jwt27 wrote:

So it sounded like that when it was first released? That is pretty bad. At least it's good to hear it's not some soundcard incompatibility or my cpu being too fast, 🤣.

Yes, it has ALWAYS sounded like that. Even since the first release of Silverball, as well it's successor Silverball Plus 2.

I remember back in the day exchanging messages in the Epic MegaGames Forum on CompuServe with James Schmalz (I'm sure that you probably know who he is <grin>). He said they had been planning on releasing an update patch that would update SB and SBP2 to use the newer version of Jensen's MASI drivers, but unfortunately they cancelled releasing the update (for reasons unknown).

jwt27 wrote:

The reverse stereo is a bit annoying but not that much. You could just wear your headphones the other way around 🤣

Hehe, I don't have headphones, but rather four high-powered quadraphonic speakers attached to my SBLive 😀

jwt27 wrote:

In Epic Pinball the stereo seems to reverse randomly on my system, for some reason. I was thinking of making a switch on the soundcard just for that, hehe.

That's a weird one. I don't ever remember having the reversed sterero bug in EP on any of my various Sound Blaster Pro and 16 cards (as well as currently in DOSBox). That is, after the version 2.0 and 2.1 update patches for the game.

The previously mentioned original shareware version of EP, the one with the ORIGINAL "Android" pinball table, had the reversed stereo bug (on all of those sound cards, as well as currently in DOSBOx)... but, of course, at the time, it was using the exact same drivers as Silverball.

jwt27 wrote:

Ah! I'm a bit too young to remember that. Plus I don't live in the US, I don't think Compuserve was around here back then.

I don't want to get too sidetracked here talking about CompuServe <grin>, but I really miss my old CompuServe days.

A lot of gamers don't even realize this, but you know how Wolfenstein 3D defined the "shareware" concept? You know how DOOM defined the "first person shooter" genre of PC games? You know how DOOM and Duke Nukem 3D defined the "deathmatch" concept and mode of multiplayer gameplay?

Well, CompuServe itself played a HUGE roll in defining the entire PC game industry in it's whole! The "hay-day" of PC gaming was around the time when CompuServe was at it's strongest, and "everyone who was anyone" was on CompuServe, and had a specific seperate CompuServe Forum for their company and product support.

Those forums had a seperate "file libraries" section, chat rooms, as well as integral messages boards. They were usually run by the game developers themselves, who you could easily contact and communicate with even on a daily basis 😀

I myself served as an Associate Sysop in several of CompuServe's forums (CIS:GAMERS, CIS:ARCADE, CIS:ACTION, CIS:FLIGHTSIM, and CIS:SIMPILOT) from around 1994-2007 or so (and had been a regular CompuServe member from around 1989-1994)... Man, those were the days 😀 I feel really privileged that I got to witness the evolution of the PC gaming industry firsthand 😀

P.S. Oh, and of course, "Eternal DOOM" (I, II, and II) was born and developed in the CompuServe Action Games Forum, by CompuServe members (who later went on to do bigger and better things in the PC gaming industry, myself excluded 🤣!) 😀

And another slight sidetrack... my "72672,1450" CIS ID? Hehe, I've had that thing memorized for decades; and in years past, even accidently ENDORSED CHECKS with that number :WHOOPS: LMAO!

(EDIT: gawd I'm rambling here 🤣!) THAT is why I LOVE the VOGONS forums so much... it brings back the memories of the old PC games, the old PC game industry, and my good times during my CompuServe years 😀

rfnagel wrote:

Hehe, I don't have headphones, but rather four high-powered quadraphonic speakers attached to my SBLive 😀

That is pretty cool, though quite unusual. I know one other person with a quad setup, a friend of mine who has a '74 JVC quadraphonic set, complete with quad amp, turntable, demodulator, etc... but try finding any quad records 🤣
I myself use six '70s speakers wired in stereo, because well... just about everything is in stereo. And you only have two ears anyway 😀

rfnagel wrote:

That's a weird one. I don't ever remember having the reversed sterero bug in EP on any of my various Sound Blaster Pro and 16 cards (as well as currently in DOSBox). That is, after the version 2.0 and 2.1 update patches for the game.

The previously mentioned original shareware version of EP, the one with the ORIGINAL "Android" pinball table, had the reversed stereo bug (on all of those sound cards, as well as currently in DOSBOx)... but, of course, at the time, it was using the exact same drivers as Silverball.

