to apply updates does this stop working.

Then there is creative and their terrible driver install programs but would still trust them over MS drivers which are usually already out of date and more basic.
I'm not sure of the latest drivers for Win9x as my card is in a dos only machine. but TheMans compilation CD has every driver released so have a play with that till you find something your happy with http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=13

Installing in windows the driver will very kindly override your dos legacy settings which is why I recommend backing up all your dos drivers.

Dos I'm using the Win95 legacy drivers (only the installer checks for the OS version, boot off a boot disk and you can install the dos tools on any os)
Or looking at the Vogons Drive page seems Malik has already done the work for you. I've got the CT3910 which is the same as yours accept Awe32 Value so it'll work
http://www.vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=65

Reply 13 of 13, by Kurasiu

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Looking at the bluescreen... 0E fatal exception at 0028:XXXXXXXX? That's almost the exact same error I had while booting Windows not that long ago, described here. In my case it was caused by a faulty jumper configuration on the IDE devices, and, from what I remember, it may also be caused by faulty drivers/configurations, so I agree with chinny22 about the unofficial SP3 being the culprit.

And don't worry about reinstalling Windows, I also did three reinstalls before getting everything (Win98/DOS) to run silky smooth. Even picky games like Monster Bash now works, with sound and such!