Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-05, 17:58:

I may catch some flak for posting these because they're probably considered too new to be "retro" by many, but they represent significant milestones in my PC journey throughout early adulthood.

If 5 years ago a system from 2001 was retro (and checking old posts few doubted it was), one from 2005-2006 is more than retro now.

In purely technical terms something with ATX12V and PCIe can run with modern PSU and peripherals, which makes it less of a challenge than 5V heavy stuff or older AT form factor, but bottom line is this is stuff you're not using to run contemporary software and using for practical purposes, but something you're doing for fun with older parts & software. That's retro.

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-05-06, 20:37:

[...]

Pics like that make me twitch.. due to all looking like parts I've got somewhere, and wondering if somebody broke in last night 🤣 ... Kidding of course, wouldn't accuse fellow Vogons of such a thing, y'all are smart enough to go for the high ticket stuff right? 🤣

Hell no, that high ticket stuff is overpriced and IMHO pointless with old stuff. The only reason to shell out for high-end gear is because nothing faster exists. With vintage stuff, except in corner cases (*the* fastest card using a certain technology) there's always mid-range stuff from one year later or low end-stuff from two years later. And these TVGA are useful workhorses, particularly as I just installed an 8800CS (relabeled as 'Zymos') in my surprise XT.

Still, tbh none of the bits in that pic were reason to go for this particular computer.

tauro wrote on 2023-05-07, 08:20:

What could a Win7 computer run that Win10/11 doesn't run?

A lot of games that had a CD-check or many other forms of DRM.

For example, the only version of Red Alert 2 that I can run on my Windows 10 machine is the one from origin, as W10 refuses to run the CD installer. Even after that, I needed a community made patch to run it an acceptable framerate.

On Windows 7 meanwhile it's just a straight install and a single line edit on an .ini file to avoid slowdowns during explosions.

Bought two AGP cards and two sticks of 512 Mb SDR Ram. All untested.

Munx wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

On Windows 7 meanwhile it's just a straight install and a single line edit on an .ini file to avoid slowdowns during explosions.

and juggling CDs to play games? Il take copying 2 files (exe and directdraw overlay) over using CD any day.

Turbo -> wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

Bought two AGP cards and two sticks of 512 Mb SDR Ram. All untested.

That ASUS 9600XT looks cool, hope it works for you, last real AGP flagship GPU ???

rasz_pl wrote on 2023-05-07, 12:48:

Munx wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

On Windows 7 meanwhile it's just a straight install and a single line edit on an .ini file to avoid slowdowns during explosions.

and juggling CDs to play games? Il take copying 2 files (exe and directdraw overlay) over using CD any day.

I'll take using a no-cd patch with the CD version over having to start up origin each time any day.

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-05-07, 13:24:

That ASUS 9600XT looks cool, hope it works for you, last real AGP flagship GPU ???

Maybe it is 9800XT 😉

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-05, 17:58:

First, an ASUS P5N32-E SLI socket T (775) motherboard, which is the same board I had when I built my first Core2Duo PC with an Intel E6600. I still have that same E6600 CPU but I might stick the QX6700 CPU I currently have in another PC in this one, not sure yet. Also not pictured are two brand new Nvidia 7950 GTs which I will run SLI. This will be a mostly period correct 2006-2007 system running XP.

Well I'm 0 for 1 so far on the new acquisitions, the P5N32-E SLI will not POST at all using known good components from another system, so I'll have to return it. That's a huge bummer. Hopefully the other two boards work.

Maybe it's just me but it seems like there's a lot more crap being sold on ebay these days. I've had to send more stuff back just in the previous year than the entire 23 years I've been buying on eBay prior. You would think sellers wouldn't be so quick to sell used stuff without testing it before shipping it as they have to eat the return shipping. Or if you absolutely can't test it, just sell it for parts.

DundyTheCroc wrote on 2023-05-07, 15:29:

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-05-07, 13:24:

That ASUS 9600XT looks cool, hope it works for you, last real AGP flagship GPU ???

