How much L2 cache do you have on your board?
When you have too much RAM you risk that parts of your RAM are outside of the cacheable area.
When you have 512 KB of onboard cache, you need to reduce RAM to 128 MB.
When you have 1 MB of onboard cache, you need to reduce RAM to 256 MB.
With 2 MB of onboard cache, you can go up to 512 MB RAM.

Disruptor wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:35:

How much L2 cache do you have on your board? When you have too much RAM you risk that parts of your RAM are outside of the cache […]
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How much L2 cache do you have on your board?
When you have too much RAM you risk that parts of your RAM are outside of the cacheable area.
When you have 512 KB of onboard cache, you need to reduce RAM to 128 MB.
When you have 1 MB of onboard cache, you need to reduce RAM to 256 MB.
With 2 MB of onboard cache, you can go up to 512 MB RAM.

I dont know right now.. i wanna put in a GeForce 2 mx400 Is It Better thanx ATI 7000?
The mobo Is: VIA Apollo MVP3

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

Now he mount an ATI 7000 64MB card... can i upgrade it? Or do I risk bottlenecking?

By the time Radeon 7000 hit the market, the CPU had already broken the GHz milestone, so yes, K6-2 was a bit old for Radeon 7000, and your Super Socket 7 motherboard could only support AGP 2x (1.0).

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

I dont know right now.. i wanna put in a GeForce 2 mx400 Is It Better thanx ATI 7000?

Theoretically yes, but not much. They were both announced in Q1 2001, aiming the budget market.

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

The mobo Is: VIA Apollo MVP3

That's the chipset, not the make and model of your motherboard. It's a nice SS7 chipset and highly sought after, though.

dormcat wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:13:

By the time Radeon 7000 hit the market, the CPU had already broken the GHz milestone, so yes, K6-2 was a bit old for Radeon 7000 […]
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Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

Now he mount an ATI 7000 64MB card... can i upgrade it? Or do I risk bottlenecking?

By the time Radeon 7000 hit the market, the CPU had already broken the GHz milestone, so yes, K6-2 was a bit old for Radeon 7000, and your Super Socket 7 motherboard could only support AGP 2x (1.0).

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

I dont know right now.. i wanna put in a GeForce 2 mx400 Is It Better thanx ATI 7000?

Theoretically yes, but not much. They were both announced in Q1 2001, aiming the budget market.

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 13:30:

The mobo Is: VIA Apollo MVP3

That's the chipset, not the make and model of your motherboard. It's a nice SS7 chipset and highly sought after, though.

Oooh. Ok... CPU bottleneck but i Remember i player some old games on It like nfs4 and StarCraft.. what Is the best card for k6-2?

On such a system 7000 will get about half the score of a 7500 in 3dm2000

7500, 9200,9250 and gf2/gf3 should be among the fastest cards for k6-2 systems on pci.

If agp, radeon 9800 pro/gf2/gf3 will probably be the best.

Honorable mention: voodoo 5500 won’t be as fast but still cool

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:37:

On such a system 7000 will get about half the score of a 7500 in 3dm2000 […]
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On such a system 7000 will get about half the score of a 7500 in 3dm2000

7500, 9200,9250 and gf2/gf3 should be among the fastest cards for k6-2 systems on pci.

If agp, radeon 9800 pro/gf2/gf3 will probably be the best.

Honorable mention: voodoo 5500 won’t be as fast but still cool

Thx so much.. Is worth upgrade to k6-3?

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:16:

Oooh. Ok... CPU bottleneck but i Remember i player some old games on It like nfs4 and StarCraft.. what Is the best card for k6-2?

NFS4 (High Stakes) didn't have high system requirements back in 1999:

Your system clearly outperformed its recommended configuration.

Being a 1998 RTS game with minimal -- if any -- 3D acceleration requirement, StarCraft could run on much older hardware (Pentium 90, 16 MB RAM, 80 MB HDD, any DirectX-compatible local bus SVGA video card).

The best card? Not every AGP 8x card is compatible with your MB (what's the make and model?); Sphere478 already mentioned that Radeon 9800 Pro might be your best choice and I agree, although installing an 8x card on a 2x slot might be a bit wasted.

dormcat wrote on 2023-08-07, 16:22:

NFS4 (High Stakes) didn't have high system requirements back in 1999: nfs4_ref.jpg Your system clearly outperformed its recommen […]
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Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:16:

Oooh. Ok... CPU bottleneck but i Remember i player some old games on It like nfs4 and StarCraft.. what Is the best card for k6-2?

NFS4 (High Stakes) didn't have high system requirements back in 1999:
nfs4_ref.jpg
Your system clearly outperformed its recommended configuration.

Being a 1998 RTS game with minimal -- if any -- 3D acceleration requirement, StarCraft could run on much older hardware (Pentium 90, 16 MB RAM, 80 MB HDD, any DirectX-compatible local bus SVGA video card).

The best card? Not every AGP 8x card is compatible with your MB (what's the make and model?); Sphere478 already mentioned that Radeon 9800 Pro might be your best choice and I agree, although installing an 8x card on a 2x slot might be a bit wasted.

Understood.. thx so much to everyone.. can i play games like Unreal tournament 1999 on the config?

Yes, the Radeon 7000 handles UT99 with ease.

Davvo25 wrote on 2023-08-07, 16:49:

Understood.. thx so much to everyone.. can i play games like Unreal tournament 1999 on the config?

