Aztech Sound Galaxy BX (OPL2) and Pro 16 II (OPL3).

https://www.dosdays.co.uk/topics/Manufacturers/aztech.php

Yup, as Dominusprog has said. I used an Aztech Multimedia Pro 16 IIB-3D in my A2286, using XT-IDE to boot off the Aztech's IDE port. No hanging note bug and SoftMPU works fine on it. Just check, even though some cards aren't PNP, they still need some sort of init program to enable the IDE port, the Yamaha YMF 719 and Opti 82C929 chipsets come to mind. These won't work for your application.

There are some older ESS cards that aren't PnP such as the 1688. Not genuine OPL3 but so close that you're unlikely to notice.

Lots of SB16s will work as in your list above, most can be fixed now so there's no hanging note bug by replacing the DSP.

The Soundblaster DSP project

dominusprog wrote on 2024-03-15, 19:57:

Aztech Sound Galaxy BX (OPL2) and Pro 16 II (OPL3).

Cool, thanks. Also the Aztech cards 'Waverider Pro 32-3D', 'Multimedia Pro 16 ABI/ABO' and 'Multimedia Pro 16 IIB-3D' seem to fit the bill.

orcish75 wrote on 2024-03-15, 22:45:

Yup, as Dominusprog has said. I used an Aztech Multimedia Pro 16 IIB-3D in my A2286, using XT-IDE to boot off the Aztech's IDE p […]
Show full quote

Yup, as Dominusprog has said. I used an Aztech Multimedia Pro 16 IIB-3D in my A2286, using XT-IDE to boot off the Aztech's IDE port. No hanging note bug and SoftMPU works fine on it. Just check, even though some cards aren't PNP, they still need some sort of init program to enable the IDE port, the Yamaha YMF 719 and Opti 82C929 chipsets come to mind. These won't work for your application.

There are some older ESS cards that aren't PnP such as the 1688. Not genuine OPL3 but so close that you're unlikely to notice.

Lots of SB16s will work as in your list above, most can be fixed now so there's no hanging note bug by replacing the DSP.

The Soundblaster DSP project

Nice! Pretty cool that you can reprogram the DSP! I'm not very confident SMD soldering though..

The 1688 seems a good candidate as well. Or a 688 (seems to need a TSR for the MPU-401 though).

I'll see what I can find then. As you might have guessed, it's for a bridge board as well. (A2386sx, 486slc2/50)

Ideally it would have a real OPL3, decent SNR, no hanging note bug (at least type 1) and Intelligent mode for the MT32.

Intelligent mode isn't really a thing in sound cards (other than modern very PnP stuff by Keropi).

Bug-free UART MIDI is however very doable, basically everyone except Creative and Mediavision managed that.

I agree with Aztech 3rd gen cards mentioned above (far too many names to keep track, but ensure you have an AZT2316 controller and you should be good). 4th gen are PnP, 1st was noisy and no MPU-401, 2nd had DSP issues.

Apart from that ESS1688 might be an option, but it has ESFM, not a real OPL3. ESS688 does use a real external OPL3, but I've never been able to get MIDI running on one of those cards and TSRs are less than ideal, particularly not if you need to run SoftMPU as well.

Alternatives: OPTi 929-based cards. Non-PnP, real (or 1:1 clone) external OPL3, great SBPro2 compatibility and frequently available with IDE interface.

I bowled into the thread with a vague "I seent an aztech card what done that" and I see these guys are mentioning them so yeah, that.

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 01:56:

Apart from that ESS1688 might be an option, but it has ESFM, not a real OPL3. ESS688 does use a real external OPL3, but I've never been able to get MIDI running on one of those cards and TSRs are less than ideal, particularly not if you need to run SoftMPU as well.

Alternatives: OPTi 929-based cards. Non-PnP, real (or 1:1 clone) external OPL3, great SBPro2 compatibility and frequently available with IDE interface.

