VOGONS


First post, by athlon_p0wer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

I have configured my 486 with Windows 95, but with a boot screen that lets me choose between Windows 95 booting normally with no changes at all and booting into MS-DOS mode, which I've configured with HIMEM.SYS and EMM386. I have DOS running in the UMB.

In DOS, It loads everything and detects the sound card, but when the screen fades to black just before the program actually launches, the system crashes. I looked it up, and on their website it states to run AT2 through Windows if it crashes in DOS mode. I tried that, and it gives an insufficient memory error, which I've never seen it do on standard Windows 95.

I know the recommended requirements for this program state a Pentium, but I've ran this just fine under standard Windows 3.x/MS-DOS 6.22, so I don't see any reason why it shouldn't run under DOS, or at least Windows 95.

System specs:

OPTI 82C802 Chipset
486 DX2-66
128KB L2 15ns
16MB RAM 60ns (I'm pretty sure it's running at 70ns because I don't think this chipset can do 60ns, but that doesn't really matter here)
Cirrus Logic CL-5430
Soundblaster Vibra 16s
1.2GB Seagate Medalist HDD
HP DVD Writer 200i (I know this makes no sense, but I have no other working and unused IDE CD-ROM drives and it works well for that purpose)

[AUTOEXEC.BAT]

@ECHO OFF
GOTO %CONFIG%

:DOS
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D3 P330 T4
C:\MOUSE.EXE (ctmouse v2.0)
GOTO END

:WIN
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D3 P330 T4
C:\WINDOWS\WIN.COM
GOTO END

:END

[CONFIG.SYS]

[MENU]
MENUITEM=WIN
MENUITEM=DOS

[DOS]
DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\EMM386.EXE RAM AUTO I=B000-B7FF
DOS=UMB

[WIN]

Additionally, I tried running DOS with just HIMEM.SYS and in the high memory area, and it crashed at the same place with those settings as well. It's strange that it gives an insufficient memory error in Win95 considering that I have twice the RAM that it recommends and it launches DOOM and similar games under Windows just fine. I think it has something to do with how Windows is managing its memory though, so I'm really trying to get this to work under DOS. Any thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated, I'm at a loss.

A miscellaneous problem I've been having that may or may not be related is that if I just boot up the computer into DOS mode and start Wolfenstein 3D, the gun and various other digitized sounds do not play, but the menu sounds do. When I launch any other DOS game before Wolfenstein, the sounds work. I'm not sure how to fix this, either.

Reply 1 of 10, by Gmlb256

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

On AT2 did you edit the ADTRACK2.INI file and set opl_latency to 1? I had issues with opl_latency=0, but in my case the program didn't crash and it was on a faster computer.

Apart from this, the Vibra16S is a PnP card and you need to get CTCM for initialization in DOS or MS-DOS mode. Besides, the BLASTER environment variable is slightly wrong. It should be the following in your case:

SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 H5 P330 T6

T4 is for SB Pro 2.0 and T6 is for SB16, this also assumes that DMA channel is set to 1 (which is recommended) instead of 3.

VIA C3 Nehemiah 1.2A @ 1.46 GHz | ASUS P2-99 | 256 MB PC133 SDRAM | GeForce2 GTS 32 MB | Voodoo2 12 MB | SBLive! | AWE64 | SBPro2 | GUS

Reply 2 of 10, by athlon_p0wer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
Gmlb256 wrote on 2021-10-17, 19:24:
On AT2 did you edit the ADTRACK2.INI file and set opl_latency to 1? I had issues with opl_latency=0, but in my case the program […]
Show full quote

On AT2 did you edit the ADTRACK2.INI file and set opl_latency to 1? I had issues with opl_latency=0, but in my case the program didn't crash and it was on a faster computer.

Apart from this, the Vibra16S is a PnP card and you need to get CTCM for initialization in DOS or MS-DOS mode. Besides, the BLASTER environment variable is slightly wrong. It should be the following in your case:

SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 H5 P330 T6

T4 is for SB Pro 2.0 and T6 is for SB16, this also assumes that DMA channel is set to 1 (which is recommended) instead of 3.

I can't use DMA 1 because it's taken up by another device in the system that's in the motherboard. Serial and parallel ports are disabled as is APM and it doesn't have any other expansion cards in it, so I'm guessing that it's probably something to do with the IDE controller.

I already had opl_latency set to 1 because I've never seen it work with it set to 0, and I've used AT2 on four or five sound cards total. I've been having luck without CTCM, as I'm using a driver package that allows Windows to manage the PnP resources and set them in stone so that DOS mode can use them. This has worked fine so far, but if changing the BLASTER variables around a little bit doesn't work, I'll have to resort to CTCM.

Reply 3 of 10, by Gmlb256

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Ok, but you still have to fix the BLASTER environment variable.

SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D3 H5 P330 T6

This one is that you will be using for that SB16 sound card.

On CONFIG.SYS use DOS=HIGH,UMB instead as HIGH will move some parts of MS-DOS into HMA (not UMB), giving you a bit of conventional memory.

The issue with AT2 seems strange, what does appear on the screen when it crashes in DOS?

VIA C3 Nehemiah 1.2A @ 1.46 GHz | ASUS P2-99 | 256 MB PC133 SDRAM | GeForce2 GTS 32 MB | Voodoo2 12 MB | SBLive! | AWE64 | SBPro2 | GUS

Reply 4 of 10, by athlon_p0wer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
Gmlb256 wrote on 2021-10-17, 20:43:
Ok, but you still have to fix the BLASTER environment variable. […]
Show full quote

Ok, but you still have to fix the BLASTER environment variable.

SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D3 H5 P330 T6

This one is that you will be using for that SB16 sound card.

