Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-11-24, 17:41:

Intel is spending 26 billion on fabrication plants around the world. Don’t count them out. […]
Show full quote

Intel is spending 26 billion on fabrication plants around the world.
Don’t count them out.

Video link:
https://youtu.be/PtSSoZW19vs

Intel still can't count.........

My grand conspiracy theory is that the future is Intel's, and all they have to do is stay in the game long enough.

It's not because of anything Intel is doing, although I love the fact that they have an engineer CEO again. Their stock price has been taking hits, but I've read it's because of a shareholder revolt over the companies change in direction from return to shareholders to R&D and growth again.

No, I think Intel stands ready to inherit the semiconductor crown again because China is going to fuck over Taiwan, and TSMC along with it. At this point almost everyone can see the writing on the wall. But I think the true implications of it are too terrifying for people to earnestly consider.

China has spent billions over a decade trying to nurture a homegrown semiconductor industry, and has practically zero to show for it. And right off their shore is a territory they believe is rightfully theirs, with the worlds best semiconductor company. Where there is a will there is a way.

At best, TSMC must spend the next several years attempting to move as much of their manufacturing out of China's reach as possible. You see them doing this, opening new fabs around the world. I question how complete the process will be before China moves. Especially since I imagine nationalizing TSMC will be a huge part of their motivation. Doesn't do them much good to let their prey escape.

So I suspect TSMC will be partially or entirely nationalized by the CCP. And once again, the implications of this are too terrifying for most people to earnestly consider. For starters, the CCP will steal the intellectual property of everyone who has ever done business with TSMC. Furthermore, they'll hold the manufacturing capacity hostage to allowing further intellectual property to be stolen, just as they've done with every company that does business with China.

Worst case, other companies let this happen, as they sleepwalk right into worse long term problems, to avoid short term supply chain disruption.

Well, that's not the worst case. The worst case is certain actors burn TSMC's facilities in Taiwan to the ground to prevent them from falling into the CCPs hands. They are practically the worlds most important strategic resource, and any international actor worth their salt would be wise to prevent them from falling into the CCPs hands, as opposed to be a common good as they are currently.

Anyways, since I believe anyone with business ties with TSMC is a dead man walking, even if they don't know it yet, or believe the worst won't happen, I believe almost by default Intel's day will come. Even if they are still on a 14nm+++++++ process, or "Intel 7" or whatever they call it.

"Real men have fabs". And we're about to find out why soon.

Caluser2000 wrote on 2021-11-24, 17:53:

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2021-11-24, 17:41:

Intel is spending 26 billion on fabrication plants around the world. Don’t count them out. […]
Show full quote

Intel is spending 26 billion on fabrication plants around the world.
Don’t count them out.

Video link:
https://youtu.be/PtSSoZW19vs

Intel still can't count.........

The PR guys probably rounded it from 26.0000000000002713 Billion

Namrok wrote on 2021-11-24, 18:00:

...

You are so drunk on Western propaganda, it is sad to read what you just wrote. China is Taiwan's biggest export market, people go to work there, etc. People in West are fed propaganda daily and USA wants you to be scared of CCP because united China and Taiwan would create a country that is more than the sum of its parts. Taiwan has the technology China is still missing and China has the human capital and financial resources that Taiwan needs, TSMC would benefit greatly and Intel and Samsung would be in trouble. China and Taiwan reunification would create a country with which USA would not be able to compete and that is why they are scared. CCP will not touch Taiwan unless Taiwan makes the first move, because otherwise they would lose it forever, that is why USA is desperately trying to make Taiwan make a dumb mistake like Ukraine, Lybia and other countries that trusted USA.

Namrok wrote on 2021-11-24, 18:00:

My grand conspiracy theory is that the future is Intel's, and all they have to do is stay in the game long enough. […]
Show full quote

My grand conspiracy theory is that the future is Intel's, and all they have to do is stay in the game long enough.

It's not because of anything Intel is doing, although I love the fact that they have an engineer CEO again. Their stock price has been taking hits, but I've read it's because of a shareholder revolt over the companies change in direction from return to shareholders to R&D and growth again.

No, I think Intel stands ready to inherit the semiconductor crown again because China is going to fuck over Taiwan, and TSMC along with it. At this point almost everyone can see the writing on the wall. But I think the true implications of it are too terrifying for people to earnestly consider.

China has spent billions over a decade trying to nurture a homegrown semiconductor industry, and has practically zero to show for it. And right off their shore is a territory they believe is rightfully theirs, with the worlds best semiconductor company. Where there is a will there is a way.

At best, TSMC must spend the next several years attempting to move as much of their manufacturing out of China's reach as possible. You see them doing this, opening new fabs around the world. I question how complete the process will be before China moves. Especially since I imagine nationalizing TSMC will be a huge part of their motivation. Doesn't do them much good to let their prey escape.

So I suspect TSMC will be partially or entirely nationalized by the CCP. And once again, the implications of this are too terrifying for most people to earnestly consider. For starters, the CCP will steal the intellectual property of everyone who has ever done business with TSMC. Furthermore, they'll hold the manufacturing capacity hostage to allowing further intellectual property to be stolen, just as they've done with every company that does business with China.

Worst case, other companies let this happen, as they sleepwalk right into worse long term problems, to avoid short term supply chain disruption.