I've got an ES688 in an 80286 PC, and from what I can tell the IDE port does work without any utility.
So it might be useful for things like XTIDE Universal BIOS, DDOs or HDD utilities that require to be on the very top of autoexec.bat/config.sys. 😀

Jo22 wrote on 2024-03-16, 10:18:

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 01:56:

Apart from that ESS1688 might be an option, but it has ESFM, not a real OPL3. ESS688 does use a real external OPL3, but I've never been able to get MIDI running on one of those cards and TSRs are less than ideal, particularly not if you need to run SoftMPU as well.

Alternatives: OPTi 929-based cards. Non-PnP, real (or 1:1 clone) external OPL3, great SBPro2 compatibility and frequently available with IDE interface.

I've got an ES688 in an 80286 PC, and from what I can tell the IDE port does work without any utility.
So it might be useful for things like XTIDE Universal BIOS, DDOs or HDD utilities that require to be on the very top of autoexec.bat/config.sys. 😀

The IDE should be fine - although that's not so special as it's basically just an extension of the ISA bus - it's the MPU I'm worried about. It theoretically works with a TSR (ENMPU.EXE), but I've had a few of these cards and never managed to get working MPU-401 UART out of them. [url=Re: ES688 with wavetable add-on vs ENMPU initializer (DOS) - pure silence]And I'm not the only one[/]

Seems like SoftMPU may work better (and is needed for intelligent mode stuff anyway): Sound Leader Pro 16E (ESS688) QUESTION

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 15:52:

Jo22 wrote on 2024-03-16, 10:18:

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 01:56:

Apart from that ESS1688 might be an option, but it has ESFM, not a real OPL3. ESS688 does use a real external OPL3, but I've never been able to get MIDI running on one of those cards and TSRs are less than ideal, particularly not if you need to run SoftMPU as well.

Alternatives: OPTi 929-based cards. Non-PnP, real (or 1:1 clone) external OPL3, great SBPro2 compatibility and frequently available with IDE interface.

I've got an ES688 in an 80286 PC, and from what I can tell the IDE port does work without any utility.
So it might be useful for things like XTIDE Universal BIOS, DDOs or HDD utilities that require to be on the very top of autoexec.bat/config.sys. 😀

The IDE should be fine - although that's not so special as it's basically just an extension of the ISA bus - it's the MPU I'm worried about. It theoretically works with a TSR (ENMPU.EXE), but I've had a few of these cards and never managed to get working MPU-401 UART out of them. [url=Re: ES688 with wavetable add-on vs ENMPU initializer (DOS) - pure silence]And I'm not the only one[/]

Seems like SoftMPU may work better (and is needed for intelligent mode stuff anyway): Sound Leader Pro 16E (ESS688) QUESTION

I understand, I haven't really tried the MPU-401 part yet, though. 🙁 There's also a jumper setting for SB-MIDI/MPU-401, I remember.
Maybe the SB-MIDI mode doesn't need a TSR? If so, it would be great if the SoftMPU dev could add support for SB-MIDI eventually.

SB-MIDI originally does operate through the 8051 MCU (Sound Blaster "DSP"), so there are no SB sound effects available when MIDI is being processed.
On the bright side, though, SB-MIDI by design doesn't need a special serial FiFo like a real MPU-401 needs.
It's more of a software solution, all in all. And quite a few games can provide both SFX and music through the MT-32/CM-32L.

i'd also say a 3rd gen aztech card (some are non-pnp; some aren't). the ess es688 could also work with softmpu, but only with serial output. stay away from the emulated mpu-401 with a tsr.

opti 924/930 cards are another non-pnp option. i have a couple with admos qs700 wavetable. they are ok i guess.

the crystal cs4232 has external opl3 and is very quiet, but i've never run across a card that wasn't pnp.

Thanks, everyone for your help! Much appreciated!

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 01:56:

Intelligent mode isn't really a thing in sound cards (other than modern very PnP stuff by Keropi). Bug-free UART MIDI is however […]
Show full quote

Intelligent mode isn't really a thing in sound cards (other than modern very PnP stuff by Keropi).
Bug-free UART MIDI is however very doable, basically everyone except Creative and Mediavision managed that.

I agree with Aztech 3rd gen cards mentioned above (far too many names to keep track, but ensure you have an AZT2316 controller and you should be good). 4th gen are PnP, 1st was noisy and no MPU-401, 2nd had DSP issues.

