VOGONS


First post, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Since I used to have a Roland SCB-55 that happily coexisted with my sound card back in those days, I never thought this would be an issue when I bought my "new" SC-55mkII.

Anyway, here's my setup:
Windows 10 Pro x64
Laptop with USB ports
Roland SC-55mkII
Roland UM-ONE USB2MIDI interface
3-piece speaker system that accepts one set of input (currently from computer)

I have set up everything as I have seen on various tutorials prior to buying, but still I missed one very important thing, and that is how to playback both sound devices at the same time.
Now when I play DOS games, MIDI is playing silently (I can see bars running on the SC-55 display) until I plug the speaker jack into SC-55's earphone port, then MIDI plays but other sound effects are silenced out. I either get sound effects or MIDI, but not both.

Some people say you need to hook up to a mixer, but I am no musician, I'm pretty sure there's a simpler solution out there to solve this issue. Maybe a tweak in sound settings? Or a sound pass-thru device that can accept 2 line-ins and output them at the same time? I have seen one of those but that allows only one output at a time through a selector, but that is not what I have in mind. I need both playbacks simultaneously.

Any suggestions?

Reply 2 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
cyclone3d wrote on 2021-08-29, 04:36:

Plug the output from the SC-55 into the line-in on the sound card. The set the sound card mixer settings to play the line-in audio to the speakers.

Unfortunately I'm using a notebook and it doesn't have a line-in. Supposedly this jack on the notebook is both a line-in and line-out, but the line-in function only works with headphones with a mike.

I first thought that the MIDI port created by the UM-ONE cable, then broadcast by the CoolSoft MIDI mapper, would take care of the output problem, as the game port did on old sound cards. But it didn't. Games would read from this virtual port and would play MIDI music through it, but there is no actual sound output to the speakers.

Reply 4 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
keropi wrote on 2021-08-29, 06:08:

Do the opposite then, sc-55 has audio input RCA jacks next to the output ones, so connect your laptop audio there and let sc-55 do the mixing

That's a good idea.
I just plugged the laptop's output to the SC-55-RCA-in. Still no sound. I guess I have to do something about the output ports on the SC-55 as well, maybe get another RCA cable and connect SC-55-out to speaker-in. It just might work.
I'll have to find another RCA cable.

Reply 5 of 18, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++
isdeai wrote on 2021-08-29, 05:47:
cyclone3d wrote on 2021-08-29, 04:36:

Plug the output from the SC-55 into the line-in on the sound card. The set the sound card mixer settings to play the line-in audio to the speakers.

Unfortunately I'm using a notebook and it doesn't have a line-in. Supposedly this jack on the notebook is both a line-in and line-out, but the line-in function only works with headphones with a mike.

I first thought that the MIDI port created by the UM-ONE cable, then broadcast by the CoolSoft MIDI mapper, would take care of the output problem, as the game port did on old sound cards. But it didn't. Games would read from this virtual port and would play MIDI music through it, but there is no actual sound output to the speakers.

You should be able to get a headphone/mic splitter cable then and use that. I use the opposite on my desktop computer with my headset.

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 6 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
cyclone3d wrote on 2021-08-29, 19:41:

You should be able to get a headphone/mic splitter cable then and use that. I use the opposite on my desktop computer with my headset.

Hmm...I don't have that splitter cable either. Will have to get one and try that if the pass-thru-SC-55 trick fails (still waiting for my RCA cables).
I've never used a splitter before, not sure how that works. Let me guess...
If I plug the splitter cable into the computer's line-out, then the "mic" port on the splitter will act as line-in and "headphone" as line-out, so I should direct the output of the SC-55 into the "mic" port, and the "headphone" end into the speakers. Am I on the right track?

Reply 7 of 18, by cyclone3d

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Yep. That's about it. The splitter cable with be a 4-pole 3.5mm plug on the male end and 2x 3.5mm jacks on the female end.

Like this:
https://www.amazon.com/Kingtop-Adapter-Tablet … n/dp/B01I3A47I4

The attachment 51aoLEfu1JS._AC_SL1500_.jpg is no longer available

Yamaha modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG repository
YMF7x4 Guide
Aopen AW744L II SB-LINK

Reply 8 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

I tried the SC-55-pass-thru method today, that is, I directed all my computer's output through the SC-55 and into the speaker, as keropi suggested...
It worked. I can now hear MIDI and other sounds through the same speaker.
There is one problem, however. Now the main volume is mostly controlled by the volume knob on the SC-55, and my MIDI output is MUCH louder than the sound. With the SC-55's volume at a mere 30%, the music dwarfed out most of the other sounds when I'm playing a game. The volume on my speakers are maxed out, but still it's no match with the MIDI.
Back in the Win9x days I could control MIDI and sound volumes separately through the system mixer, but now I can't.
Now I'm going to have to buy a mic/headphone splitter, connect line-in and line-out independently and see if the volumes are more balanced that way.
Or is there a way I can adjust the MIDI volume without affecting the other sounds?

Reply 9 of 18, by Tiido

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

I guess you have maximized the master volume on the sound card ? (I'm not sure if you meant that by speakers volume, or the actual knob on the speakers)

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 10 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
Tiido wrote on 2021-08-31, 13:25:

I guess you have maximized the master volume on the sound card ? (I'm not sure if you meant that by speakers volume, or the actual knob on the speakers)

Yes, I have maxed out the volume on the sound card, so that I can keep up with the MIDI volume (but still it's no match).
The only way I can lower the MIDI volume is through the volume knob on the SC-55, but doing that will drag the sound card volume with it as well, because the sound card passes the signal through the SC-55 and into the speakers, so the SC-55 is in effect the master controller of the system sound volume.
I'm looking for a way to adjust the MIDI volume independently without affecting the other sounds. It would be great if there's a software that allows me to do that, like the old Win9x mixer.

