jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-09, 11:01:

Hi thanks for replying I typed a:/f:1.2/u this time it worked as it tells me to insert a disk but when I do it try’s to format but doesn’t and then gives a error message I’ve sent a screenshot I’ve tried multiple disks and still the same error message

I still think you should give FDFORMAT a try. I've attached a ZIP archive to this post - download it, unpack. You seem to have a way to write to 3.5 floppy so that's where you can put it. Or directly on the target HDD. It should work when run form B: drive as well as C:

Run this command: FDFORMAT A: F120
(note spaces between FDFORMAT, A: and the F120 parameters)

Whatever it does, post a screenshot. Hopefully it will just work.

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-09, 11:30:

Hi I’ve checked the disks they were bought on eBay unopened as far as I know the media inside looks ok But I’m not 100 percent s […]
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kotel wrote on 2024-07-09, 11:12:

Check the floppies for physical damage.

Hi I’ve checked the disks they were bought on eBay unopened as far as I know the media inside looks ok
But I’m not 100 percent sure I do know that the disks I’m having problems with I’ve used in a program
Called disk image.com as I was trying to format them that way as well but there’s so many different settings in that program
That I’m not Shure if I did it right

Packages can get resealed. Can you post some photos of those floppies ?

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-09, 15:08:

I still think you should give FDFORMAT a try. I've attached a ZIP archive to this post - download it, unpack. You seem to have a […]
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jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-09, 11:01:

Hi thanks for replying I typed a:/f:1.2/u this time it worked as it tells me to insert a disk but when I do it try’s to format but doesn’t and then gives a error message I’ve sent a screenshot I’ve tried multiple disks and still the same error message

I still think you should give FDFORMAT a try. I've attached a ZIP archive to this post - download it, unpack. You seem to have a way to write to 3.5 floppy so that's where you can put it. Or directly on the target HDD. It should work when run form B: drive as well as C:

Run this command: FDFORMAT A: F120
(note spaces between FDFORMAT, A: and the F120 parameters)

Whatever it does, post a screenshot. Hopefully it will just work.

Hi thanks for the link I’ll definitely give it a go and let you know what happens

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-09, 15:08:

I still think you should give FDFORMAT a try. I've attached a ZIP archive to this post - download it, unpack. You seem to have a […]
Show full quote

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-09, 11:01:

Hi thanks for replying I typed a:/f:1.2/u this time it worked as it tells me to insert a disk but when I do it try’s to format but doesn’t and then gives a error message I’ve sent a screenshot I’ve tried multiple disks and still the same error message

I still think you should give FDFORMAT a try. I've attached a ZIP archive to this post - download it, unpack. You seem to have a way to write to 3.5 floppy so that's where you can put it. Or directly on the target HDD. It should work when run form B: drive as well as C:

Run this command: FDFORMAT A: F120
(note spaces between FDFORMAT, A: and the F120 parameters)

Whatever it does, post a screenshot. Hopefully it will just work.

Hi I’ve downloaded and put FDFORMAT on my c drive if I click on fdformat.exe it doesn’t do anything if I click on get boot.exe
I can then type anything and I typed what you said to type this is the screen I got Ive taken a screenshot of it for you

You may give VGA-Copy 6.25 a try.
https://downloads.zdnet.de/2557/vga-copy-de0ddl/

Note you need to load a disk into RAM using function keys. (Formfill function)
Then you can write/format those disks. (Write function)

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-11, 10:56:

Hi I’ve downloaded and put FDFORMAT on my c drive if I click on fdformat.exe it doesn’t do anything

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it doesn't know what to do without the parameteres. You need to give it the parameters, just like when you run FORMAT in the previous attempts. The difference is this is not a Microsoft program and is less stupid.

Let's say you put the folder in C: (so it's C:\FDFORMAT), this is what you should do:
- boot the system without Windows, or just exit Windows to command line
- change directory: type CD \FDFORMAT
- run the program: type FDFORMAT A: F120

You could also try running it from Windows command line window but it's better to use pure DOS, in case it's Windows that is somehow messing things up.

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-11, 11:27:

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it does […]
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jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-11, 10:56:

Hi I’ve downloaded and put FDFORMAT on my c drive if I click on fdformat.exe it doesn’t do anything

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it doesn't know what to do without the parameteres. You need to give it the parameters, just like when you run FORMAT in the previous attempts. The difference is this is not a Microsoft program and is less stupid.

Let's say you put the folder in C: (so it's C:\FDFORMAT), this is what you should do:
- boot the system without Windows, or just exit Windows to command line
- change directory: type CD \FDFORMAT
- run the program: type FDFORMAT A: F120

You could also try running it from Windows command line window but it's better to use pure DOS, in case it's Windows that is somehow messing things up.