Apart from that ESS1688 might be an option, but it has ESFM, not a real OPL3. ESS688 does use a real external OPL3, but I've never been able to get MIDI running on one of those cards and TSRs are less than ideal, particularly not if you need to run SoftMPU as well.
Also, Dos Days says later ESS cards needs a driver to activate the IDE. It doesn't say for 1688, but perhaps it is still required.

Alternatives: OPTi 929-based cards. Non-PnP, real (or 1:1 clone) external OPL3, great SBPro2 compatibility and frequently available with IDE interface.

Thanks. After checking out some ESS vs OPL3 comparisons on youtube, it sounds good enough for me. So 1688 is a good candidate.

According to Dos Days, Aztech 3rd gen cards have SB Pro compatibility but no Adlib / SB / SB 2.0 compatibility?
Having used mainly Creative cards for adlib/SB/SB Pro games, I was under the impression that if a card supported SB Pro, it would also support the older ones, but I guess not. Being able to have sound in Adlib / SB games would be nice, hmm..

dionb wrote on 2024-03-16, 15:52:

The IDE should be fine - although that's not so special as it's basically just an extension of the ISA bus - it's the MPU I'm worried about. It theoretically works with a TSR (ENMPU.EXE), but I've had a few of these cards and never managed to get working MPU-401 UART out of them. [url=Re: ES688 with wavetable add-on vs ENMPU initializer (DOS) - pure silence]And I'm not the only one[/]

Seems like SoftMPU may work better (and is needed for intelligent mode stuff anyway): Sound Leader Pro 16E (ESS688) QUESTION

He didn't seem very impressed with that card and SoftMPU either, it seems. ("Works with some older games ... but breaks many others")

stanwebber wrote on 2024-03-17, 01:49:

i'd also say a 3rd gen aztech card (some are non-pnp; some aren't). the ess es688 could also work with softmpu, but only with serial output. stay away from the emulated mpu-401 with a tsr.
opti 924/930 cards are another non-pnp option. i have a couple with admos qs700 wavetable. they are ok i guess.
the crystal cs4232 has external opl3 and is very quiet, but i've never run across a card that wasn't pnp.

So I think I'm arriving at ESS 1688, third gen Aztech, or perhaps Opti 924/930.

I'll have a look for some of those. Thanks a lot for your help!

fgh wrote on 2024-03-15, 23:25:

The 1688 seems a good candidate as well. Or a 688 (seems to need a TSR for the MPU-401 though).

I'll see what I can find then. As you might have guessed, it's for a bridge board as well. (A2386sx, 486slc2/50)

Yup the 688 needs a TSR, so I'd avoid it. The 1688 is the best ESS option for your use case.

Ah! Awesome!!! That must be the fastest bridgeboard for the Amiga by far! You're on the same road I was about 15 years ago, the limited ISA slots for the bridgeboard. My A2000 has the A2286, ATi Mach 32 VGA card, the Aztech Pro 16 IIB and a 3Com 3c509B NIC in it's 4 ISA slots. Booting off a hardfile was pitifully slow, so had to make a plan. First I had a Future Domain ISA SCSI card, that worked well, but then I had no soundcard. I searched everywhere for an ISA soundcard that had an IDE port that could be set to primary. They're like hen's teeth, but eventually found a Turtle Beach Tropez Plus that has that option. Used it for a while with an old 100MB HDD, but soon discovered that the Tropez Plus was waaaaay too good a card to be wasted on the A2286, it's "My Precious!" It's now installed in my primary retro rig, a Pentium 233. It was around that time I discovered XT-IDE, V2.x hadn't come out at that time, it was still V1.1.5. The docs mentioned it could boot off any IDE controller, primary or secondary so I burned a 27C64 EPROM with the 16bit version of XT-IDE, setup the 3C905B to read the boot PROM and plugged the HDD in the IDE port of my SB16 which was hard wired to secondary. Lo and behold, it booted off the secondary IDE.

After much stuffing around, I eventually ended up with the Aztech Pro16 IIB and a 4GB CF card attached to it's IDE port, booting DOS 6.22. It's quite fun having the Amiga version and PC version of the same game running on the A2000 simultaneously. 😀

fgh wrote on 2024-03-17, 19:29:

So I think I'm arriving at ESS 1688, third gen Aztech, or perhaps Opti 924/930.

