I really don't know - possibly requests from the Chinese community.
The I/O ports make a lot of sense as I think most people were using the ISA expansion for an I/O card.
I'd be more keen to see an appropriate network interface like a Realtek 8019 chip or similar integrated, than all the way to VGA (and its poor emulation of old standards).

betamax80 wrote on 2023-09-02, 10:57:

I really don't know - possibly requests from the Chinese community.
The I/O ports make a lot of sense as I think most people were using the ISA expansion for an I/O card.
I'd be more keen to see an appropriate network interface like a Realtek 8019 chip or similar integrated, than all the way to VGA (and its poor emulation of old standards).

Yup, I understand what you mean. 😔 While some ISA VGAs still had special HW emulation modes, the original IBM VGA was very superficial here.
That being said, things like Composite CGA graphics and Plantronics mode weren't emulated, either way.

But there are alternatives. There used to be pre-VGA cards like ATI Wonder series or the ATI VIP (VGA Improved Performance).
Or enhanced EGA clones. Maybe some chips are still available as NOS?
If not, FPGA solutions like this one might be worth a look.
They could also provide a more optimal video output needed for the LCD panel.

Edit: I'm also a bit surprised as to why the creator had chosen AdLib, but didn't also add a simple (cheap) Covox DAC.
Some early Disney titles supported Sound Source (+Covox) and CGA graphics. Games like Sim Ants worked with Covox, too.
It's not important, but a minimalistic parallel port (no DMA/IRQ needed) can be built with a few 74 SMD parts, the DAC is just a resistor ladder.

Biggest advantage of Book 8088 so far - that it's produced 😀
I've seen a lot of open-source "build yourself an XT projects" - but those require technical skills and (a lot of) time to make.
As for video card - CGA and IO in Book 8088 are already done with three CLPD chips.
Video RAM chip is 32K Hynix - so 4-bit (16 colors) 320x200 screen is possible.
I wish i know anything about how those CLPD are programmed (there's a manual, but i would like to see a higher level one)
Newer version, as betamax80 pointed, has COM and LPT, so Covox is totally possible there.

n0p wrote on 2023-09-03, 08:24:

Biggest advantage of Book 8088 so far - that it's produced 😀
I've seen a lot of open-source "build yourself an XT projects" - but those require technical skills and (a lot of) time to make.

Yes, that's true. Some rather critical people (a bit like me, maybe) would consider it to be an rather unnecessary "e-waste", though. 😉

That reminds me of a recent hackaday.com article about a cheap, DSP-based AM-only radio.
One group found it to be great (the rose-coloured oldtimers of AM days), while the other one was upset because AM as such is useless,
rendering the radio obsolete (the real fun is on SSB and CW; AM stations on medium wave and short-wave have mostly died out in past 10 years).
Point was, that a slightly more expensive DSP of same family had said SSB support - so it was a wasted opportunity.

Edit: My apologies, I assume my wording was a bit poor again. I didn't meant to step on someone's feet. 🙁
What I mean, is, that with slightly different specs, the Book 8088 could be an actually useful item (not that Norton Commander in your pocket isn't cool).
Thing is, a real PC XT or Turbo XT in the business world used to have Hercules graphics (most popular choice) or EGA. Not basic CGA. That was kid's play.
So if that Book 8088 had *at least* Olivetti 640x400, Hercules (alternate res) 640x400, EGA Mono 640x350 or Hercules 720x348, it could be useful as a real DOS computer.
Just think of running compilers/IDEs (doing DOS programming on the road), astronomy programs, playing SimCity, machine control stuff etc.

Edit: Plantronics ColorPlus and Tandy graphics (TGA II) are of course equally worthy alternatives, I think.
They are "Super CGA" graphic systems, so to say. They feature the things so badly missed.

Edit: Just did the math. Technically, 512x256 in 16c (2 Bit) would fit into 32 KB, as well.
Too bad this resolution was never used on PC. It would have been much more balanced than 640x200 in 16c.
But IBM and the game industry were somewhat obsessed with 200 line modes, apparently.
From a purely technical point, resolutions with up to ca. 300 lines per field are manageable on an average 15 KHz CRT.
Anyway, that's a bit off-topic, maybe. It just came to mind when calculating minimum memory requirements for video standard.