Well, that's not the worst case. The worst case is certain actors burn TSMC's facilities in Taiwan to the ground to prevent them from falling into the CCPs hands. They are practically the worlds most important strategic resource, and any international actor worth their salt would be wise to prevent them from falling into the CCPs hands, as opposed to be a common good as they are currently.

Anyways, since I believe anyone with business ties with TSMC is a dead man walking, even if they don't know it yet, or believe the worst won't happen, I believe almost by default Intel's day will come. Even if they are still on a 14nm+++++++ process, or "Intel 7" or whatever they call it.

"Real men have fabs". And we're about to find out why soon.

I actually read through all of this and I feel dumber for it.

Okay, can't blame you appiah. The IR and geopolitic experts seem to have carried over from fb.

antrad wrote on 2021-11-25, 09:24:

You are so drunk on Western propaganda, it is sad to read what you just wrote. China is Taiwan's biggest export market, people go to work there, etc. People in West are fed propaganda daily and USA wants you to be scared of CCP because united China and Taiwan would create a country that is more than the sum of its parts.

People everywhere are exposed to propaganda, "the West" is no exception. Your claim (if I understand it correctly) is that both Taiwan and China want to (re)unite, and it is the USA (or "the West") in general that is preventing that?

dr_st wrote on 2021-11-25, 14:46:

antrad wrote on 2021-11-25, 09:24:

You are so drunk on Western propaganda, it is sad to read what you just wrote. China is Taiwan's biggest export market, people go to work there, etc. People in West are fed propaganda daily and USA wants you to be scared of CCP because united China and Taiwan would create a country that is more than the sum of its parts.

People everywhere are exposed to propaganda, "the West" is no exception. Your claim (if I understand it correctly) is that both Taiwan and China want to (re)unite, and it is the USA (or "the West") in general that is preventing that?

You gotta admit, it's pretty funny to see someone pull the "u propaganda" card, and then promptly proceed to respond with an analysis as balanced as the Titanic in its last minute above water. 😉

VileR wrote on 2021-11-25, 15:15:

dr_st wrote on 2021-11-25, 14:46:

antrad wrote on 2021-11-25, 09:24:

You are so drunk on Western propaganda, it is sad to read what you just wrote. China is Taiwan's biggest export market, people go to work there, etc. People in West are fed propaganda daily and USA wants you to be scared of CCP because united China and Taiwan would create a country that is more than the sum of its parts.

People everywhere are exposed to propaganda, "the West" is no exception. Your claim (if I understand it correctly) is that both Taiwan and China want to (re)unite, and it is the USA (or "the West") in general that is preventing that?

You gotta admit, it's pretty funny to see someone pull the "u propaganda" card, and then promptly proceed to respond with an analysis as balanced as the Titanic in its last minute above water. 😉

like the titanic was ever above the water, that's what they want you to think!! 😀

Both TSMC and Intel do business in China. Alot of chips flow into China. TSMC already operates plants in mainland China, and Intel plans to as well. Alot of product comes out of China to western countries. Any kind of war drumming will simply devastate the supply chain, and benefits no one. For the part on the Chinese government taking a direct stake in TSMC technology through unification doesn't seem like a positive step forward, as TSMC already has presence in China, how would direct government involvement help business? It seems like the opposite effect could just as likely happen.

I wish I could speculate better from what I know, but really as it stands, all the big foundries are growing tremendously right now. Whoever's business strategy wins out in current events not anyone really can predict. But I don't agree that one company is going to leapfrog the others through some big plan.

TSMC is building new fabs in USA though, so...

The high tech equipment used in TSMC fabs are made in Europe and if China invaded Taiwan they will be cut off.

TSMC is building fabs in the US and Europe because the governments there are shelling out massive amounts of money for them.

Anyway back on topic Intels claim to fame has always been is massive manufacturing facilities allowing it to churn out millions of chips. Cyrix and AMD with a much smaller footprint and using older processes were able to dethrone Intel a few times. The only thing holding AMD back these days is limited production which will change in the next 4 to 5 years.

I don't see Intel gaining a tech edge in manufacturing again so they will slowly decline for a decade or two until like AMD and everyone else before them run out of cash to have their own dedicated fabs and have to use others for manufacturing.

I don’t know if they still do but Intel use to manufacture CPU’s for Nvidia and they also manufactured the CPU for HP the Itanium.

Intel is advertising $179 discrete 6gb 3D graphics cards coming online soon. (At least the spam I’ve been getting says that)

What that actually means (if anything) remains to be seen

Two i740 cores SLIed together with a PCIe bridge 🤣

BitWrangler wrote on 2021-11-26, 04:42:

Two i740 cores SLIed together with a PCIe bridge 🤣

If true Someone will couple that graphics core with a quad AMD Threadripper Pro 3995WX and complain fallout76 runs poorly

rmay635703 wrote on 2021-11-26, 04:22:

Intel is advertising $179 discrete 6gb 3D graphics cards coming online soon. (At least the spam I’ve been getting says that)

What that actually means (if anything) remains to be seen

You will probably be buying $500 worth of driver bugs alongside them, but we'll see.

Has anyone mentioned "Made in Merica" yet?

Caluser2000 wrote on 2021-11-26, 14:24:

Has anyone mentioned "Made in Merica" yet?

I think the champion of that propoganda is still banned from posting.