Maybe it is 9800XT 😉

Asus A9800XT/TVD indeed. With 130 nm lithography and lower TDP, 9600 does not require any external power; OTOH 9500/9700 require floppy 4-pin connectors, while the flagship 9800 requires a standard Molex 4-pin.

It was on par with or better than FX 5900 Ultra (a dual slot card) and outperformed FX 5900 (the fastest single slot card NVIDIA could offer back then). Really an excellent find. 👍

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-07, 16:13:

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-05, 17:58:

First, an ASUS P5N32-E SLI socket T (775) motherboard, which is the same board I had when I built my first Core2Duo PC with an Intel E6600. I still have that same E6600 CPU but I might stick the QX6700 CPU I currently have in another PC in this one, not sure yet. Also not pictured are two brand new Nvidia 7950 GTs which I will run SLI. This will be a mostly period correct 2006-2007 system running XP.

Well I'm 0 for 1 so far on the new acquisitions, the P5N32-E SLI will not POST at all using known good components from another system, so I'll have to return it. That's a huge bummer. Hopefully the other two boards work.

Maybe it's just me but it seems like there's a lot more crap being sold on ebay these days. I've had to send more stuff back just in the previous year than the entire 23 years I've been buying on eBay prior. You would think sellers wouldn't be so quick to sell used stuff without testing it before shipping it as they have to eat the return shipping. Or if you absolutely can't test it, just sell it for parts.

Stupid question did you use a new bios battery? I've had a large number of motherboards old and new either not power on/post or just behave and strange unpredictable ways with missing or dead/low bios batteries.

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-05-07, 13:24:

Turbo -> wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

Bought two AGP cards and two sticks of 512 Mb SDR Ram. All untested.

That ASUS 9600XT looks cool, hope it works for you, last real AGP flagship GPU ???

That would be the 9800XT. Nvidia's would have been the FX5900, before they started using bridge chips on their PCI-E offerings to sell AGP variants.

Munx wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

A lot of games that had a CD-check or many other forms of DRM. […]
Show full quote

tauro wrote on 2023-05-07, 08:20:

What could a Win7 computer run that Win10/11 doesn't run?

A lot of games that had a CD-check or many other forms of DRM.

For example, the only version of Red Alert 2 that I can run on my Windows 10 machine is the one from origin, as W10 refuses to run the CD installer. Even after that, I needed a community made patch to run it an acceptable framerate.

On Windows 7 meanwhile it's just a straight install and a single line edit on an .ini file to avoid slowdowns during explosions.

I see, very interesting example. So Win7 is more retro-compatible with very old CD-based games.

My point was this, is there any Win7 game (not compatible with Win98, not compatible with WinXP) that can't run on Windows 10 or 11?

chrismeyer6 wrote on 2023-05-07, 19:47:

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-07, 16:13:

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-05, 17:58:

First, an ASUS P5N32-E SLI socket T (775) motherboard, which is the same board I had when I built my first Core2Duo PC with an Intel E6600. I still have that same E6600 CPU but I might stick the QX6700 CPU I currently have in another PC in this one, not sure yet. Also not pictured are two brand new Nvidia 7950 GTs which I will run SLI. This will be a mostly period correct 2006-2007 system running XP.

Well I'm 0 for 1 so far on the new acquisitions, the P5N32-E SLI will not POST at all using known good components from another system, so I'll have to return it. That's a huge bummer. Hopefully the other two boards work.

Maybe it's just me but it seems like there's a lot more crap being sold on ebay these days. I've had to send more stuff back just in the previous year than the entire 23 years I've been buying on eBay prior. You would think sellers wouldn't be so quick to sell used stuff without testing it before shipping it as they have to eat the return shipping. Or if you absolutely can't test it, just sell it for parts.

Stupid question did you use a new bios battery? I've had a large number of motherboards old and new either not power on/post or just behave and strange unpredictable ways with missing or dead/low bios batteries.

