VOGONS


Reply 181 of 229, by retardware

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As WINXX.CAB is hard to find, best apply it before firstboot.
Press Shift-F5 or-F8 at the first reboot and apply the Loew patches you need.

Edit: Look for the HDCP patch.

Reply 182 of 229, by vinxi2

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The problem is that I can't get past the first Scandisk before the setup.

I re-created the two partitions with "Minitool Partition Wizard":
https://www.partitionwizard.com/free-partition-manager.html

and then with:
https://www.paragon-software.com/free/pm-express/

and now for Scandisk it's the C: drive that has that LBA error. In the BIOS the LBA is enabled.

Is the 4.0 GB size wrong for Windows 98?

I then deleted the recovery partition in FDISK and it didn't work either.

Just for chatting, "Enhanced mode" or "Compatible mode" in the BIOS didn't make a difference.

Reply 183 of 229, by Sombrero

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-10, 19:02:
The problem is that I can't get past the first Scandisk before the setup. […]
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The problem is that I can't get past the first Scandisk before the setup.

I re-created the two partitions with "Minitool Partition Wizard":
https://www.partitionwizard.com/free-partition-manager.html

and then with:
https://www.paragon-software.com/free/pm-express/

and now for Scandisk it's the C: drive that has that LBA error. In the BIOS the LBA is enabled.

Is the 4.0 GB size wrong for Windows 98?

I then deleted the recovery partition in FDISK and it didn't work either.

Just for chatting, "Enhanced mode" or "Compatible mode" in the BIOS didn't make a difference.

4GB is fine.

Super Fdisk is one other you could also try, pretty sure I've seen someone here mentioning they use that themself. It also lets you do a emergency floppy/CD that lets you run it on the PC directly without having to move the SSD around.

You could also try to create one full disk size FAT32 partition and see does that help, maybe the unallocated space is somehow confusing scandisk. Other than that I don't know, maybe the issue is too large SSD, or maybe because you are using SATA, or maybe the stars aren't aligned the right way 🤷🏻

DOS/Win98SE: Pentium III 650MHz / Voodoo 3 3000 / Sound Blaster Audigy 2 / Orpheus
WinXP: Pentium 4 HT 651 3.4GHz (65W) / 9800 GTX+ / Sound Blaster X-Fi
Win7/10: Xeon E3-1230 v3 / GTX 1660 Ti / Sound Blaster Z

Reply 184 of 229, by vinxi2

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Guys, I made it using a patched Fdisk:

https://fd.lod.bz/repos/current/pkg-html/fdisk.1_3_4.html

Like @chinny22 said. I added this software to the FAT32 GB partition of the Easy2Boot flash drive that is accessible from DOS.
That Fdisk is able to see all the 240 GB so that's what I did:

- Create 4 GB Primary Partition C: WIN98
- Activate it
- Create 10 GB Extended Partition E: RECOVERY

Reboot, format both as FAT32, copy "WIN98" folder to the recovery partition and start the setup that is really fast on this machine. In the first 3-4 reboots I couldn't even see the boot Windows logo screen. I just installed NUSB36, Chipset, Audio, LAN, USB, VGA drivers and beside the LAN that i didn't test, everything works. Windows lost some italian parts 🤣 but that's ok.

The only problem is that the image is not really sharp. Is it the cable? It's very old.

Tomorroy I will Install large drive and RAM patches.

Reply 185 of 229, by Sombrero

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-10, 23:11:

The only problem is that the image is not really sharp. Is it the cable? It's very old.

You are using a modern LCD monitor? If so, welcome to the world of native resolutions and interpolation. Your monitor has a fixed native resolution and resolutions under that leave a lot of extra pixels that need to be filled by mathematical guesswork. The quality of your VGA cable can affect the picture quality, and so can the monitor itself and your GPU.

I've noticed Voodoo 3 has excellent picture quality using my Dell 1280x1024 monitor, but if I hook up my XP machine to it with an NVIDIA GPU the picture is not great when not using native resolution.

DOS/Win98SE: Pentium III 650MHz / Voodoo 3 3000 / Sound Blaster Audigy 2 / Orpheus
WinXP: Pentium 4 HT 651 3.4GHz (65W) / 9800 GTX+ / Sound Blaster X-Fi
Win7/10: Xeon E3-1230 v3 / GTX 1660 Ti / Sound Blaster Z

Reply 186 of 229, by vinxi2

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Sombrero wrote on 2021-11-11, 05:17:

You are using a modern LCD monitor? If so, welcome to the world of native resolutions and interpolation.

Understood. I raised the resolution to 1280x960 and things got a little better but definitely not good. Also the image sometimes "tremble" at some height.
Today I should get the 9600 Pro with DVI connection, I hope it's better.