Edit: Aw, I'm sorry, I got carried away again. I'm a bit too chatty. 😅

n0p wrote on 2023-09-03, 08:24:

As for video card - CGA and IO in Book 8088 are already done with three CLPD chips. Video RAM chip is 32K Hynix - so 4-bit (16 c […]
Show full quote

As for video card - CGA and IO in Book 8088 are already done with three CLPD chips.
Video RAM chip is 32K Hynix - so 4-bit (16 colors) 320x200 screen is possible.
I wish i know anything about how those CLPD are programmed (there's a manual, but i would like to see a higher level one)
Newer version, as betamax80 pointed, has COM and LPT, so Covox is totally possible there.

Interesting, 32 KB was likely chosen because original CGA has a mirrored frame buffer (2x 16 KB). By simply providing 32 KB physically, no extra logic is needed here.
- In reality, CGA image data uses 16 KB only. Another possible use case would be 640x200 in 4 colours (2 bit), I think.
Even on a real IBM CGA, if it had 32KB and its memory address logic was "corrected" (no mirroring).

Speaking of memory expansion, 736 KB of memory are perfectly fine in a CGA system.
Many upgraded XTs and clones had 704 KB and more memory installed.
Having such a memory expansion makes up for the lack of the HMA (286+),
which DOS 5 and up used to store their stuff (DOS 2&3 were more lightweight and didn't need that so much).
It would also lower the need for having some UMBs to load drivers into.

Edit:

n0p wrote on 2023-09-03, 08:24:

Newer version, as betamax80 pointed, has COM and LPT, so Covox is totally possible there.

Thanks for the info! That's good news indeed! ^^ And if the CPLDs get an update, eventually, it would be awesome! 😁

To be honest, i seriously doubt of any real practical use XT would have nowadays.
Even some special software could be reversed, run in emulator, etc.
For me it's like being in perfume store, you suddenly catch a whiff of a perfume that's almost identical to what your first love was wearing. That raised a whole level of long forgotten memories, so you immediately bought the bottle, not even looking at the price.
Lyrics aside, here's some more Book 8088 end-user notes:
Good:
- It's compact.
- BIOS/CGA chartable/CPU and some other chips are socketed and accessible without disassembly, though i wish the CPU/BIOS lid would be bigger, i had to make special twizzers for BIOS EPROM (EEPROM now 😀)
- Plastic case that wouldn't give you a heart attack if scratched (it's cheap 😀)

Bad:
- Aspect ratio. Screen itself is 16:9 and 400/200 lines are not filling it vertically, so it's even worse.
- Screen auto-align is bad. I don't know why the controls are not there, plenty of space inside, they could really be useful. Even hardware auto-align button instead of "mode 80" Fn-F7 would be great. For example, Rogue is misaligned by one column with 50% probability after gfx logo.
(So i ordered two screens - 8-inch IPS and 7-inch TN (4:3, with board and controls), will see what fits better)
- Speakers (those, that are routed to FM chip). I reverted them to lid side and put a tape over, so Super Solvers Adventure music doesn't scream and rattle. Volume control wouldn't hurt.
- Again, keyboard connector. Any type. I don't need mouse, never had an XT with one, but built-in small keyboard is very mediocre. I doubt that it's even replaceable, as it's mark YJ-860 doesn't yield any results (and it's firmly glued with double-sided tape to the case, and case is plastic, so heat gun is not really an option 😀)
- Small note: no rubber feet on case. I put some - feels better.

n0p wrote on 2023-09-03, 14:38:

To be honest, i seriously doubt of any real practical use XT would have nowadays.

Yeah, but would you like to see your, let's say, C64 being recreated as a ZX Spectrum, with rubber keys ? 😁
Or your favorite vintage car being re-released as a Kettcar ? 🤣

Personally, I never left the DOS world, I still do have a practical use for a few DOS programs and wouldn't like to accept a downgrade (well, I would. I would simply not use it).
One of them is IC Database, which I still use for my electronic hobby. It matches my 50 years old Weller soldering station so well! 😉
Sometimes, I also use QB45 for writing little tools for controlling homebrew interfaces on COM/LPT port. Or that little metric converter program on Windows 2.x..
I still use STS+, too, to check whenever the ISS passes above my location (the program was on MIR space station!; supports x87).
The various programs for my radio hobby (JV Fax, HamCom, The Hellschreiber, PK FAX etc) technically run on XTs, too. RDSSTV2 was made in the mid 80s, even.
Programs like Graphic Packet might need EGA and up, though, I admit.

Others seem to be similar minded here, as well, it seems.
The PCB people still seem to enjoy using P-Cad or Protel Autotrax/Easytrax etc., while the astronomy dudes still hold on to Sky Globe,
because no other modern alternative got as professional anymore. They're all just kids toys by comparison, lacking the seriousness and professionalism.