I'll have a look for some of those. Thanks a lot for your help!

Just check the Opti 924/929/930 card before you buy it. Depending on how it was designed, the IDE port might not be separate from the Opti chip. Both my 929 cards need the Opti init program to run before the IDE port is enabled, so at boot time the XT-IDE won't find the IDE port.

fgh wrote on 2024-03-17, 19:29:

[...]

According to Dos Days, Aztech 3rd gen cards have SB Pro compatibility but no Adlib / SB / SB 2.0 compatibility?
Having used mainly Creative cards for adlib/SB/SB Pro games, I was under the impression that if a card supported SB Pro, it would also support the older ones, but I guess not. Being able to have sound in Adlib / SB games would be nice, hmm..

That sounds rather... confused.

These cards support AdLib, that's what the OPL3 is for and they have one, or one of the "LS-212" 1:1 clones. They also support the original Sound Blaster. The only things they don't support fully are SBPro 1.0 (with dual OPL2 - also not supported by SBPro2.0 or SB16) and SB16 (instead they support WSS for 16b sound).

[...]

So I think I'm arriving at ESS 1688, third gen Aztech, or perhaps Opti 924/930.

Don't forget the OPTi 929 either, it's halfway between the 924 and 930, with codec integrated, but OPL3 or clone still external.

dionb wrote on 2024-03-17, 21:43:

Don't forget the OPTi 929 either, it's halfway between the 924 and 930, with codec integrated, but OPL3 or clone still external.

OPL3 (or a 1:1 copy) is external on the 930 as well.

WSS is integrated and possibly also the YAC512.

Yeap! OPTi are interesting cards)

Babasha wrote on 2024-03-18, 07:11:

Yeap! OPTi are interesting cards)

i own the 82c924/930 versions of the 2nd card with a ymf262. i think the 82c925 is opti fm like the 82c931 which also has a version with the admos qs700 wavetable (some have wavetable header populated). i'm not sure if the 82c925/931 are non-pnp.

the 82c930/qs700 card is probably still for sale on ebay NOS for around $30. it does have a quirk where the fm/midi output is quite a bit louder than the sb/wss. also, there are no xp drivers for the card, but you can get the nt drivers working.

edit: i just noticed the first card has a ymf289b. nice! never even seen one of those come up for sale before.

I recomend aztech waverider pro 32-3d non pnp.

pitchshifter wrote on 2024-03-19, 19:48:

I recomend aztech waverider pro 32-3d non pnp.

what wavetable chip does that card have? is it a wavefront? i have a couple oem waverider platinum 3d pnp cards with the samsung wavetable. i've been after a waverider pro 32 for some time, but i assumed the only differences were pnp vs non-pnp and the 4th vs 3rd gen azt2316.

AZT3310, rebranded Samsung KS0164.

stanwebber wrote on 2024-03-20, 00:20:

pitchshifter wrote on 2024-03-19, 19:48:

I recomend aztech waverider pro 32-3d non pnp.

what wavetable chip does that card have? is it a wavefront? i have a couple oem waverider platinum 3d pnp cards with the samsung wavetable. i've been after a waverider pro 32 for some time, but i assumed the only differences were pnp vs non-pnp and the 4th vs 3rd gen azt2316.

stanwebber wrote on 2024-03-20, 00:20:

pitchshifter wrote on 2024-03-19, 19:48:

I recomend aztech waverider pro 32-3d non pnp.

what wavetable chip does that card have? is it a wavefront? i have a couple oem waverider platinum 3d pnp cards with the samsung wavetable. i've been after a waverider pro 32 for some time, but i assumed the only differences were pnp vs non-pnp and the 4th vs 3rd gen azt2316.

If you want the ICS Wavefront, look for the MMSN826, or an MMSN830 with the proprietary wavetable module.

Definitely sounds better than the Samsung chip, but still not exactly in SC-55 / Dreamblaster category. Advantage of the Samsung is that it doesn't require any software to function, it's just wired up to the MPU-401 output. The ICS Wavefront needs init software.