I think it's just because my sound card is not 100% compatible with the SBPro2 interface. But it's a minor issue to me anyway. It's not like I'm playing some shooter where good 3D positional audio actually improves your gameplay. Though playing without any sound is near impossible, it's much harder to stay focused on the game. And crackling sound doesn't really help either.

rfnagel wrote:

I don't want to get too sidetracked here talking about CompuServe <grin>, but I really miss my old CompuServe days. […]
Show full quote

I don't want to get too sidetracked here talking about CompuServe <grin>, but I really miss my old CompuServe days.

A lot of gamers don't even realize this, but you know how Wolfenstein 3D defined the "shareware" concept? You know how DOOM defined the "first person shooter" genre of PC games? You know how DOOM and Duke Nukem 3D defined the "deathmatch" concept and mode of multiplayer gameplay?

Well, CompuServe itself played a HUGE roll in defining the entire PC game industry in it's whole! The "hay-day" of PC gaming was around the time when CompuServe was at it's strongest, and "everyone who was anyone" was on CompuServe, and had a specific seperate CompuServe Forum for their company and product support.

Those forums had a seperate "file libraries" section, chat rooms, as well as integral messages boards. They were usually run by the game developers themselves, who you could easily contact and communicate with even on a daily basis 😀

I myself served as an Associate Sysop in several of CompuServe's forums (CIS:GAMERS, CIS:ARCADE, CIS:ACTION, CIS:FLIGHTSIM, and CIS:SIMPILOT) from around 1994-2007 or so (and had been a regular CompuServe member from around 1989-1994)... Man, those were the days 😀 I feel really privileged that I got to witness the evolution of the PC gaming industry firsthand 😀

P.S. Oh, and of course, "Eternal DOOM" (I, II, and II) was born and developed in the CompuServe Action Games Forum, by CompuServe members (who later went on to do bigger and better things in the PC gaming industry, myself excluded 🤣!) 😀

And another slight sidetrack... my "72672,1450" CIS ID? Hehe, I've had that thing memorized for decades; and in years past, even accidently ENDORSED CHECKS with that number :WHOOPS: LMAO!

(EDIT: gawd I'm rambling here 🤣!) THAT is why I LOVE the VOGONS forums so much... it brings back the memories of the old PC games, the old PC game industry, and my good times during my CompuServe years 😀

We only got a 486 here in 1996 or so, so I was a bit late to the party. And I was only 6 back then 🤣. But at least I remember all these games and still use DOS on a regular basis, I don't think many people of my age can say the same.

jwt27 wrote:

That is pretty cool, though quite unusual. I know one other person with a quad setup, a friend of mine who has a '74 JVC quadraphonic set, complete with quad amp, turntable, demodulator, etc... but try finding any quad records 🤣 I myself use six '70s speakers wired in stereo, because well... just about everything is in stereo. And you only have two ears anyway 😀

Hehe, there's no way could I play Day of Defeat, Counter-Strike, Counter-Strike: Condition Zero, or Counter-Strike: Condition Zero Deleted Scenes without my 4-channel setup 😀 Not to mention, ZDOOM, as well as SimCity 3000 Unlimited sounds really nice with 3D positional sound too 😀

Speaking of DoD/CS/CS:CZ/CS:CZDS do you play any of these Valve games? Are you on Steam? If yes to either, friend me here -> http://steamcommunity.com/id/RichNagel 😀

jwt27 wrote:

I think it's just because my sound card is not 100% compatible with the SBPro2 interface.

Ahhh... I see now. I thought you had a true SBPro. Is it a clone of some kind?

jwt27 wrote:

And crackling sound doesn't really help either.

Yeah, that static really drives me crazy. Wish I could hack/hex-edit a fix for it. One thing that makes that difficult is the simple fact of this:

Even though Silverball/Plus 2 has those seperate "GUS.INF" and "SB.INF" MASI sound driver files, the game does NOT load them externally. They are also EMBEDED within the "SILVER.EXE" file, and THAT is where the game loads them from.