Can you guys point me to a thread with essential software for Windows 98?
I won't browse the internet or read PDF, I'll just play games.

Edit: Yesterday before going to bed I disconnected the "on the fly" connection with the PSU, now I reconnected it and the system turned itself off/on during the POST without video. Now it's working normally. What was that?

Reply 187 of 229, by vinxi2

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I just got the 9600 Pro, connected via DVI, and eveything went wrong.

In the first boot Windows 98 displayed these strange character while booting:

IMG-2601-2.jpg

and after installing ATI drivers 6.2, the latest, Windows gave me this error:

IMG-2602.jpg

Something like "graphic bus error" and "graphic driver encountered incompatbility issue with the system and it's not possible to use accelerated graphic rendering". Plus I have those blu/green vertical lines and the system hangs.

Edit: In Safe Mode I uninstalled iGPU drivers, put 1024x768 32bit and everything looks better but those DOS characters are still there, the windows logo screen doesn't appear anymore, the boot is slow, and sometimes the system hangs.

Is the GPU defective?

Reply 189 of 229, by vinxi2

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I removed the GPU and everything went back as normal.

I also installed the RAM patch since I got the 2x1 GB and everything went fine.

Just out of curiosity, I installed DirectX9 and copied Thief 2 ("8 bit paletted texture + table fog" title) GOG version and the sky in the mission 1, with the simple iGPU, is black and full of stars. It's patched for sure, but it was fun to watch after all the fear about those 2 feature missing on ATI/GeForce 6+.

Reply 190 of 229, by Joseph_Joestar

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-11, 16:47:

It's patched for sure, but it was fun to watch after all the fear about those 2 feature missing on ATI/GeForce 6+.

The Thief 2 stars are not paletted textures.They are rendered using a technique that wasn't supported by contemporary Nvidia cards.

For testing paletted textures try Forsaken and unpatched FF7.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / OPTi 82C930 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 1700+ / Abit KT7A / Voodoo3 / SBLive / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3000+ / Asus K8V-MX / GeForce4 / Audigy1
PC#4: i5-3550P / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 650Ti / X-Fi

Reply 191 of 229, by DosFreak

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-11, 16:47:

I removed the GPU and everything went back as normal.

I also installed the RAM patch since I got the 2x1 GB and everything went fine.

Just out of curiosity, I installed DirectX9 and copied Thief 2 ("8 bit paletted texture + table fog" title) GOG version and the sky in the mission 1, with the simple iGPU, is black and full of stars. It's patched for sure, but it was fun to watch after all the fear about those 2 feature missing on ATI/GeForce 6+.

Yeah Thief has been well supported by the community. GOG didn't do anything except allow people to buy it.

I want to say Timeslip was the first to fix the issue with ddfix.
Think tafferpatcher may have included ddfix.
Tfix and t2fix may have included it as well.
Then the source code was leaked and "NewDark" was posted to the net which is the Thief source code updated and compiled.
Then tfix and t2fix integrated newdark as an option at one point. Not sure if it's a requirement or not now though.
Think GOG is likely using NewDark and/or t2fix but I don't rebuy games I already own so haven't been able to check.

Keep in mind though that even though there are patches not everyone wants to use those patches and just want to run the original game.

Last edited by DosFreak on 2021-11-11, 19:56. Edited 1 time in total.

DOSBox Compilation Guides
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PC Game Compatibility List
How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
Running DRM games offline

Reply 192 of 229, by vinxi2

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Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2021-11-11, 17:08:

For testing paletted textures try Forsaken and unpatched FF7.

IMG-2607.jpg
IMG-2606.jpg
IMG-2608.jpg
IMG-2609.jpg

I'm sorry for the photos, but I don't know how to take screenshots yet.
I tried Forsaken, but I needed to patch it to 1.01 because the monitor otherwise couldn't display the default resolution/refresh and I don't know where to edit it.

I choosed the "Generic 3d Accelerator" as Renderer, 800x600 but 16bit, don’t know why 32bit is not available. And I got 60FPS by the way 🤣

How is it?

Reply 193 of 229, by Joseph_Joestar

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-11, 19:29:

I'm sorry for the photos, but I don't know how to take screenshots yet.
I tried Forsaken, but I needed to patch it to 1.01 because the monitor otherwise couldn't display the default resolution/refresh and I don't know where to edit it.

My "unpatched" comment was made only in reference to Final Fantasy VII, since its official patch removed the requirement for paletted textures. Before that, with the stock v1.00 version of the game, you couldn't use 3D acceleration unless your graphics card supported all the required features:

FF7_v100.jpg
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When running the FF7 Configuration tool, paletted textures are the last requirement on the list.

I choosed the "Generic 3d Accelerator" as Renderer, 800x600 but 16bit, don’t know why 32bit is not available.

