VOGONS


First post, by Cursed Derp

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Heyyyyyyyo,
I have the DOS starter pack from Phil's Computer Lab installed. I've edited my configuration files to boot to DOS automatically. However, all of the drivers only work if I've shut down from pure DOS (the system's state after I've rebooted to DOS from Windows). If I shut down the computer from Windows, then boot back up, the Windows startup screen appears. The pc then boots to zombie DOS. Only some drivers work. CTmouse barely works. The sound drivers only work with a few games. I made a batch file that runs the custom autoexec used for the starter pack, but when I run it, only a few games work with the drivers. Duke 3d, the best game ever, works. Doom and Doom 2 either crash or have no sound. To get back to pure DOS, I have to run Windows and then reboot to DOS. If there's any way to always boot to normal pure DOS, I would like to know.
Thank ye.

I am as smooth as a gravy train with flaming biscuit wheels.

Reply 1 of 8, by theelf

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Maybe is because english is not my native language, but i can't understand anything

Anyways, without hardware details..

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQlFTWxjM2As3cRqneTlxDJ4fJftCIgwjkB8g&usqp=CAU

Reply 2 of 8, by Cursed Derp

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It's a Dell Dimension L1000R running Windows 98 SE. It has a Sound Blaster PCI CT4810 card.

I am as smooth as a gravy train with flaming biscuit wheels.

Reply 3 of 8, by theelf

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Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-07-01, 23:33:

It's a Dell Dimension L1000R running Windows 98 SE. It has a Sound Blaster PCI CT4810 card.

Sound Blaster PCI FM emulation in DOS is terrible, be aware

Anyways, in DOS, use something like this in your autoexec

SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 H5 P330 T6
SET SBPCI=C:\DOSDRV
C:\DOSDRV\SBINIT.COM
SynthFile=C:\DOSDRV\Eapci8m.Ecw

Change C:\DOSDRV to whatever is your driver

Here drivers for DOS

https://easymamecab.mameworld.info/html/snddosdr.htm

Reply 4 of 8, by RetroSonicHero

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What do you mean by "pure DOS"? Windows 98 SE installs its own version of DOS (7.1) and you should be able to select to boot into command-prompt only mode during startup. This is effectively "pure DOS" as no Windows drivers are loaded, to my knowledge. Knowing this to be the case, I don't see why it'd be necessary to boot here automatically, as it only saves a couple seconds at most.

Truthfully, I'm not familiar with this "DOS Starter Pack". I'll do some research on it so I can give you a more informed response. How familiar are you with DOS/Windows 9x? I typically avoid these kinds of repacks given my experience with working with these operating systems in the past. I've found it far more troublesome to try and work within someone else's parameters instead of just learning how the stock system works and tweaking it myself. Also, if all you're doing is stuff in DOS, shouldn't 6.22 suffice? The only reason why I wouldn't use it over the 7.1 included with 98 is because of the lack of FAT32 support, but 2 GBs is honestly more than enough for most people - trust me, DOS programs really don't take up a lot of space. You're gonna have more problems with memory management more than anything, as games tend to have specific needs as to whether or not they need stuff like EMM386, for instance, and memory management in general was a tremendous pain in the ass in DOS.

In any case, it should be very straightforward to just install 6.22 and go from there. I know stuff like driver setup and whatnot can be a pain, but I genuinely believe you'll be better off learning unmodified DOS 6.22 in the long run. Anyone can read the basic instructions a repack provides, as the person who created it has already gone through and figured out the hard stuff that goes over some peoples' heads. However, the best way you are going to fully learn how to troubleshoot common problems and work around them yourself is by starting from scratch and learning the quirks yourself. A repack, while convenient, forgoes this need to learn, and I find that can be very troubling in the long run. It will take a long time, but it will be worth it - I can assure you. I still have a tremendous amount of respect for people that create these things, however, as hours of research go into creating them, and it opens the gate for people that are less familiar with these ancient operating environments - I just have a hard time recommending something them for a first timer, and they're ironically better suited for someone who already knows the basics of DOS. They'll have a much easier time troubleshooting common problems, when they arise, as they'll know what to look for.