I really don't know why Epic MegaGames shipped the game with those extra files... I'm assuming accidently, as especially back then, software companies were EXTREMELY concerned about "file bloat" (including totally unneeded files that only made the installation even bigger).

jwt27 wrote:

We only got a 486 here in 1996 or so, so I was a bit late to the party. And I was only 6 back then 🤣. But at least I remember all these games and still use DOS on a regular basis, I don't think many people of my age can say the same.

Most excellent... a 23 year old who understands DOS, and still uses it! 😀 KUDOS! 😀

BTW, I almost forgot...

I know that you said that DOSBox didn't work too well for you, but just a heads-up:

When Silverball is running under DOSBox, if you configure the sound driver for a GUS, it sounds *MUCH* better... with considerably *LESS* static 😀 FYI, Silverball's GUS sound driver is only mono, so you won't hear the swapped stereo problem either.

The only drawback is, the GUS driver sounds to me like that it has some sort of lowpass filter... it isn't as "crisp" sounding as the SB/SBPro sound drivers, hence you lose a lot of the "highs" (which probably explains why you don't hear as much static).

Anyhow, I figured that you might want to know 😀

rfnagel wrote:

Hehe, there's no way could I play Day of Defeat, Counter-Strike, Counter-Strike: Condition Zero, or Counter-Strike: Condition Zero Deleted Scenes without my 4-channel setup 😀 Not to mention, ZDOOM, as well as SimCity 3000 Unlimited sounds really nice with 3D positional sound too 😀

I did use a surround (6-channel) setup for a while, but figured I could use the space better so turned it into stereo. The speakers are now aligned in different angles to each other which makes the sound very "wide", and in games I can actually hear sounds coming from behind.
Took some pictures of my computer room a few days ago, you can see what I mean here:
http://imageshack.us/a/img7/7417/img4055x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img829/6569/img4058x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img850/489/img4056x.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img13/9151/img4057xp.jpg
I shot these in the middle of the night so they're a bit dark. Sorry about that. But at least you can get an idea of the setup.

But for the best 3D audio, nothing beats a good pair of headphones IMO, especially when used with an HRTF algorithm like Creative's CMSS-3D. That happens to be about the only feature I actually like about my current sound card 🤣

rfnagel wrote:

Speaking of DoD/CS/CS:CZ/CS:CZDS do you play any of these Valve games? Are you on Steam? If yes to either, friend me here -> http://steamcommunity.com/id/RichNagel 😀

Nope, sorry. I don't have Steam, and I don't really like it either. But then I must say I have never even tried it. I did play the first Counterstrike for a while, but the last time was at least 5 years ago.

rfnagel wrote:

Ahhh... I see now. I thought you had a true SBPro. Is it a clone of some kind?

It's a Yamaha YMF719 card (OPL3-SAx), which is as far as I know, the most compatible and best sounding clone card around. But it might just be not very compatible with certain games, you never know.

rfnagel wrote:

Yeah, that static really drives me crazy. Wish I could hack/hex-edit a fix for it. One thing that makes that difficult is the simple fact of this:

Even though Silverball/Plus 2 has those seperate "GUS.INF" and "SB.INF" MASI sound driver files, the game does NOT load them externally. They are also EMBEDED within the "SILVER.EXE" file, and THAT is where the game loads them from.

I really don't know why Epic MegaGames shipped the game with those extra files... I'm assuming accidently, as especially back then, software companies were EXTREMELY concerned about "file bloat" (including totally unneeded files that only made the installation even bigger).

If they're embedded in the exe, would it not be possible to hex-edit the Epic Pinball versions of these files in there? Or did you try that already?

rfnagel wrote:

Most excellent... a 23 year old who understands DOS, and still uses it! 😀 KUDOS! 😀

Thank you 😀 I just happen to like collecting and using old stuff for some reason. But that should have been obvious from the pictures above 😀

jwt27 wrote:

I did use a surround (6-channel) setup for a while, but figured I could use the space better so turned it into stereo. The speakers are now aligned in different angles to each other which makes the sound very "wide", and in games I can actually hear sounds coming from behind.