Forsaken should work fine on any graphics card, since it offers a choice between many different texture formats. But it is useful as a quick test to determine whether your graphics card is capable of using paletted textures. To check this, go to Options > Visuals > Select Texture Format. On my Voodoo3 that screen looks like this:

Forsaken.jpg
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Different graphics cards may list other texture formats here as well. But if they don't support paletted textures, then that option won't be available.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / OPTi 82C930 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 1700+ / Abit KT7A / Voodoo3 / SBLive / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3000+ / Asus K8V-MX / GeForce4 / Audigy1
PC#4: i5-3550P / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 650Ti / X-Fi

Reply 194 of 229, by Joseph_Joestar

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And just to clarify, both FF7 (with the official patch) and Forsaken will work on a card which doesn't support paletted textures. They are mostly useful for detecting that capability (or lack thereof).

The problem is that there may be other games which need paletted textures but don't advertise it openly. At the moment we simply don't have enough data to know the full impact of this feature and how widespread it was.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / OPTi 82C930 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 1700+ / Abit KT7A / Voodoo3 / SBLive / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3000+ / Asus K8V-MX / GeForce4 / Audigy1
PC#4: i5-3550P / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 650Ti / X-Fi

Reply 195 of 229, by chinny22

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ah man, I'm too late as normal! but looks like everyone else has you sorted.

but as you'll no doubt be installing windows in the future, skipping scandisk during setup is as easy as typing setup /is

This page has list of all the other switches which can be useful when installing on slower computers
https://www.windowsreinstall.com/articles/set … tm#.YY5lFGDP3cs

Reply 196 of 229, by vinxi2

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Different graphics cards may list other texture formats here as well. But if they don't support paletted textures, then that option won't be available.

Yes you're right. I had many options in that menu but not that one.

chinny22 wrote on 2021-11-12, 13:01:

ah man, I'm too late as normal! but looks like everyone else has you sorted.

Yes, everyone here is helping me, I really appreciate that.

Guys while I'm waiting for a different GPU I'm doing the partitioning.
Since I got a 240GB SSD do I have to leave that 25% unpartitioned? Or can I use it all by doing TRIM on Windows XP?

Reply 197 of 229, by Sombrero

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vinxi2 wrote on 2021-11-12, 16:44:

Guys while I'm waiting for a different GPU I'm doing the partitioning.
Since I got a 240GB SSD do I have to leave that 25% unpartitioned? Or can I use it all by doing TRIM on Windows XP?

Your SSD has a tool that can trim FAT32 partitions under XP? Because I only just heard that apparently the disk optimizer on Windows 10 can't trim FAT32 file system. Linux might be able to trim FAT32, but I haven't seen anyone confirming that. Then there's the DOS DISK/FAT32 TRIM Program from Rudolph R. Loew which should work?

Unless someone pops in and tells a sure way to trim FAT32, I'd recommend making a small test partition, trying that R. Loews DOS tool and/or a linux live CD. If you can trim the partion with something you don't need any overprovisioning, just trim it occasionally. If you can't trim it, then you might benefit from leaving unallocated space. How much I cannot say, but I doubt you are going to somehow manage to use that whole 240GB for games anyway, so why not.

DOS/Win98SE: Pentium III 650MHz / Voodoo 3 3000 / Sound Blaster Audigy 2 / Orpheus
WinXP: Pentium 4 HT 651 3.4GHz (65W) / 9800 GTX+ / Sound Blaster X-Fi
Win7/10: Xeon E3-1230 v3 / GTX 1660 Ti / Sound Blaster Z

Reply 199 of 229, by vinxi2

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Thanks Sombrero.

I created this set of partitions based on @chinny22 suggestion:

2 GB FAT32 Windows 98
100 GB FAT32 Data1 (recovery/drivers for the moment)
110 GB FAT32 Data2
11 GB NTFS XP

Edit: I don't know if I have to TRIM FAT32, I don't if I have to TRIM in general here. 🤣 Please tell me.

I created the last partition in XP setup that wanted to leave 8MB at the end of the drive, don't know why.
If this partitions scheme works, I don't have to patch Win98 for larger HDDs.

I installed XP after reinstalling Win98 by adding its ISO to the already created Easy2Boot, Phil has a video about that too. It installed very fast too and set automatically the dual boot. I now wonder how to restore it when I will have to reinstall Windows 98.
About XP I have to find ways to remove its "toyness".

I didn't install GPU drivers in both OSes, hoping that like this it's more "cleaner" since next week I *should* get the FX5700 hoping it works. I will try the GPU in XP first, since it should be more "robust" in driver installing. (right?)

Basically the idea is to use mainly the more stable XP, and use Win98 when older games won't work on it or for DOS ones.