Hi I’ve typed what u said to type it would not start but I typed cd fdformat18 instead that brought up the c:\fdform18 then I typed what you said to type witch was fdformat a:f120 then it brought this screen up Ive taken a screenshot of it this is while I was trying in native dos mode

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 12:24:

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-11, 11:27:

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it does […]
Show full quote

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-11, 10:56:

Hi I’ve downloaded and put FDFORMAT on my c drive if I click on fdformat.exe it doesn’t do anything

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it doesn't know what to do without the parameteres. You need to give it the parameters, just like when you run FORMAT in the previous attempts. The difference is this is not a Microsoft program and is less stupid.

Let's say you put the folder in C: (so it's C:\FDFORMAT), this is what you should do:
- boot the system without Windows, or just exit Windows to command line
- change directory: type CD \FDFORMAT
- run the program: type FDFORMAT A: F120

You could also try running it from Windows command line window but it's better to use pure DOS, in case it's Windows that is somehow messing things up.

Hi I’ve typed what u said to type it would not start but I typed cd fdformat18 instead that brought up the c:\fdform18 then I typed what you said to type witch was fdformat a:f120 then it brought this screen up Ive taken a screenshot of it this is while I was trying in native dos mode

I think you forgot to put a space between the colum and f120. It should look like "FDFORMAT A: F120". at least that's what I think.

kotel wrote on 2024-07-12, 12:41:

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 12:24:

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-11, 11:27:

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it does […]
Show full quote

FDFORMAT is command-line tool. You can't run it from Windows by clicking it - it will just close and do nothing, because it doesn't know what to do without the parameteres. You need to give it the parameters, just like when you run FORMAT in the previous attempts. The difference is this is not a Microsoft program and is less stupid.

Let's say you put the folder in C: (so it's C:\FDFORMAT), this is what you should do:
- boot the system without Windows, or just exit Windows to command line
- change directory: type CD \FDFORMAT
- run the program: type FDFORMAT A: F120

You could also try running it from Windows command line window but it's better to use pure DOS, in case it's Windows that is somehow messing things up.

Hi I’ve typed what u said to type it would not start but I typed cd fdformat18 instead that brought up the c:\fdform18 then I typed what you said to type witch was fdformat a:f120 then it brought this screen up Ive taken a screenshot of it this is while I was trying in native dos mode

I think you forgot to put a space between the colum and f120. It should look like "FDFORMAT A: F120". at least that's what I think.

Hi definitely worked this time the disk drive started and attempted something I had the disk in disk drive but it stopped and
Came up with a message so I think it attempted to format I’m guessing but wouldn’t finish formatting I’ve taken a screenshot of the message

Just a quick update I’ve had a look at the media of the disks that won’t format in the light it seems they all have what looks like moisture or marks on it they were brought on eBay supposedly new and unformatted but only one of them seems to format and the other 9 won’t the brand are called Nashua
The other pack of disks that I brought on eBay that won’t format they don’t seem to have a brand
On the box and disk so I’m thinking maybe I’ve just been unlucky and have brought a dud of
Both boxes of floppy’s

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 14:07:

Just a quick update I’ve had a look at the media of the disks that won’t format in the light it seems they all have what looks l […]
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Just a quick update I’ve had a look at the media of the disks that won’t format in the light it seems they all have what looks like moisture or marks on it they were brought on eBay supposedly new and unformatted but only one of them seems to format and the other 9 won’t the brand are called Nashua
The other pack of disks that I brought on eBay that won’t format they don’t seem to have a brand
On the box and disk so I’m thinking maybe I’ve just been unlucky and have brought a dud of
Both boxes of floppy’s

I hope You didn't left positive feedback 😀 😀 😀

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 14:07:

only one of them seems to format and the other 9 won’t the brand are called Nashua

Nashua isn't a big brand in floppies like Dysan for example but also not a no-name. I have some of their floppies, in fact used and bought cheap, and they all work. It's possible that your floppies have been very poorly stored and might be moldy or something. There is no way to tell from outside, even when the box seems to be factory sealed, how the floppies were stored and if they are any good.

It seems I gave you a German version of FDFORMAT by accident, I should've zipped my working folder with English version. Sorry about that. But from the screenshot I can see it was trying to format track 79 and then failed during verification step. It might be due to floppies being bad, but also it's possible the drive you have has some head damage, or the current switch is not working properly. Which might make the write very weak or not work at all, but it would not affect reads much. So before you assume the floppies are indeed bad you should test them with a different drive. Preferably one that is known to be good.

BTW can you make a photo or two of your floppies? The actual media out of the envelope, not the box. It is possible some ebay sellers repack old floppies into genuine boxes to look like they've never been used, but these might not even be HD floppies at all. Usually 5.25" HD floppies will not have that friction ring in the middle, unlike DD ones. Maxell is I think the only company that had those, and only on some early production.

EDIT: This is the English version of the FDFROMAT.EXE, you can replace it if you want.

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 14:07:

Just a quick update I’ve had a look at the media of the disks that won’t format in the light it seems they all have what looks like moisture or marks on it

If only someone had told you that it's not impossible that the whole pack is bad...