Didn't you previously say though that you're sound card was only 2 channels (stereo), and you had simply chained 3 speakers together for each channel? If so, then it would STILL only be stereo (in which case you wouldn't hear true 4-channel positional sound), no?

jwt27 wrote:

Took some pictures of my computer room a few days ago, you can see what I mean here:

Looking good! 😀

jwt27 wrote:

But for the best 3D audio, nothing beats a good pair of headphones IMO, especially when used with an HRTF algorithm like Creative's CMSS-3D. That happens to be about the only feature I actually like about my current sound card 🤣

As long as the headphones are TRUE 4-channel headphones. If they are only stero headphones, then the Creative CMSS-3D will only be simulating 3d surround-sound. My SBLive also has this feature, and when I enable it and play games (or music) that are only two channels, the surround-sound effects sound quite weird to me <grin>.

jwt27 wrote:

Nope, sorry. I don't have Steam, and I don't really like it either. But then I must say I have never even tried it. I did play the first Counterstrike for a while, but the last time was at least 5 years ago.

First of all, let it be said:

I FREAKIN' *HATE* STEAM! Bloated, glitchy, resource hog, bug infested, PO$hit, does whatever the hell it wants to (unless you do some creative hacking), intrusive DRM (or what I call "copy protection), PITA, and TOTAL GARBAGE... did I leave anything out 🤣!?

That being said, unfortunately the only way that you can play CS/CS:CZ/DoD is on Steam... and I LOVE those games 😀

jwt27 wrote:

If they're embedded in the exe, would it not be possible to hex-edit the Epic Pinball versions of these files in there? Or did you try that already?

The newer MASI sound drivers for EP version 2.0 and 2.1 are completely incompatible with the older MASI sound drivers that came with SB (and the original EP shareware "Android" pinball table). So, unfortunately that's not do-able.

THAT is why you can't simply copy over the needed files (renaming where needed) from SB to your EP installation directory (the various "PIN#.EXE", "PIN#.DAT", "SF#.PIN", etc...). EP crashes hard as a rock when trying this.

BTW, FYI, BOTH Silverball and Epic Pinball supports a total of 20 pinball tables. For SB, "PIN1.EXE" through "PIN20.EXE", and for EP "EP1.EXE" through "EP20.EXE".

rfnagel wrote:

Didn't you previously say though that you're sound card was only 2 channels (stereo), and you had simply chained 3 speakers together for each channel? If so, then it would STILL only be stereo (in which case you wouldn't hear true 4-channel positional sound), no?

That's right, it's all stereo. But that doesn't mean I can't hear 3D audio. As I said... You only have two ears anyway 😀

rfnagel wrote:

As long as the headphones are TRUE 4-channel headphones. If they are only stero headphones, then the Creative CMSS-3D will only be simulating 3d surround-sound. My SBLive also has this feature, and when I enable it and play games (or music) that are only two channels, the surround-sound effects sound quite weird to me <grin>.

CMSS-3D does not really improve anything when upsampling two-channel to surround, that's right. It sounds like a mess, after all the algorithm has no way of knowing what to play on which speakers. That can be calculated from the phase differences, in theory, but in practice it just turns everything into a mess.
The other way around, however, "downsampling" multi-channel to two-channel (IIRC for headphones this is not called stereo, but binaural) is a lot easier and I think it actually sounds very good. I'll have to bring up my "only two ears" argument again here 🤣

rfnagel wrote:

First of all, let it be said:

I FREAKIN' *HATE* STEAM! Bloated, glitchy, resource hog, bug infested, PO$hit, does whatever the hell it wants to (unless you do some creative hacking), intrusive DRM (or what I call "copy protection), PITA, and TOTAL GARBAGE... did I leave anything out 🤣!?

That was more or less my impression of it, thanks for re-confirming that for me 🤣

rfnagel wrote:

The newer MASI sound drivers for EP version 2.0 and 2.1 are completely incompatible with the older MASI sound drivers that came with SB (and the original EP shareware "Android" pinball table). So, unfortunately that's not do-able.

THAT is why you can't simply copy over the needed files (renaming where needed) from SB to your EP installation directory (the various "PIN#.EXE", "PIN#.DAT", "SF#.PIN", etc...). EP crashes hard as a rock when trying this.

BTW, FYI, BOTH Silverball and Epic Pinball supports a total of 20 pinball tables. For SB, "PIN1.EXE" through "PIN20.EXE", and for EP "EP1.EXE" through "EP20.EXE".

That sucks. Guess we'll just have to live with the static then 🙁

Unless... I can get hold of a GUS. But that's probably not gonna happen anytime soon.

CMSS-3D needs surround information (e.g. 5.1) and then processes it for Stereo headphones.

