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First post, by Lachdahnan

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I'm running XP SP2. Heres what I would like to accomplish:

A single solution that will play most of the 95/98 games I have. (I would like to avoid having unique and elaborate setups tailored to each specific game if possible being that I have many many old games.)

What I have tried so far:

Windows VM. This was great for 2D games, but once the game required some 3D power things went downhill fast.

Wine. I couldnt even compile it being that I am still a newcomer to the programming scene.

VMware Workstation. Again, this seemed to work very well for the 2D games. But 3D was a no go.

I have yet to try Parallels.

Bochs. This seems like it has potential, but takes quite a bit of time to setup and I would rather just ask if its viable rather than spend so much time to find out its not.

Application Compatability Toolkit 5.0 Upon toying with this for a little bit it seemed that its more of an enhanced version of the compatability tab built into windows. This will not get me anywhere with a 16 bit game correct? I did try, but I had no working results. I easily could have done something wrong on my end causing it not to work however.

It seems to me the best method is an emulator to cater to the 16 bit games as well. Im not even sure if what I'm looking for is even near possible. But thats why I came here to ask 😀 So, what do you all use? What have you found to be most beneficial for your 95/98 and 16 bit games?

Thank you much!

Reply 1 of 10, by MiniMax

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Bochs is (I believe) a no-go. I think it does a full software emulation of the CPU so it will be incredible slow.

I am no expert on ACT, but 16-bit programs shouldn't be a problem since you are on XP. And it will be fast. Maybe too fast. Thrown in VDMSound, and I think you will have something that works for you.

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Reply 2 of 10, by leileilol

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VMs and 3D accelleration is still a stone's throw in the water.

QEMU is my favorite.

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Reply 3 of 10, by Lachdahnan

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I havent found any guides specificly tailored to running older games using ACT 5.0 or any of the newer versions for that matter. I tried out QEMU but was unable to get it working properly. I read through the guides but they are very general in thier descriptions so there is plenty of room for error. Are you using QEMU for 3D games such as Kingpin, Shogo, Red Faction on your system via QEMU through XP? If so, is it more than just simple software mode? I did not see anything about improved SVGA emulation or directX support.

Reply 4 of 10, by DosFreak

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There is no 3D support in almost all VM's.

Qemu & VirtualBox have unofficial patches for JUST OPENGL support but AFAIK they are only for Linux and again they are unofficial and not complete.

Vmware Workstation IIRC has some barely implemented DX8 support but it's nothing to get excited over.

I think Parallels for the Mac is probably the only VM with decent D3D support. I don't have any experience with it so I can't really tell you anything about it, it probably uses some version of Cedega.

There's also Moka 5 which supposedly offers DX9 support but I haven't had a chance to try that.

The closest your going to get to OpenGL support in a VM is to use MesaGL (software OGL) which is slow as hell.

If you want D3D support in a VM then you'll have to run Linux with Wine in a VM, which is a waste of time since the only games that run well in Wine are the ones one the Wine Compatibility List which isn't that many.....and you'll be playing the games using Software OGL using MESA anyway which is slow as ****.

or you can use TransGaming's Swiftshader (for Windows) which is a POS so your better off just running the game on your host computer.

All of the games you listed above played just fine on Windows 98,2000,XP,2003,Vista assuming you have a video card made in the past 9 years that supports what those games require.

Kingpin - OpenGL
Shogo - D3D 6?
Red Faction - D3D 8?/OGL (I think....)

Most Windows games run fine on Windows XP.

For the ones that don't:

DOS games - Use DosBox

If you have computer technology from 1998 then run your DOS games in NTVDM and don't use DosBox.

16bit Windows 3.1 Games
Some of these run too fast or have graphics errors in Windows XP, for these games run them in Windows 3.1 in DosBox. (Yes, I said DosBox not VPC)

Windows 95 Games that run too fast or have graphics/network issues on the host:
You can use slowdown programs on your host but I usually run these games in DosBox with Windows 95 (not a supported configuration) or in Qemu with Windows 95/98....you can also use Vmware but Vmware virtualizes the processor so you'll still have to use a slowdown program.

The ACT is almost never needed. I've tested 3000+ games in various versions of Windows and the ACT is probably only used about a dozen times on each OS.....and that's pushing it.

If your using Windows 2000/Windows XP then the ACT Database included with these OS's have thousands of fixes included for games which is why the ACT isn't needed that much.

Don't use Microsoft Virtual PC for DOS games. Hell don't even use it for Windows games (that's what Vmware is for) but if you want to ignore my advice and use VPC then remember one thing....DON'T USE IT FOR DOS GAMES. That's what DosBox is for. It's why we've been testing and developing the program for the past 6+ years while MS has been sitting around bastardizing the VPC tech for server usage.

Last edited by DosFreak on 2008-02-12, 23:21. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 5 of 10, by Lachdahnan

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I was throwing those D3D games out there as a general idea of what I was trying to run. I see now that I cannot use a VM the way I was hopeing. One of the games that has been very problematic that I can think of off the top of my head is Revenant by Eidos. I was hopeing that what I could just do was use the VM as an all around tool so I didnt have to individualy tweak each game or build a separate 98 machine. Thats alright though, I dont mind a little extra work if it allows me to play my games 😀 As for Revenant, I was able to get it working on the VM. But very poorly since it does require 3D acceleration. I also read on the Eidos forums (this was a while ago, but Im pretty sure) that it was impossible to play Revenant on an XP machine. Dont suppose you have tried this one by chance?

*EDIT*
PS. Where are my manners??? Sorry I am very tired today, not much sleep 😜 Anyway, thank you all for the responses. Help is always appreciated 😀

Reply 6 of 10, by DosFreak

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Not really. I have a very early demo. It's possible the full game is different but I think I remember the demo only using GDI/DirectDraw. Will have to go back and see.

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Reply 7 of 10, by DosFreak

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If you want to save some time at trying to get your games to work then I suggest clicking on the "PC Game Compatibility List" in my signature.

3,000 games tested on Windows 2000,XP,2003,Vista.....coming soon Windows 2008/Linux/DOS/Windows 98SE and finishing up Windows NT4 testing.

Also check out www.ntcompatible.com and www.vistagamedoctor.com but my list should be your first stop.

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Reply 8 of 10, by Lachdahnan

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A very nice list you have compiled there. Very helpful indeed. If there is a game that is not included on there (like Genderwars) but I have tested on my current setup. Do you prefer people to send thier results to you, or you prefer to do all the testing yourself?

Reply 9 of 10, by leileilol

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DosFreak wrote:

If you have computer technology from 1998 then run your DOS games in NTVDM and don't use DosBox.

Incorrect: Even a "Proper DOS machine" (SB16/AWE, Vesa3.0 card, Pentium II) with the correct hardware running XP won't have more luck playing DOS games in NTVDM than other computers running XP.

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Reply 10 of 10, by DosFreak

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The point was that if your processor is so old that games in DosBox won't run very well then your better off playing them in NTVDM than in DosBox (or in real DOS of course but in most people's cases that is not an option).

and by "a processor so old that games in DosBox won't run very well" I mean P3/K6-3 processors.

I still can't believe the posts we get from people using DosBox on P3's......

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