Did a test fit of various hardware on the IMB200 motherboard:
I'm also thinking of swapping out the Diamond MX300 for a Turtle Beach Montego II. From what I've researched there shouldn't be any practical difference between the two.
Shponglefan wrote on 2024-08-11, 18:57:I'm also thinking of swapping out the Diamond MX300 for a Turtle Beach Montego II. From what I've researched there shouldn't be any practical difference between the two.
It may depend on whether your Montego II is a Dell OEM card or a retail one. I have the Dell version, and I encountered some crackling/popping in A3D games when using generic Aureal drivers like 2041 etc. To resolve this, I needed to download a specific driver version from Dell. I think I got it from one of the links in this thread where someone else described the same problem.
After installing the Dell drivers, those crackling/popping issues went away. Thief Gold and Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight are good test cases for this problem, especially when using headphones.
Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-08-12, 05:43:It may depend on whether your Montego II is a Dell OEM card or a retail one. I have the Dell version, and I encountered some crackling/popping in A3D games when using generic Aureal drivers like 2041 etc. To resolve this, I needed to download a specific driver version from Dell. I think I got it from one of the links in this thread where someone else described the same problem.
After installing the Dell drivers, those crackling/popping issues went away. Thief Gold and Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight are good test cases for this problem, especially when using headphones.
That's a wrinkle I hadn't anticipated. Do you know if there is a way to tell which cards are Dell OEM versions and which are the retail versions?
The card I have I had bought stand-alone (no retail packaging or anything), so I don't know which version it might be.
Shponglefan wrote on 2024-08-12, 14:44:That's a wrinkle I hadn't anticipated. Do you know if there is a way to tell which cards are Dell OEM versions and which are the retail versions?
I don't know of a sure fire way. Dell cards can have a white sticker with a part number on the back, but sometimes, it falls off due to the age of the card and/or improper storage. There's a picture of the Dell white sticker on this page of TheRetroWeb, though I think that's a Vortex 1. In any case, it's worth testing the card with the aforementioned games using Aureal's generic 2041 drivers. If you get crackling/popping, there's a good chance you have a Dell.
For Thief Gold in particular, this is super easy to check. Turn on Hardware Acceleration in the game's Sound Options, then go back to the main menu and hover the mouse cursor over the different entries there (Start New Game and such). A sound should play each time you hover over an entry. If you hear crackling/popping together with the intended sound, your card is affected. You may need to wear headphones to pick this up more easily.
Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-08-12, 14:59:I don't know of a sure fire way. Dell cards can have a white sticker with a part number on the back, but sometimes, it falls off due to the age of the card and/or improper storage. There's a picture of the Dell white sticker on this page of TheRetroWeb, though I think that's a Vortex 1. In any case, it's worth testing the card with the aforementioned games using Aureal's generic 2041 drivers. If you get crackling/popping, there's a good chance you have a Dell.
For Thief Gold in particular, this is super easy to check. Turn on Hardware Acceleration in the game's Sound Options, then go back to the main menu and hover the mouse cursor over the different entries there (Start New Game and such). A sound should play each time you hover over an entry. If you hear crackling/popping together with the intended sound, your card is affected. You may need to wear headphones to pick this up more easily.
The card I have does have a couple white stickers on the back. I compared to a few old Ebay listings for retail cards (i.e. ones that include a retail box) and they all have the same stickers. Couldn't tell any differences other than manufacture dates and serial numbers.
Per your advice, I'll have to test it in Windows and see how it goes.
(And I suppose I could always just stick with the Diamond MX300. One advantage that card still has is if I ever wanted to do quad-speaker setup, it has the extra audio jack.)
Shponglefan wrote on 2024-08-13, 01:36:The card I have does have a couple white stickers on the back. I compared to a few old Ebay listings for retail cards (i.e. ones that include a retail box) and they all have the same stickers. Couldn't tell any differences other than manufacture dates and serial numbers.
I think your card might be a Dell. The big white sticker near the bracket has a "DP/N 0005931D" marking which likely stands for "Dell Part Number".
But yeah, testing the card with Thief Gold would confirm it.
Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-08-13, 02:09:I think your card might be a Dell. The big white sticker near the bracket has a "DP/N 0005931D" marking which likely stands for "Dell Part Number".
But yeah, testing the card with Thief Gold would confirm it.
This got me curious, so I looked through all the Ebay listings I could and every single card has a sticker with a DP/N on it. Including the ones that come with retail boxes.
Is it possible Turtle Beach just used the same stickers for everything?
Shponglefan wrote on 2024-08-13, 12:20:Is it possible Turtle Beach just used the same stickers for everything?
No idea, but I have seen the DP/N marking on other Dell branded hardware from the mid to late 90s, such as their Virge and TNT2 cards.
Guess I'll find out when I get around to testing the Montego II card.
In the mean time, I've been some DOS sound card testing with the Orpheus II as I attempt to determine what hardware configuration I want.