This might sound a bit harsh, but you really should search before ask: https://gamesystemrequirements.com/game/unreal-tournament

Graphic card advice for my K6-III retro build (Epox Super Socket 7 Mobo MVP3G-M)
Graphic card advice for my K6-III retro build (Epox Super Socket 7 Mobo MVP3G-M)

fastest solution for 1999 gaming is always getting rid of AMD and going slot1

The Radeon 7000/VE does not have hardware T&L.
This means that the driver will use the CPU for that, relying on the floating point unit.
I think that even one of the fastest K6-2 will slow down the performances in that case.

I'd rather suggest a 7200 / 7500 / 8500 / 9xxx with a T&L unit to offload the k6-2

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:37:

If agp, radeon 9800 pro/gf2/gf3 will probably be the best.

Why not GeForce FX 5950 Ultra?
This is only 5-10% slower than the 9800XT.

PS. To offer a top-end card from 2003 for a 500 MHz processor, this is a bit too much, I think 😀

shevalier wrote on 2023-08-07, 19:27:

Why not GeForce FX 5950 Ultra? This is only 5-10% slower than the 9800XT. […]
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Sphere478 wrote on 2023-08-07, 14:37:

If agp, radeon 9800 pro/gf2/gf3 will probably be the best.

Why not GeForce FX 5950 Ultra?
This is only 5-10% slower than the 9800XT.

PS. To offer a top-end card from 2003 for a 500 MHz processor, this is a bit too much, I think 😀

I’ve noticed geforce 5 series compatibility being a little spotty on 586, some have gotten them to work though.

They aren’t as fast as gf2/3 with 7.76 driver

See the k6-3+ aiming for the stars thread.

I have run a 9800 pro on a k6 setup, even on a cyrix mII the performance was quite good considering the processor.

https://youtu.be/jx-KE-xlNS0

Behold radeon 9800 pro on cyrix mII

acl wrote on 2023-08-07, 18:34:

The Radeon 7000/VE does not have hardware T&L. This means that the driver will use the CPU for that, relying on the floating poi […]
Show full quote

The Radeon 7000/VE does not have hardware T&L.
This means that the driver will use the CPU for that, relying on the floating point unit.
I think that even one of the fastest K6-2 will slow down the performances in that case.

I'd rather suggest a 7200 / 7500 / 8500 / 9xxx with a T&L unit to offload the k6-2

How can i mount a T&L driver on PC?

The Radeon 7000 is pretty slow. I've never tested one in a K6, but I think ATI in general has slower drivers for the K6 CPUs. I could be wrong though, since so many ATI cards are listed as good options.
Keep in mind the Radeon 9800 tends to be an expensive card and very frequently is found faulty with artifacting problems. The cost/effort it takes to find a good one probably isn't worthwhile if it's just going in a K6.

If you're doing AGP, then the Geforce2 MX/MX400 is a common and cheap card, and they're very reliable. At lower resolutions, I don't think you can get much more 3D speed from a K6 beyond what a Geforce2 MX would deliver. At higher resolutions, a more powerful card could still be better.
If you need PCI then please mention it because that limits your choices. Tell us your motherboard if you can.

Many motherboards of this period have issues with supplying power to the AGP slot, and might be damaged if the card is too demanding. Unless you know the construction of your motherboard, this is a concern. If you are using an AT power supply then this is almost guaranteed to be an issue. If you are using ATX, it still might be an issue (depends on the motherboard).

The Geforce2 MX avoids that danger because it doesn't draw much power.

Geforce2 has older drivers that are optimized better for this CPU. The MX400 should be able to use the same, older drivers but you have to edit the .inf to trick it into recognizing an MX400.
A Geforce2 MX and MX400 are practically the same. Avoid the MX200 though, it is crippled.

Thx so much.. Is worth upgrade to k6-3?

They're definitely faster than a standard K6-2.
However, the K6-2+ and K6-3+ (with the "+" sign) are much better chips than the original K6-III. They clock higher, they can change speed in software without rebooting, and because they draw less power they run cooler and are less stressful on the motherboard. This can even make them more stable, where a more power hungry original K6-III might be a bit glitchy.
But whether you can run these depends on your motherboard.

Geforce2 MX400 64MB or Geforce3 TI200 64MB would be my choice from Nvidia, but use only old drivers, like 7.76 or even earlier.

K6-2+/III/III+ would fit even better, but k6-2 500Mhz 3dnow also helps it out. T&L comes with graphics drivers, Nvidia gf2/3 has it.

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-08-07, 20:33:

I’ve noticed geforce 5 series compatibility being a little spotty on 586, some have gotten them to work though.

The Radeon 9800 has a consumption of 50-60W and half of it comes from the 3.3V bus.
Because of this, you can get problems even on the first generations of motherboards on the S370, not like Socket 7.

shevalier wrote on 2023-08-08, 02:38:

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-08-07, 20:33:

I’ve noticed geforce 5 series compatibility being a little spotty on 586, some have gotten them to work though.

The Radeon 9800 has a consumption of 50-60W and half of it comes from the 3.3V bus.
Because of this, you can get problems even on the first generations of motherboards on the S370, not like Socket 7.

Yes, it is a hungry card. I have gotten it to work before on ss7 though. Not all motherboards will run it. But many other cards have compatibility issues also.

I have a project for adding less 3.3v resistance to the traces for 3.3v on systems like these btw. But it is kinda on hold until someone feels the need to prove that the problem can be solved that way and it isn’t just a early agp quirk. Personally I have boards that will run it and no immediate need to use others.

Re: AGP Power Improver