psaez wrote on 2024-04-10, 20:30:

Hi […]
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Hi

I mean connecting just for reading websites, without installing anything from internet. At least not anything with one or more alerts on virustotal.com

I ask this, because I remember that Windows XP in his last days got a virus that entered the computer just installing it with a connection on. Just after the clean install you already got the virus.

Does that happen also on 95 or 98SE?

The Blaster worm would only get to your Windows XP system if it was directly connected to the internet and not behind a NAT/Firewall. If you use a regular home router, you should be fine.

While Win9x didn't have the vulnerable background services that Win2K/XP had that the Blaster worm exploited, you'll run into other types of issues, like not having a web browser that can negotiate a secure cipher with today's web services. I think there was a work-around for that, but I would still use the Opera web browser (9 or 10 works on Win95/98) because most of the malware and exploits target Internet Explorer.. or targeted anyway.

There aren't really any services enabled by default on Win9x, unless you configure with file sharing turned on or turn on the message program -- which you probably shouldn't. I don't remember any remote exploits in the network stack itself.

I think I remember there being issues with IGMP maybe having a DoS or a crash bug. Maybe it was fixed in a patch. But it wouldn't hurt having a firewall to mitigate things. But most of the time you run behind NAT? Right? I can't imagine you are suggesting running naked and plugging directly into your ISP these days.

The real problem is gonna be the browser, just connecting at all to most websites. You could try running lynx with modern ssl lib. Yeah, that would at least be something.

Not sure how it's now, but in the 2000s, I've seen how quickly a Windows 98SE PC got infected.

Read my story here: Re: Windows XP how many people still use for it their MAIN OS?

Edit: My recommendation if you really want let Windows 98 go online: Get a physical firewall to protected the vintage PC.
It doesn't have to be fancy. An old DSL or cable router, a Raspberry Pi running PiHole etc.

Edit: Windows Scripting Host (WSH) might be enabled on Windows 9x; disable it if not necessary.

Jo22 wrote on 2024-04-11, 01:10:

Not sure how it's now, but in the 2000s, I've seen how quickly a Windows 98SE PC got infected. […]
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Not sure how it's now, but in the 2000s, I've seen how quickly a Windows 98SE PC got infected.

Read my story here: Re: Windows XP how many people still use for it their MAIN OS?

Edit: My recommendation if you really want let Windows 98 go online: Get a physical firewall to protected the vintage PC.
It doesn't have to be fancy. An old DSL or cable router, a Raspberry Pi running PiHole etc.

Edit: Windows Scripting Host (WSH) might be enabled on Windows 9x; disable it if not necessary.

the3dfxdude wrote on 2024-04-11, 00:21:

There aren't really any services enabled by default on Win9x, unless you configure with file sharing turned on or turn on the message program -- which you probably shouldn't. I don't remember any remote exploits in the network stack itself.

I think I remember there being issues with IGMP maybe having a DoS or a crash bug. Maybe it was fixed in a patch. But it wouldn't hurt having a firewall to mitigate things. But most of the time you run behind NAT? Right? I can't imagine you are suggesting running naked and plugging directly into your ISP these days.

The real problem is gonna be the browser, just connecting at all to most websites. You could try running lynx with modern ssl lib. Yeah, that would at least be something.

Hi, I don't know anything about using a NAT, old DSL or cable router, pihole, etc... and even I don't have a raspberry pi. Also, yes, my intention was to connect it directly to my ISP router to have internet.

Then, is not safe to do it? Will it be automatically full of viruses? in that case, I simply will not do it. But other person on this post is telling that it will be safe.

Who is right?

This topic came up recently, you should be able to find it with a search.

There is no clear cut answer. It's down to your approach to the risks. Your ISP router should mitigate a lot of the issues that were relevant during the hey-day of Windows 98 and XP. But the usefulness of having the systems online today is limited. Maybe working through those limitations is a fun exercise in and of itself though 😀

I don't know of a definite answer, either.

One use case for having a Windows 9x system online are multiplayer games, I suppose.
Or old chat programs and media players, maybe.

Another reason might be nostalgia/reliving the past.
Browsing vintage websites on a vintage PC is priceless.

Wayback Machine seems to support this, I believe.
It can be accessed in a way that the site's history frame is being hidden.

In the browser's URL bar, merely the basic URL is being visible (no Wayback).

Sorry, can't put this into words right now.
That's what I mean: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OB1g8CUdbA

Update. Just recently, there had been a little controversy about XP and its vulnerability to internet malware. It's because of a YouTube video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uSVVCmOH5w

https://www.derstandard.de/story/300000022073 … lware-infiziert

https://www.golem.de/news/youtuber-demonstrie … 405-185239.html

However, the test done by that YouTuber has some flaws, maybe.
The XP in question was SP2 (?) with its firewall being disabled (just like Windows 98) and no hardware router between PC and internet connection.

In terms of Windows 98SE, the first one is still a problem (98SE has no firewall) but the second one shouldn't. We're no longer using 56k modems.

In our modern days, most people have a DSL router, cable router or fibre router.
Which by default hide the PC between a NAT (98SE/XP use IPv4) and do block certain ports.

Plain modems without router capability are no longer around (like 56k modems or DSL modems).
At least not here in my home country, I think. Not sure how it's elsewhere.
We're merely reducing a DSL/Cable router to a plain modem if we're using a dedicated router that we own by ourselves.

(Background story: there were legal issues about replacing the default routers,
because DSL/cable companies had something to say about which hardware could be interfaced to THEIR network.
So users left the poor router in place and reconfigured it as a dumb modem.
All network devices were instead being connected to an attached router w/ firewall .)

It's not "safe" but ultimately the only difference is if someone reports to MS a vulnerability in Windows 10, they will patch it, whereas if someone discovers something in Windows 98, they won't.

Firewalls, routers, etc. aren't necessarily relevant either. See pp. 15-16 for a demo of what could happen if you connected from Win 3.x to an untrusted FTP server using ancient WS_FTP: https://github.com/jakethompson1/16buffer/blo … ster/buffer.pdf

Jo22 wrote on Yesterday, 21:03:

Update. Just recently, there had been a little controversy about XP and its vulnerability to internet malware. It's because of a YouTube video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uSVVCmOH5w

Saw this video and was disappointed. I thought it would be good for the old "how safe is " question that comes up every year or so here.
but as soon as he mentioned it was a direct connection to the internet the whole experiment was no longer relevant to 99% of us.

You could do the same thing with a fully patched Win11 PC, if you turned its firewall off and put it direct on the internet it may take a bit longer, but it'll still get infected.