One of thing I had hoped to solve was greater compatibility with the Gravis Ultrasound / Interwave component of the Orpheus II. With the previous DFI ITOX G7S620-N motherboard, it worked with Epic Megagames releases and tracker software like Scream Tracker 3 and Impulse Tracker. But other games like Doom, Duke 3D, Descent and Crusader: No Remorse would fail to work with the GUS option.
Immediate testing with the IMB200 motherboard revealed the same level of compatibility. Epic Megagames releases worked, but not the other games. The Descent setup program in particular complains about not being able to load patches upon startup.
I confirmed this wasn't a software installation issue. If I transplant the same CF card with the same DOS install and configuration to a Socket 7 system, everything works fine. I also tested this with a regular GUS PnP and had the same issues. I even tried throttling the Pentium 4 system, but to no avail.
After doing some research, I came across this thread where another person ran into incompatibility with a GUS PnP and a Pentium III motherboard which used an ITE8888 bridge chip: [SOLVED, sort of] Doom and doom 2 freeze at "calling DMX_Init" with GUS PnP (ITE 8888 bridge)
It looks like there is some fundamental incompatibility either to do with the ISA bridge chip or some other aspect of these motherboards. On the plus side, it does work with the games I care about and music tracker software. I can live without support in other games, since I have both the Orpheus II's Crystal chip and the AWE64 to provide other sound options.
On another note, during testing I noticed the BIOS of the IMB200 offers slightly more options to reserve IRQs. The DFI motherboard didn't include IRQ3 or 4, whereas the IMB200's BIOS allows them to be reserved.
Still trying to figure out how many IRQ options and DMA channels I want to reserve...
Did some testing of optical drives under DOS.
For the first test, I wanted to see if the LG DVD drive could be throttled under DOS. It turns out it doesn't work with CD BeQuiet.
After some research and experimenting, I found this TEAC CD-ROM driver in the Vogons driver library: http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=1457&menustate=0
This driver includes a speed control option which worked perfectly. I used the /S:4 parameter to throttle the drive and it was completely silent.
My original plan was to use the LG DVD drive in conjunction with an older CD-ROM drive like a 4x to 8x Mitsumi. Unfortunately I couldn't get either of the Mitsumi drives to work. They didn't work with the TEAC driver, resulting in a system lockup. I tried them with the OAK driver, and while they were detected, they wouldn't read any disks. I'm sure if the drives are at fault or if it's some incompatibility with the IDE controller, cable, or something else.
Instead, I looked for a drive that would also work the TEAC driver. Most of my drives worked with the driver, but not with the speed control parameter. The only one that did work was a Samsung CD-RW SW-248. Thus, I think this will be my drive pairing:
I did some further testing of the TEAC driver and discovered it can also be set to use only a single drive at a time. This isn't well documented, but the /P parameter can accept "P-M" for master and "P-S" for slave.
LG DVD (Primary Master):
DEVICE=C:\CDROM\TEAC_CDI.SYS /D:MSCD001 /S:4 /P:P-M
Samsung CD-RW (Primary Slave):
DEVICE=C:\CDROM\TEAC_CDI.SYS /D:MSCD001 /S:4 /P:P-S
Since both drives can be nicely throttled, this resolves the issue of needing to use CD audio from only one drive under DOS.
Instead my plan is to configure DOS to pair a sound card with an optical drive. Then using a DOS boot menu, I can just pick which sound card and drive combo I want to use. Using only a single drive at a time will also make game management easier since all games can be configured for the same drive letter.
And since MPU-401 playback from the Orpheus II doesn't depend on the Orpheus driver, I can still get General MIDI support while using either sound card for digital audio.
After thinking I had my optical drives sorted, fate just decided otherwise.
First, the LG DVD drive stopped working. I booted up my system and the drive immediately ejected. Furthermore, it would no longer close either by pressing the button or nudging the tray.
In both cases, the motor kicks in but it's still trying to eject the tray rather than retract it.
I disassembled the drive, but couldn't find any obvious mechanical faults. Nothing seemed broken, no loose bits or anything like that.
Reassembling the drive, I was able to get it to power up without ejecting. Everything seemed normal, including the ejection process. But once the drive tray was ejected, it again would no longer retract.
I tried troubleshooting this for awhile, but no matter what the motor would never spin in the opposite direction. Pressing the button always causes the motor to eject the tray, even if it's already open.
Putting that aside, I decided to do some more testing with the Samsung CD-RW drive and that's when I ran into another problem. I had previously tested this drive with the TEAC driver for speed throttling. And that works... but only for data. Once I tried testing with CD-audio and the drive would fully spin up, sounding like a vaccuum cleaner in the process. This included mixed media CDs as well as regular audio CDs.
I have no idea why it throttles when reading data, but not with CD audio. Unfortunately that rules out this drive for use, since CD audio is a big reason I want optical drives in the first place.
Now I'm back to square one trying to sort out what optical drives to use with this build. 😒
I've had similar eject problems with two different CD drives on an IMB200 motherboard. I think it's the motherboard.