I did not try a new CMOS battery. I've never had a board not boot with a dead or missing battery, they just don't retain settings or date/time, so that would be news to me. Worth a shot I guess. I'm going to try a few more things before throwing in the towel though. I really want it to work.

Dmetsys wrote on 2023-05-07, 21:39:

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-05-07, 13:24:

Turbo -> wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

Bought two AGP cards and two sticks of 512 Mb SDR Ram. All untested.

That ASUS 9600XT looks cool, hope it works for you, last real AGP flagship GPU ???

That would be the 9800XT. Nvidia's would have been the FX5900, before they started using bridge chips on their PCI-E offerings to sell AGP variants.

The FX5950 Ultra was the fastest FX card from Nvidia, not the 5900.

Nvidia also did some PCIe FX cards that used a bridge chip. The PCX5300, 5750 and 5900.

I found a passively cooled Radeon HD 3650 AGP for very cheap locally, it's my most powerful AGP card now 😀
I just had to re-apply new thermal paste as the old one was completely dry (and it seems that today everyone is doing that to be cool).

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-08, 05:00:

chrismeyer6 wrote on 2023-05-07, 19:47:

Brawndo wrote on 2023-05-07, 16:13:

Well I'm 0 for 1 so far on the new acquisitions, the P5N32-E SLI will not POST at all using known good components from another system, so I'll have to return it. That's a huge bummer. Hopefully the other two boards work.

Maybe it's just me but it seems like there's a lot more crap being sold on ebay these days. I've had to send more stuff back just in the previous year than the entire 23 years I've been buying on eBay prior. You would think sellers wouldn't be so quick to sell used stuff without testing it before shipping it as they have to eat the return shipping. Or if you absolutely can't test it, just sell it for parts.

Stupid question did you use a new bios battery? I've had a large number of motherboards old and new either not power on/post or just behave and strange unpredictable ways with missing or dead/low bios batteries.

I did not try a new CMOS battery. I've never had a board not boot with a dead or missing battery, they just don't retain settings or date/time, so that would be news to me. Worth a shot I guess. I'm going to try a few more things before throwing in the towel though. I really want it to work.

I was totally dumbfounded the first time I figured that out. So I went back through my container of non-working motherboards and trying new batteries had 15 suddenly spring to life. I did as a control pull the battery and try again and sure enough they all played dead. So it's one of my go-to troubleshooting steps. My sons socket A system with a Abit KT7a-raid gets weird blue screens or hangs at post when it's battery gets low and my EVGA 680i based XP system will not post with a dead battery.

tauro wrote on 2023-05-08, 03:31:

Munx wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

A lot of games that had a CD-check or many other forms of DRM. […]
Show full quote

tauro wrote on 2023-05-07, 08:20:

What could a Win7 computer run that Win10/11 doesn't run?

A lot of games that had a CD-check or many other forms of DRM.

For example, the only version of Red Alert 2 that I can run on my Windows 10 machine is the one from origin, as W10 refuses to run the CD installer. Even after that, I needed a community made patch to run it an acceptable framerate.

On Windows 7 meanwhile it's just a straight install and a single line edit on an .ini file to avoid slowdowns during explosions.

I see, very interesting example. So Win7 is more retro-compatible with very old CD-based games.

My point was this, is there any Win7 game (not compatible with Win98, not compatible with WinXP) that can't run on Windows 10 or 11?

I have not encountered such and I doubt there would be many, as XP support was ending when publishers were stopping to use crap like securom and moved on to win10 compatible garbage like denuevo.

The main advantage With 7 would be very wide (though not perfect) compatibility, which ranges from W9x stuff all the way up current-day titles.

Turbo -> wrote on 2023-05-07, 11:48:

Bought two AGP cards and two sticks of 512 Mb SDR Ram. All untested.

Love that ASUS 9800XTX! I had one exactly like that. Man that thing is all copper and really heavy 😀

Can someone identify this ISA card? I do not want to plug it to a PC before i know what it is.

I would guess it's a memory expansion card, as it has 8 RAM chips on it. Possibly for a specific motherboard.