On CONFIG.SYS use DOS=HIGH,UMB instead as HIGH will move some parts of MS-DOS into HMA (not UMB), giving you a bit of conventional memory.

The issue with AT2 seems strange, what does appear on the screen when it crashes in DOS?

Thank you, I corrected the BLASTER variables and set DOS= to put it in high memory as well, and now the conventional memory bar is completely free in Wolf3D. Setting the blaster variables didn't fix Wolf3D though, so I'm not sure what's going on with that. I'm going to try installing CTCM and seeing if that helps.

As far as AT2 goes, it gets to the point where it's found whatever I/O it's chosen for the sound card, the shell slowly fades to black like normal, and it crashes almost instantly after that. I don't ever see the main screen of AT2, and the screen remains black.

[EDIT]
I can only use CTCM in config.sys, and that doesn't help with Wolf3D. If I try to run CTCU in autoexec.bat, it detects that it's running under DOS 7 and doesn't load.

Reply 5 of 10, by Gmlb256

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
athlon_p0wer wrote on 2021-10-17, 20:54:

Thank you, I corrected the BLASTER variables and set DOS= to put it in high memory as well, and now the conventional memory bar is completely free in Wolf3D.

You're welcome!

Setting the blaster variables didn't fix Wolf3D though, so I'm not sure what's going on with that. I'm going to try installing CTCM and seeing if that helps.

IIRC, for Wolf3D only DMA channel 1 worked for me but you can't set that due to being used by another device. Does that other device allows to change the DMA channel?

As far as AT2 goes, it gets to the point where it's found whatever I/O it's chosen for the sound card, the shell slowly fades to black like normal, and it crashes almost instantly after that. I don't ever see the main screen of AT2, and the screen remains black.

In AT2 on the same file where you modify opl_latency there are two stuff related to video which are screen_mode and comp_text_mode, try playing with them to see what you get.

[EDIT]
I can only use CTCM in config.sys, and that doesn't help with Wolf3D. If I try to run CTCU in autoexec.bat, it detects that it's running under DOS 7 and doesn't load.

There's a workaround for CTCU

VIA C3 Nehemiah 1.2A @ 1.46 GHz | ASUS P2-99 | 256 MB PC133 SDRAM | GeForce2 GTS 32 MB | Voodoo2 12 MB | SBLive! | AWE64 | SBPro2 | GUS

Reply 6 of 10, by athlon_p0wer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

I couldn't get CTCM to detect the soundcard, but I did get it working except for that. I also tried a few different compatibility text modes, and nothing changed. It crashed and the display remained black like always. I also tried uninstalling the mouse drivers in case that was it, and changing the value that reduced FPS in case it maybe had something to do with that. It still doesn't want to launch.

Reply 7 of 10, by Gmlb256

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Mmm, AT2 has another program that is only used for music playback called ADT2PLAY and starts in text mode by default. That one requires using command-line switches for loading a file and the /latency parameter since it doesn't use the INI file.

VIA C3 Nehemiah 1.2A @ 1.46 GHz | ASUS P2-99 | 256 MB PC133 SDRAM | GeForce2 GTS 32 MB | Voodoo2 12 MB | SBLive! | AWE64 | SBPro2 | GUS

Reply 8 of 10, by athlon_p0wer

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
Gmlb256 wrote on 2021-10-17, 22:20:

Mmm, AT2 has another program that is only used for music playback called ADT2PLAY and starts in text mode by default. That one requires using command-line switches for loading a file and the /latency parameter since it doesn't use the INI file.

I had to take a break for a minute but once I was able to find out how ADT2PLAY worked, it worked! I can even launch it with /gfx. I don't understand why I can do that, but not launch regular AT2.

I'm guessing Wolf3D just doesn't like DMA 1, but it's locked to the floppy disk controller in both Windows and BIOS. It still does work after I play any other of my games first, so I'm wondering if there's a way to get it to work without that.

Reply 9 of 10, by etXzat

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

I have a very similar system and the exact same issues with Adlibtracker2 (but also more info and a possible workaround).
My system specs:

AMD am486 DX4 100
256kB L2
16MB FPM
OPTi Chipset on an unidentified VLB Board (maybe Shuttle, but no HOT-419)
AMI WinBIOS
Cirrus Logic VLB VGA (1MB video RAM)
OPTi MAD16 Pro Soundcard (with OPL4 module)

While the behavior under DOS 6/7 (system freeze) and Win95 (Insufficient DOS memory) are the same, I was able to run it successfully under WfW 3.11 of all things. Sometimes it crashes, too, with insufficient DOS memory, but when I click around a bit first in Windows (e.g., opening the MIDI driver config window or the media player and closing them again) it just works. (These machines are just crazy sometimes ...)
I did have other issues with this system and the OPL3/4, because they didn't like the "auto" setting for the ISA/AT bus timings at all. Unless I use the Turbo to decelerate the system or set the clock divider manually to a higher value, the OPL just produces terrible noises instead of the intended ones. 😉
Maybe the settings are mislabeled or the card doesn't like 8.25MHz (33MHz / 4). I doubt this problem and the crashes are at all related, but I'll investigate.

I'm sorry to necro bump with my first post here, but I wanted to add the info for those who have the same problem.

Reply 10 of 10, by Hrothgar486

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

I had a similar issue running adlib2 on my 486 also. This forum was really helpful for me. I have a 486DX 33 running Windows 95. Adtrack2 would not start in Windows due to insufficient memory. I tried to restart in Dos mode and was greeted by a hanging black screen. I modified config.sys DOS=UMB to DOS=HIGH,UMB. I changed the latency setting from 0 to 1. Still no dice. The final kicker that put it over the edge was the screen mode setting. I changed the resolution to 600x800 and it ran from DOS after that. Hope this helps someone out there.