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-12, 14:56:

Nashua isn't a big brand in floppies like Dysan for example but also not a no-name. I have some of their floppies, in fact used […]
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jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-12, 14:07:

only one of them seems to format and the other 9 won’t the brand are called Nashua

Nashua isn't a big brand in floppies like Dysan for example but also not a no-name. I have some of their floppies, in fact used and bought cheap, and they all work. It's possible that your floppies have been very poorly stored and might be moldy or something. There is no way to tell from outside, even when the box seems to be factory sealed, how the floppies were stored and if they are any good.

It seems I gave you a German version of FDFORMAT by accident, I should've zipped my working folder with English version. Sorry about that. But from the screenshot I can see it was trying to format track 79 and then failed during verification step. It might be due to floppies being bad, but also it's possible the drive you have has some head damage, or the current switch is not working properly. Which might make the write very weak or not work at all, but it would not affect reads much. So before you assume the floppies are indeed bad you should test them with a different drive. Preferably one that is known to be good.

BTW can you make a photo or two of your floppies? The actual media out of the envelope, not the box. It is possible some ebay sellers repack old floppies into genuine boxes to look like they've never been used, but these might not even be HD floppies at all. Usually 5.25" HD floppies will not have that friction ring in the middle, unlike DD ones. Maxell is I think the only company that had those, and only on some early production.

EDIT: This is the English version of the FDFROMAT.EXE, you can replace it if you want.

Hi thanks for the English version or fdformat really appreciate it I’ve taken 2 photos of the different disks I have the photo
With the disk with white box is the no brand non of them format the other photo is of the Nashua brand with the box it
Came in only 1 disk from that pack formats the rest don’t

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-13, 06:57:

With the disk with white box is the no brand non of them format the other photo is of the Nashua brand with the box it
Came in only 1 disk from that pack formats the rest don’t

These disks don't have the ring I mentioned so you can be pretty sure they are HD and not repackaged DD floppies. I also don't see any obvious signs of surface damage - though it's not conclusive from just one photo and a small piece of the media surface visible.

I have some experience with moldy/dirty floppies and usually they do format, except with a lot of bad sectors, certainly nothing like 9 of 10 not being able to format at all. So I think this might be a problem with your drive (it could be both, poor media quality and bad drive). Something as simple as dirt that prevents the heads from clamping the media properly, or perhaps a head/IC damage I mentioned already.

So in the end I think you'll need to find another 5.25" drive to test these disks. Otherwise you can't be sure which is bad.

You can try try to format know good disks on both drives to rule out bad drives, at least partially.

kotel wrote on 2024-07-13, 10:18:

You can try try to format know good disks on both drives to rule out bad drives, at least partially.

Hi the drive I’m using formats one disk fine over an over again but all the rest won’t format so I’m thinking the disk drive is ok
But not 100 percent sure

Deunan wrote on 2024-07-13, 09:25:

These disks don't have the ring I mentioned so you can be pretty sure they are HD and not repackaged DD floppies. I also don't s […]
Show full quote

jude1977 wrote on 2024-07-13, 06:57:

With the disk with white box is the no brand non of them format the other photo is of the Nashua brand with the box it
Came in only 1 disk from that pack formats the rest don’t

These disks don't have the ring I mentioned so you can be pretty sure they are HD and not repackaged DD floppies. I also don't see any obvious signs of surface damage - though it's not conclusive from just one photo and a small piece of the media surface visible.

I have some experience with moldy/dirty floppies and usually they do format, except with a lot of bad sectors, certainly nothing like 9 of 10 not being able to format at all. So I think this might be a problem with your drive (it could be both, poor media quality and bad drive). Something as simple as dirt that prevents the heads from clamping the media properly, or perhaps a head/IC damage I mentioned already.

So in the end I think you'll need to find another 5.25" drive to test these disks. Otherwise you can't be sure which is bad.

Hi just received a nother 5.25 floppy drive I brought on eBay it’s a 1.4 like the other drives that I have anyway I’ve installed it
And the seller included two blank floppy disks I’ve formatted one and no problems at all then I tried the original floppy disks
That wouldn’t format and still won’t format exactly the same error message that I got when I tried with the other
Disks drives when I format on this new drive so I recon it’s definitely the disks that are the problem
Interesting the 2 disks that the seller sent me and have formatted ok are a verbatim brand so
Maybe there better brands of disk

Try to format those 2 disks on all of the floppy drives. That way we can rule out bad drives completely.

kotel wrote on 2024-07-13, 14:03:

Try to format those 2 disks on all of the floppy drives. That way we can rule out bad drives completely.

Hi I’ve done some more testing I’ve tried the 2 floppy disks that formated in the new drive I got I tried to format
Them both in the other 2 drives that wouldn’t format and the floppy disks would not format in them then put in
The new drive again and the 2 floppy disks format straight away so yes after testing I’ve found that the
Other 2 drives wouldn’t format the 2 disks and those same 2 disks format fine in the new drive
The only thing is the other floppy disks that I brought that wouldn’t format in the other 2 drives
Still won’t format in the new drive only the 2 new floppy disks that came with the new drive will format