Reply 11 of 18, by Tiido

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

SC55 should have a master volume control that can be changed by a sysex or some other way (using a special MIDI file you play as part of initialisation), but I don't know any further details...

T-04YBSC, a new YMF71x based sound card & Official VOGONS thread about it
Newly made 4MB 60ns 30pin SIMMs ~
mida sa loed ? nagunii aru ei saa 😜

Reply 12 of 18, by MAZter

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

Finally, buy Roland sound mixer:

go.jpg

Roland Go Mixer, portable USB powered device

+ adapters:
s-l140.jpg

Doom is what you want (c) MAZter

Reply 13 of 18, by JudgeMonroe

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
Tiido wrote on 2021-08-31, 16:12:

SC55 should have a master volume control that can be changed by a sysex or some other way (using a special MIDI file you play as part of initialisation), but I don't know any further details...

Sc55 has LEVEL buttons on the front panel. Press "ALL" and then adjust level with the buttons.

Reply 14 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
JudgeMonroe wrote on 2021-08-31, 20:58:

Sc55 has LEVEL buttons on the front panel. Press "ALL" and then adjust level with the buttons.

This definitely looks like the solution I need! I was just thinking there had to be a way to tune down the MIDI so that it can be on the same volume level as my sound card.
Got to try that one out tonight. Will post back the results. Thanks.

Reply 15 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
JudgeMonroe wrote on 2021-08-31, 20:58:

Sc55 has LEVEL buttons on the front panel. Press "ALL" and then adjust level with the buttons.

That does it! I lowered all the levels on the MIDI so they are as loud as the other sounds, now I can adjust volume from SC-55, the speakers, or the taskbar, and all will go together.
Thanks so much to everyone for all of your input. I learned a lot from this thread!
I might consider getting a mixer when I'm good enough at it.

Reply 16 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Well, for the sake of trying things out and testing different options, I tried the headphone/mic splitter approach.

With my current setup, which sends computer's audio-out into the SC-55 then to the speakers, it works perfectly, but since the SC-55 is the pass-thru device, it has to be turned on at all times for any kind of audio to be heard through the speakers.

So today I tried the above-said approach, using a mic/phone splitter to split them into independent devices so they don't have to depend on each other.

Sadly, this doesn't work. In the windows mixer settings I could see the mic's volume bar dancing as the MIDI plays, but nothing is heard. That means the MIDI does play into the mic jack, but the sounds aren't relayed to the speakers. Which kind of makes sense, because when you speak into your mic, you don't hear your own voice. Maybe if I start a voice chat with someone, he/she'll be hearing all my MIDI music instead...

I guess there are two more things left to try out if I want to separate my audio/MIDI independently. Either I try to direct my mic output to the speakers (the way you get echoes when you speak into the mic), or I get a USB sound module with line-in/line-out--hopefully that line-in behaves like in old sound cards.

Any ideas?

Reply 17 of 18, by Falcosoft

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
isdeai wrote on 2021-09-09, 13:21:
.... Sadly, this doesn't work. In the windows mixer settings I could see the mic's volume bar dancing as the MIDI plays, but not […]
Show full quote

....
Sadly, this doesn't work. In the windows mixer settings I could see the mic's volume bar dancing as the MIDI plays, but nothing is heard. That means the MIDI does play into the mic jack, but the sounds aren't relayed to the speakers. Which kind of makes sense, because when you speak into your mic, you don't hear your own voice. Maybe if I start a voice chat with someone, he/she'll be hearing all my MIDI music instead...

I guess there are two more things left to try out if I want to separate my audio/MIDI independently. Either I try to direct my mic output to the speakers (the way you get echoes when you speak into the mic), or I get a USB sound module with line-in/line-out--hopefully that line-in behaves like in old sound cards.

Any ideas?

Hi,
If you do not have a Levels tab on the property page of your playback device where you can un-mute the microphone you can still use the built-in Windows feature 'Listen to this device' on the property page of any recording devices (like microphones).
1.

The attachment speakersprop1.png is no longer available

2.

The attachment listento1.png is no longer available

Website, Facebook, Youtube
Falcosoft Soundfont Midi Player + Munt VSTi + BassMidi VSTi
VST Midi Driver Midi Mapper

Reply 18 of 18, by isdeai

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
Falcosoft wrote on 2021-09-09, 16:37:

If you do not have a Levels tab on the property page of your playback device where you can un-mute the microphone you can still use the built-in Windows feature 'Listen to this device' on the property page of any recording devices (like microphones).

Yep, that does it. Now the sound and MIDI are working independently, I don't have to leave the Roland on all the time. It just gets a bit complicated when I'm enjoying MIDI and someone gives me a voice or video call. Then I'd have to go mute the mic, reroute the cables, and call back.
I also tried a voice call while MIDI is connected to my mic-in, and just as I anticipated, it really did blast my MIDI music through to her speakers, as if she were playing the MIDIs herself, although I won't be able to talk to her until I switched back to mic input.
Not bad. Thanks a lot for the tip.