kjt418 wrote on 2025-02-12, 14:01:

DOS 6.22 hangs with the message
"Attempting to auto detect media..."

Do you have the network/cable connected?

I don't know specifically about the 5C905 and it's drivers, but I've
got a couple network cards where the packet driver hangs if the
network is not connected to an actual network so it can figure out
the type of connection!

Dave ::: https://dunfield.themindfactory.com ::: "Daves Old Computers"->Personal

@DaveDDS Thanks for the reply! Yes I do have a cable connected to an active ethernet drop. (I tested it out by plugging the same cable into my laptop and I'm able to get a valid IP address)

My first thought was maybe I need to have some DHCP configured in some CFG file?

Can you run 3C90XCFG.EXE and set media type to something other than "auto"?

Anyway, it's a well-known fact that packet drivers for 3Com NICs often turn out to be buggy.
It may be a good idea to try the ODI driver + ODIPKT.COM instead.

Did the NIC pass the diagnostics tests? (e.g. Etherdisk 3c90xcfg.exe tests described in the manual? A loopback connector/cable may be needed.)

https://docs.rs-online.com/e9e4/0900766b8002c838.pdf

https://archive.org/details/3cometherdiskxl

There could also be issues with using old busmastering chipsets on the motherboard according to some postings I saw?
(e.g. PIO fallback not available on the B and above models of the NIC). But it's unclear if that would affect initialization.

@Rwolf. Thanks for the reply, I think the diagnostic tests passed...I ran 3c90xcfg.exe and I got this...

@Grzyb I believe that solved my issue! Thank you

BTW: is it still possible to connect to modern Linux from DOS via SSH?
What's the recommended client?

@Grzby I'm using SSH2DOS from this repo

Then, on the Linux server I need to make the following changes to the /etc/ssh/sshd_config

1#add kex
2KexAlgorithms diffie-hellman-group-exchange-sha1,diffie-hellman-group14-sha1,diffie-hellman-group1-sha1
3
4#add new allowed algo
5HostKeyAlgorithms=ssh-rsa,ssh-rsa-cert-v01@openssh.com
6
7# add accepted algo
8PubkeyAcceptedAlgorithms=+ssh-rsa,ssh-rsa-cert-v01@openssh.com

The 3C90x packet driver bugs drive me round the bend sometimes. Was recently trying to get a 3X905CX-TX-M working in a DOS system. It worked. Once. Then after reboot without changing hardware or software it stopped, still loading the 3C90XPD.COM packet driver without issues but hanging as soon as you tired to use it. Same as here, just not from that version of the CD. Tried a few different versions, got frustrated. Gave up.

So beware, even if it works now, it might not tomorrow...

Reason I spent so long on it was that it was a low profile system and it was the only NIC (theoretically) supported in DOS I had with low profile bracket. Instead I got out my wirecutters and went to work on an SMC 8416. Not pretty, but it fits and equally importantly it runs reliably. Did hit a memory conflict first, but at least its packet driver was so kind as to tell me what the problem was so I could fix it

The PCI 90x series DOS drivers are like a minefield. Older ones will work with 900 but not 905. In fact even 900 and 900B are different enough to cause problems. Newer drivers on the other hand will work with 905 series, might even be required to detect 905C, but will hang or refuse to actually send anything on the wire with older cards like 900 series. If a particular packet driver works well I'd say stick with it and don't try any "updates". It might also help to set the card manually to a particular media (TP or BNC, or AUI) but I've also found the DOS driver might ignore that and try to auto-detect anyway, get it wrong and thus make the network unreachable.

Curiously I've never had any issues (so far anyway) with 3Com ISA cards. Or when using Win9x. Linux too but obviously it's no longer their code in there. Didn't really do much testing on Win3.x and PCI systems to get a good idea how that works.

kjt418 wrote on 2025-02-12, 17:49:

@Grzby I'm using SSH2DOS from this repo
Then, on the Linux server I need to make the following changes to the /etc/ssh/sshd_config
(...)

Ah, so it's possible, but requires non-standard configuration on the server side.

Well, we all know that modern encryption may be too hard for old computers...