Edit: I'm sure other people might still have a need for similar classics. 😄
Like Autodesk 3D Studio, Deluxe Paint (aka DPaint, EGA/VGA; separate CGA release) or Neo Paint (VGA)..

PS: There was an interesting thread from 2018 in which various uses of old PCs were being discussed:
Anything else besides games on your retro PC? How old are You?

.. and I haven't even mentioned Expanded Memory (EMS) yet. It was literally made for XT class systems of the 80s. 🙁

Edit: What saves the little handheld is the expansion bus, I think. Many things missing can be added that way, albeit at cost of portability.
That's akin to 80s/90s era laptops with their docking stations. They had a base station, so to say, which contained all the important parts.

Edit:

For me it's like being in perfume store, you suddenly catch a whiff of a perfume that's almost identical to what your first love was wearing.
That raised a whole level of long forgotten memories, so you immediately bought the bottle, not even looking at the price.

Well said, I think I understand. 😀 I didn't mean to sound ungrateful or unpolite.
It's just.. To me, personally, it's more like a meal that I remember, perhaps.
If it does taste similar to what I loved to eat or to what I remember from childhood, I feel the urge to perfect it.
It needs more pepper, paprika, salt etc. Or maybe just not so much oregano. 🤷 😅

Jo22 wrote on 2023-09-03, 15:48:

Personally, I never left the DOS world, I still do have a practical use for a few DOS programs and wouldn't like to accept a downgrade (well, I would. I would simply not use it).

That's some passion!
Why would you need cramped Book8088?
--
Decided to fork 8088_bios, push my changes and make a quick release:
https://github.com/jinshin/8088_bios/releases/tag/Book8088
No copyrights wiped, only added 😀

If anyone spots the model with serial and parallel on any site other than TaoBao do let me know 😀

betamax80 wrote on 2023-09-10, 15:10:

If anyone spots the model with serial and parallel on any site other than TaoBao do let me know 😀

Let's just hope the serial port is an 16550A and not an XT era i8250; certain things are better left in the past.. 🙁

Hi!
I could need a little help. I bought one of those 8088 books in used condition but an IC has burned down after I powered it up:
Could somebody please write me the imprint of the "U33" device? Or take a high res picture an post it? I would like to replace it but there's not much left of it. 😀

Thank you very much!
Thilo

Here

Differences on the board layout on the power input? Well good luck with that...

the3dfxdude wrote on 2023-09-11, 18:10:

Differences on the board layout on the power input? Well good luck with that...

manufacturing flexibility, respin PCB design for the cheapest part of the week instead of being linked to one vendor and price/availability swings.

The Book8088, even with an 8088 CPU, isn't quite 100% cycle-accurate to an IBM PC. Can we fix that? Well, yes we can!

https://martypc.blogspot.com/2023/09/hacking- … r-accuracy.html

Poor V20, being replaced by a castrated 8086.. 😢

Jo22 wrote on 2023-09-11, 23:27:

Poor V20, being replaced by a castrated 8086.. 😢

Let's bug reenigne to make a V20 version of 8088MPH and Area 5150. 😁

GloriousCow wrote on 2023-09-11, 23:31:

Let's bug reenigne to make a V20 version of 8088MPH and Area 5150. 😁

Yay! 😁 Your summary of the matter was excellent, also. Also kudos for the little mod on a veroboard. 😃👍

Jo22 wrote on 2023-09-10, 17:39:

betamax80 wrote on 2023-09-10, 15:10:

If anyone spots the model with serial and parallel on any site other than TaoBao do let me know 😀

Let's just hope the serial port is an 16550A and not an XT era i8250; certain things are better left in the past.. 🙁

Shudder - I hadn't even considered that. Yes I hope it has a 16550 UART.

rasz_pl wrote on 2023-09-11, 21:03:

manufacturing flexibility, respin PCB design for the cheapest part of the week instead of being linked to one vendor and price/availability swings.

So we have a guy, who bought a _used_ book, finds he has a burned out XL4015, also has a different pcb than another person. And I'm to be told the independent guy doing this is already respinning and practicing DFM on what was announced as a hobby run, and so the issue is not coming from a defect? My suggestion would to be cautious and check over it some more instead of directly slapping another IC on there. Of course the previous owner could have trashed it doing something stupid. This thing is attracting tinkerers primarily so who knows.