In short you set the Windows speaker settings to 5.1 and your X-Fi to headphones with CMSS-3D. This works for all games that have 5.1 support.

jwt27 wrote:

That's right, it's all stereo. But that doesn't mean I can't hear 3D audio. As I said... You only have two ears anyway 😀

I think maybe we're getting a bit confused here (not "on the same page").

In the games that support 4-channel audio; with my 4-channel quadraphonic setup, I can hear people walk up (or shoot) behind, to my left-rear/right-rear/front-left/front-right/etc... Sounds are panned to the perspective speaker, so you can hear different independant things (sounds) going on all around you, all independently throughout the four speakers.

In other words:

Enemy 1 is shooting towards me, and is standing to my rear-left off in the distance. Friend 1 is standing to my front-right, shooting towards enemy 1. A vehicle is driving up towards my front-left, and a plane is flying away from my rear-right, etc...

I can hear those sounds *panned independently* in the correct direction, within my four speakers 😀

jwt27 wrote:

The other way around, however, "downsampling" multi-channel to two-channel (IIRC for headphones this is not called stereo, but binaural) is a lot easier and I think it actually sounds very good. I'll have to bring up my "only two ears" argument again here 🤣

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

CMSS-3D needs surround information (e.g. 5.1) and then processes it for Stereo headphones. In short you set the Windows speaker settings to 5.1 and your X-Fi to headphones with CMSS-3D. This works for all games that have 5.1 support.

I'm a bit confused... it still wouldn't sound like *true* 4-channel positional sound (due to the headphones having only 2 speaker elements), would it (how could 2 speaker elements recreate in any fashion what I described above)?

rfnagel wrote:

I'm a bit confused... it still wouldn't sound like *true* 4-channel positional sound (due to the headphones having only 2 speaker elements), would it (how could 2 speaker elements recreate in any fashion what I described above)?

That's what the signal processing does.

Here is an article that explains some aspects:

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/virtual- … round-sound.htm

All I can say is, it works and you definitely should try it out. Get a X-Fi, Windows XP, Splinter Cell Chaos Theory and decent headphones.

Just so y'all can hear the differences of the Sound Blaster Pro MASI sound drivers for Silverball and Epic Pinball, attached are some MP3s of the two.

Also, an MP3 of Silverball configured for the Gravis Ultrasound driver.

rfnagel wrote:

I think maybe we're getting a bit confused here (not "on the same page"). […]
Show full quote

I think maybe we're getting a bit confused here (not "on the same page").

In the games that support 4-channel audio; with my 4-channel quadraphonic setup, I can hear people walk up (or shoot) behind, to my left-rear/right-rear/front-left/front-right/etc... Sounds are panned to the perspective speaker, so you can hear different independant things (sounds) going on all around you, all independently throughout the four speakers.

In other words:

Enemy 1 is shooting towards me, and is standing to my rear-left off in the distance. Friend 1 is standing to my front-right, shooting towards enemy 1. A vehicle is driving up towards my front-left, and a plane is flying away from my rear-right, etc...

I can hear those sounds *panned independently* in the correct direction, within my four speakers 😀

That's right, if you use speakers it's much easier to achieve good surround sound with multiple speakers. But it CAN be done with just normal stereo speakers. Ideally you would need point source speakers to do that, I think. With headphones, all you need is HRTF.

rfnagel wrote:

I'm a bit confused... it still wouldn't sound like *true* 4-channel positional sound (due to the headphones having only 2 speaker elements), would it (how could 2 speaker elements recreate in any fashion what I described above)?

As Mau1wurf said, that's what HRTF is all about. It models the sound waves as they enter your ears from different directions, so if you play it on headphones you'll hear the full 3D sound.
Wikipedia has an article on that, not too comprehensive, but you can get an idea of what it does:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-related_transfer_function

rfnagel wrote:

Just so y'all can hear the differences of the Sound Blaster Pro MASI sound drivers for Silverball and Epic Pinball, attached are some MP3s of the two.

Also, an MP3 of Silverball configured for the Gravis Ultrasound driver.

Mine does sound worse actually. I'll record it in a few minutes so you can hear what I mean.
The GUS is indeed less distorted, but... I can't say it sounds very good either. Mono pretty much sucks, and the filtering is waay too heavy.