Grzyb wrote on 2025-02-13, 02:08:

kjt418 wrote on 2025-02-12, 17:49:

@Grzby I'm using SSH2DOS from this repo
Then, on the Linux server I need to make the following changes to the /etc/ssh/sshd_config
(...)

Ah, so it's possible, but requires non-standard configuration on the server side.

Well, we all know that modern encryption may be too hard for old computers...

Not really. The Linux Foundation and pals removed default support for RSA encryption methods after the whole "RSA purposefully recommended a weakened set of parameters, so that they could penetrate it themselves" fiasco about 6 years ago.

Similar with discontinuation of default support for Diffie-Helman and pals, which are just technologically weak (and can be broken with modest effort, and are thus no longer considered secure)

the DOS SSH client is ... Old...

As such, it wants to use OLD cyphers. You just have to turn those cypher sets back on, because they have been turned off by default, because INSECURE. 😜

"nonstandard" is loaded. Those WERE standard cypher types. They are just OBSOLETE standard cypher sets.

OK, thanks for the explanation.

But aren't the current cypher sets more CPU-demanding than the obsolete ones?

I was convinced that there's certain minimum CPU power required to use modern cryptography - because below that minimum, the handshake takes so long, that it triggers a timeout somewhere.

dionb wrote on 2025-02-12, 19:16:

The 3C90x packet driver bugs drive me round the bend sometimes. Was recently trying to get a 3X905CX-TX-M working in a DOS system. It worked. Once. Then after reboot without changing hardware or software it stopped, still loading the 3C90XPD.COM packet driver without issues but hanging as soon as you tired to use it. Same as here, just not from that version of the CD. Tried a few different versions, got frustrated. Gave up.

So beware, even if it works now, it might not tomorrow...

Reason I spent so long on it was that it was a low profile system and it was the only NIC (theoretically) supported in DOS I had with low profile bracket. Instead I got out my wirecutters and went to work on an SMC 8416. Not pretty, but it fits and equally importantly it runs reliably. Did hit a memory conflict first, but at least its packet driver was so kind as to tell me what the problem was so I could fix it

Well, it's tomorrow and guess what...IT NOT WORKING :-p

What the actual heck is going on?!

@wierd_w the DOS SSH client I'm using is from 2021 - it was updated to support "newer" standards

1diffie-hellman-group1-sha1 -> diffie-hellman-group14-sha256
2aes128-cbc -> aes128-ctr
3hmac-sha1 -> hmac-sha2-256

do you have it in your config.sys to initiliase the pci card when your in dos mode? if you dont, it wont work properly.

in mine i have

1lh device=c:\3c905c\3c90xcfg.exe configure /configfile=c:\3c905c\3c905x.set

the .set file, you have to run 3c90xcfg and select your options and save them as configuration file.

then you can call 3c90xpd /i=60 in autoexec.bat

If all PD versions are so capricious, it may be a good idea to try something completely different: ODI driver + ODIPKT.COM, or NDIS driver + the appropriate shim.

OK, well, I added that to the config and still nothing... I'll post my files here to see if I've just done something stupid...

1:: AUTOEXEC.BAT DOS 6.22
2SET WATTCP.CFG=C:\APPS
3C:DOS\3C90XPD.COM /I=60

1::CONFIG.SYS DOS 6.22
2DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
3DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\UM386.EXE RAM I=B000-BF77
4DOS=HIGH,UMB
5LOADHIGH DEVICE=C:\3COM\3C90XCFG.EXE CONFIGURE /CONFIGFILE=C:\3COM\3C90X.SET

1# WATTCP.CFG
2hostname = "backup"
3my_ip = dhcp

Microsoft Network Client 3.0 for MS-DOS

I tried installing this, pointing the install to the drivers (C:\3COM\NDIS2\DOS and

• Setting Basic Directory
• Changed the Network Configuration to TCP/IP and removed IPX

However, on reboot the system got hung on "NetBind v2.1"

Grzyb wrote on 2025-02-13, 17:30:

If all PD versions are so capricious, it may be a good idea to try something completely different: ODI driver + ODIPKT.COM, or NDIS driver + the appropriate shim.

I just tried the NDIS2 drivers - but, the system got in a hung state executing "netbind.com" command