digger wrote on 2023-01-24, 22:23:

Indeed, thanks for pointing it out. They're expensive, though! […]
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Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-22, 18:48:

StarTech has USB 3.0 cards for PCI slots. Of note to others, there are no Windows 9x drivers for these cards.

Indeed, thanks for pointing it out. They're expensive, though!

Hopefully they can be had elsewhere for more reasonable prices, pre-owned for instance.

Any other brands that released USB 3.0 cards for legacy PCI slots?

You could make one with a low profile pcie and a pcie to pci adapter

I find it difficult to adapt low profile cards with these card edge adapters. The primary issue is that low profile brackets face the opposite direction. So to get it to adapt properly, with the bracket screwed into the case and the lid shut, you need to have a different bracket altogether.

So, the card edge gets adapted, but the bracket doesn't fit. That isn't all that helpful for any practical use.

Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-25, 05:33:

I find it difficult to adapt low profile cards with these card edge adapters. The primary issue is that low profile brackets face the opposite direction. So to get it to adapt properly, with the bracket screwed into the case and the lid shut, you need to have a different bracket altogether.

So, the card edge gets adapted, but the bracket doesn't fit. That isn't all that helpful for any practical use.

Yeah, I know, idk why they decided to reverse the screw location

Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-25, 05:33:

I find it difficult to adapt low profile cards with these card edge adapters. The primary issue is that low profile brackets face the opposite direction. So to get it to adapt properly, with the bracket screwed into the case and the lid shut, you need to have a different bracket altogether.

So, the card edge gets adapted, but the bracket doesn't fit. That isn't all that helpful for any practical use.

In the case of a USB card, that might still be worked around if the bracket can be removed and the card has internal USB headers that would allow you to hook up a separate bracket or the USB ports integrated in the ATX case. But yeah, a legacy PCI card without such an adapter would indeed be much more practical.

At least we can 3D print our own brackets now.

Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-25, 15:41:

At least we can 3D print our own brackets now.

Calamitylime made a pcb bracket also.

I bought this last week and it works great under win98SE.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/275521969395

Motherboard is a 400LX chipset (Microstar MS-6118)

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-01-21, 18:36:

They slow down the system just by being installed. I’m not going benchmarks while copying files 🤣. :p that would make sense if that was the problem.

No, just by being installed they slow the system down.

The VT6212 card I mentioned didn't seem to slow the system down until a device was plugged into it. Even a mouse would totally kill performance (like 85% CPU usage at idle on a K6-2/500).

At least the card I have (a Rosewill RC-100) has an internal USB header. The problem with that card is that it has jumpers over the fuse positions on the power pins for each port, and it only uses half of the 5V pins in the PCI slot. I installed 750mA resettable fuses, but I haven't tested it to see if that current rating is acceptable (500mA is a little too low for external hard drives, but I don't want to toast the PCI connector - I guess it will just get a little warm at full current).

Recently I got a card with a NEC D72010XF1 chip. It looks cool with that IHS. The board is from October 2010 so it's a "very new" old card.
I didn't find any datasheet about this particular "XF1" chip but I guess it's part of the D72010(1) family. Perhaps the latest iteration? I still haven't tried it.

Off the top of my head, I think the latest non-laptop chips were the small square BGA ones. Often there will be a gigantic square silkscreen around it, indicating that the PCB was originally designed for the larger node with a larger package.

I think this is the result of a die shrink and refinements with the use of a revised PCB.

Another great comparison is the ESS Maestro-1 vs Maestro-2.

tauro wrote on 2023-02-03, 17:14:

Recently I got a card with a NEC D72010XF1 chip. It looks cool with that IHS. The board is from October 2010 so it's a "very new" old card.
I didn't find any datasheet about this particular "XF1" chip but I guess it's part of the D72010(1) family. Perhaps the latest iteration? I still haven't tried it.

Oh that’s very interesting.

Look forward to results of speed tests on old systems

Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-25, 15:41:

At least we can 3D print our own brackets now.

where?

I mounted A VIA one in my 80486 and it works fine. (* VIAUSB20 - black PCB , 3xUSB ports back and one inside).

USB 2.0 = a resource hog in 98se. From my experience, NEC cards work great if you can get them to stop sharing IRQ's with other devices.

Maybe that's why it's so unstable for me. I'll have to look into that.

psybyrd wrote on 2023-02-07, 22:00:

USB 2.0 = a resource hog in 98se. From my experience, NEC cards work great if you can get them to stop sharing IRQ's with other devices.

Would you please elaborate more on this? Do you have any more info?

Sphere478 wrote on 2023-02-04, 17:01:

tauro wrote on 2023-02-03, 17:14:

Recently I got a card with a NEC D72010XF1 chip. It looks cool with that IHS. The board is from October 2010 so it's a "very new" old card.
I didn't find any datasheet about this particular "XF1" chip but I guess it's part of the D72010(1) family. Perhaps the latest iteration? I still haven't tried it.

Oh that’s very interesting.

Look forward to results of speed tests on old systems

I plan to test this card and a VIA and ALi soon, on a socket 7 system and on a powerful socket 370 system and see what happens... both on Win98 and on Linux. I don't expect huge differences but we'll see. I'll do it and post the results when I get around to it, it's coming down the pike.

Back in the day I used an NEC based USB 2.0 card on my BH6. It seemed like the VIA chips always caused me issues just threw a bootloop.

Kahenraz wrote on 2023-01-22, 18:48:

StarTech has USB 3.0 cards for PCI slots. Of note to others, there are no Windows 9x drivers for these cards.

i have the startech card. are win98 drivers impossible or did renesas (nec) set an arbitrary cutoff so they wouldn't have to support it? i kinda been waiting for someone to mod the drivers. it's a nice card...4 ports and even low profile.

I've had bad luck with VIA based cards with my P5Hx-B & P200 MMX. I recently bought two old stock USB 1.1 & 2.0 pci cards boxed and complete with drivers for 98. One is ALI based, the other NEC. Hopefully I'll have luck with one of these.

(A chronos card and a Swann card, respectively)