Anyway, this is just my advice. People are welcome to disagree, and I won't hold it against them.

Reply 5 of 8, by RetroSonicHero

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I should also mention, as someone else pointed out, that you'll be much better off with an actual Sound Blaster ISA sound card for stuff like FM music. It's much better suited for DOS gaming, and I would honestly avoid PCI cards entirely, if possible for your setup. Just like theelf stated, PCI FM emulation in DOS truly is awful, and won't give you an accurate experience.

Reply 6 of 8, by Cursed Derp

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RetroSonicHero wrote on 2024-07-02, 00:56:

I should also mention, as someone else pointed out, that you'll be much better off with an actual Sound Blaster ISA sound card for stuff like FM music. It's much better suited for DOS gaming, and I would honestly avoid PCI cards entirely, if possible for your setup. Just like theelf stated, PCI FM emulation in DOS truly is awful, and won't give you an accurate experience.

I will look into a proper ISA card. I tend to use basic, shitty general midi for most games. Doom sounds like.. well, HELL in sound Blaster mode.

I am as smooth as a gravy train with flaming biscuit wheels.

Reply 7 of 8, by Cursed Derp

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RetroSonicHero wrote on 2024-07-02, 00:49:
What do you mean by "pure DOS"? Windows 98 SE installs its own version of DOS (7.1) and you should be able to select to boot int […]
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What do you mean by "pure DOS"? Windows 98 SE installs its own version of DOS (7.1) and you should be able to select to boot into command-prompt only mode during startup. This is effectively "pure DOS" as no Windows drivers are loaded, to my knowledge. Knowing this to be the case, I don't see why it'd be necessary to boot here automatically, as it only saves a couple seconds at most.

Truthfully, I'm not familiar with this "DOS Starter Pack". I'll do some research on it so I can give you a more informed response. How familiar are you with DOS/Windows 9x? I typically avoid these kinds of repacks given my experience with working with these operating systems in the past. I've found it far more troublesome to try and work within someone else's parameters instead of just learning how the stock system works and tweaking it myself. Also, if all you're doing is stuff in DOS, shouldn't 6.22 suffice? The only reason why I wouldn't use it over the 7.1 included with 98 is because of the lack of FAT32 support, but 2 GBs is honestly more than enough for most people - trust me, DOS programs really don't take up a lot of space. You're gonna have more problems with memory management more than anything, as games tend to have specific needs as to whether or not they need stuff like EMM386, for instance, and memory management in general was a tremendous pain in the ass in DOS.

In any case, it should be very straightforward to just install 6.22 and go from there. I know stuff like driver setup and whatnot can be a pain, but I genuinely believe you'll be better off learning unmodified DOS 6.22 in the long run. Anyone can read the basic instructions a repack provides, as the person who created it has already gone through and figured out the hard stuff that goes over some peoples' heads. However, the best way you are going to fully learn how to troubleshoot common problems and work around them yourself is by starting from scratch and learning the quirks yourself. A repack, while convenient, forgoes this need to learn, and I find that can be very troubling in the long run. It will take a long time, but it will be worth it - I can assure you. I still have a tremendous amount of respect for people that create these things, however, as hours of research go into creating them, and it opens the gate for people that are less familiar with these ancient operating environments - I just have a hard time recommending something them for a first timer, and they're ironically better suited for someone who already knows the basics of DOS. They'll have a much easier time troubleshooting common problems, when they arise, as they'll know what to look for.

Anyway, this is just my advice. People are welcome to disagree, and I won't hold it against them.

I'll see about installing DOS 6.22. Is there a way to create a boot menu to select between Windows and DOS? If that could work it might save me a good bit of trouble in several fields.

I am as smooth as a gravy train with flaming biscuit wheels.

Reply 8 of 8, by feda

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Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-07-02, 11:31:

I'll see about installing DOS 6.22. Is there a way to create a boot menu to select between Windows and DOS?

What for? If you want DOS, hit alt+f5 or f8 after post. If you want Windows, do nothing and let it boot.