This is what I hear... The bad stuff starts at 0.12:
https://www.box.com/s/t3shb9aawum73o0obo69

See the attached screenshot, it appears that it's not skipping samples as I said, but rather adding short pops like on a badly scratched record. And it only starts doing this after playing for about a minute or so.

Also, from what I can tell by looking at the spectrum, it's playing at 32KHz sampling rate. Is that normal?

jwt27 wrote:

The GUS is indeed less distorted, but... I can't say it sounds very good either. Mono pretty much sucks, and the filtering is waay too heavy.

Yeah, the GUS driver is strictly mono, and it sounds like they have some sort of lowpass filter going on (as well as bass boost). That's why it doesn't sound as staticy (lack of highs) compared to the Sound Blaster drivers, yet considerably muddled.

jwt27 wrote:

This is what I hear... The bad stuff starts at 0.12: https://www.box.com/s/t3shb9aawum73o0obo69

See the attached screenshot, it appears that it's not skipping samples as I said, but rather adding short pops like on a badly scratched record. And it only starts doing this after playing for about a minute or so.

Ouch! Yeah, I don't hear those clicks and pops. I thought when we were talking avout static, you were simply refering to the scratchy lower quality audio of the older MASI drivers.

I'm not sure what could cause that, short of some incompatibility with the sound drivers and your sound card.

BTW, what version of Cool Edit Pro is that? I'm still using the ancient version 1.20 🤣!

jwt27 wrote:

Also, from what I can tell by looking at the spectrum, it's playing at 32KHz sampling rate. Is that normal?

No, not at all. According to Ripsaw8080, the older MASI sound drivers play back at a sampling rate of 16,000 hertz... although, it sounds more to me like 12,100 hertz (as it sounds the same to me as the newer MASI sound drivers that come with Epic Pinball, when you configure the sound driver for EP for "Medium Quality").

rfnagel wrote:

Ouch! Yeah, I don't hear those clicks and pops. I thought when we were talking avout static, you were simply refering to the scratchy lower quality audio of the older MASI drivers.

I'm not sure what could cause that, short of some incompatibility with the sound drivers and your sound card.

BTW, what version of Cool Edit Pro is that? I'm still using the ancient version 1.20 🤣!

I just tried it with CPU cache disabled and that seems to solve the problem! So it was just running too fast, that's what caused it.

And that is version 2.00 of CEP 😉

rfnagel wrote:

No, not at all. According to Ripsaw8080, the older MASI sound drivers play back at a sampling rate of 16,000 hertz... although, it sounds more to me like 12,100 hertz (as it sounds the same to me as the newer MASI sound drivers that come with Epic Pinball, when you configure the sound driver for EP for "Medium Quality").

If the sampling rate was 16kHz you would have seen a "mirror point" at 8kHz in the spectrum. Instead it's at 16kHz, so the sample rate has to be 32k. But I didn't know an SBPro could do that... the maximum was 22kHz in stereo right?

jwt27 wrote:

If the sampling rate was 16kHz you would have seen a "mirror point" at 8kHz in the spectrum. Instead it's at 16kHz, so the sample rate has to be 32k. But I didn't know an SBPro could do that... the maximum was 22kHz in stereo right?

THAT is why it couldn't be 32K, as the max for an SBPro is 22k.

Try this: Listen to SB for a while, and then compare to the newer EP with the various "playback quality" settings:

Ultra High Quality = 44,100
Very High Quality = 32,100
High Quality = 20,100
Medium Quality = 12,100

...or, if you're using my EP fix:

Ultra High Quality = 44,100
Very High Quality = 32,000
High Quality = 20,050
Medium Quality = 11,025

Found another bug...

http://imageshack.us/a/img534/4755/img4184xq.jpg

jwt27 wrote:

Found another bug...

http://imageshack.us/a/img534/4755/img4184xq.jpg

That wouldn't be a Melolontha (Latin name) ? (No I will not use the so-called "English" name for it). but it is also known as a May Bug and so forth.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cockchafer (no joke, that is the "common" English name for it).

Yeah it's a maybug.. If it's on schedule it should be gone by tomorrow 🤣

jwt27 wrote:

Yeah it's a maybug.. If it's on schedule it should be gone by tomorrow 🤣

Cool, at least I still got it. When it comes to my knowledge of insects .