VOGONS


First post, by Tevian

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

The title may be a little bit of clickbait, but this very well could be the world's smallest V2 SLI setup. If it worked...
No longer clickbait! This is the World's smallest V2 SLI setup!

Let's start with the hardware. This is a (pcisa-c400r-rs-r20) half-sized single-board computer running a Celeron Mobile 400 Mhz. It's using a compatible (IP-4S2-RS-R40) backplane with 2 PCI slots + 1 ISA slot. The edge connector is PISA standard and carries both ISA and PCI pinouts. The SBC has a CF card slot so I can reduce the footprint by excluding the hard drive. Using the built-in AGP graphics and the 2 x Voodoo 2's, this makes for a tiny but fully capable machine.

The attachment Mini Brick.jpg is no longer available
The attachment pcisa-c400r-rs-r20.jpg is no longer available

So let's get to the issue. While I can get one Voodoo 2 to work in either slot, I can't get both to work in SLI. Both show up in the device manager correctly and both register in the Voodoo display properties window. If I disable SLI then games like Quake seem to run fine on one card while both are still installed. I've tried a few different versions of the 3dfx drivers but the result is always the same. These Voodoo 2's are definitely working as I've tested both on my socket 7 system.

This is what it looks like when SLI is on...

The attachment 20240824_000341.jpg is no longer available

As I said, one card in either slot works fine. I tried something else by installing an ATI PCI graphics card + Voodoo 2 on the backplane. Interestingly, the ATI card works fine in either slot, but when adding the Voodoo 2, it only works if the ATI card is in slot 1. (Slot 1 is the furthest from the SBC). And, the Voodoo 2 shows up in the device manager in either case but only works in Quake when the ATI is in the first position.

The attachment 20240824_010348.jpg is no longer available

I'm kinda stumped and my attention is now turning to the backplane for compatibility reasons.

The attachment IP-4S2-RS-R40.jpg is no longer available

This is a fully passive backplane using the SBC Northbridge. I'm a little lacking in information here, but the PISA spec as well as the backplane itself lists a hardware PCI address for each slot. It's printed on the PCB but goes like this.

DEVICE|IDSLE|REQ#|GNT#|INT#
PCI1|AD19|0|0|A,B,C,D
PCI2|AD20|1|1|D,A,B,C

The PDF for the PISA spec is here. https://www.kontron.com/download/download?fil … f&product=87221

On section 4.4 Interrupt-Routing on page 16, it clarifies the hardware PCI routing. This doesn't seem to be adjustable and is a property of the physical wiring of the PCI bus on the backplane.

Is it possible this SBC is not capable of handling traffic between both PCI slots at the same time? How could I test this out? Is there some kind of software I can use to check this?

It's strange because a single Voodoo 2 works fine in either slot as well as using an additional graphics card plus one Voodoo 2. However, only if the ATI is in the first slot, otherwise I get a black screen on the Voodoo but the system is still working.

Since either slot can use one Voodoo 2 I have to assume the physical wiring is capable of accessing them. And with two installed, everything appears normal like the device manager and system info on the display window. Once the game starts, one card seems to only render 1/2 of the screen and is offset horribly. I'm not sure it's a resource conflict as the Voodoo 2's don't use an IRQ... I've played with some of the BIOS settings but got the same results which neither advanced nor degraded things. Both Voodoo 2's also show in the BIOS POST screen as "multimedia devices". This is a good sign, but something else is causing an issue when the cards are rendering something.

Any and all advice is welcome. Whether this problem is solved may determine the fate of another project I'm working on so any help would be greatly appreciated.

Last edited by Tevian on 2024-08-25, 00:43. Edited 2 times in total.

Reply 1 of 8, by MikeSG

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Do they work in SLI on your socket 7 system? Same bridge, same drivers, etc? Can you rule out everything except the backplane?

Reply 2 of 8, by rasz_pl

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

The easiest thing to try would be beefing up power supply to inner PCI slot.
What about ati pci card and something else like sata controller?
PCI is a very weird bus, the signals on it are reflected https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflected-wave_switching so its important how PCB is laid out. Its possible you are hitting a corner case.

https://github.com/raszpl/FIC-486-GAC-2-Cache-Module for AT&T Globalyst
https://github.com/raszpl/386RC-16 memory board
https://github.com/raszpl/440BX Reference Design adapted to Kicad
https://github.com/raszpl/Zenith_ZBIOS MFM-300 Monitor

Reply 3 of 8, by Tevian

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

IT WORKS!!!! And now the title fits! World's smallest Voodoo 2 SLI setup!

Thx @MikeSG and @rasz_pl. This was the motivation I needed to re-examine the physicals. I did, and I'm happy to say it works!!! 😎

It was so strange that only one card worked at a time. I started by checking the 5V power rails. 5V rail is at 5.09V with both cards in and drops to 4.7V fully booted. Voltage drops below 4.6V when both cards are rendering. This seemed a little low so I tapped an additional 5V lead to the power plane at the rear of the PCI slots. This brought the voltage sag back to 4.8V with both cards rendering. The voltage sag happened with two different power supplies so this might be a weak point in the backplane design. Maybe they didn't think such power-heavy cards would be used there.

The attachment 20240824_172111.jpg is no longer available

This alone didn't work, so I started probing the signals on the SLI bridge. Curiously, the low clock looked fine but the high clock peak to peak was almost half. I can't remember if that was normal so I soldered up another SLI bridge. And... That was it!!! I should have tried a ribbon to double-check, and that bridge is not one I use in my main socket 7 system but I was 99% sure I tested that piece in the other system. The one I normally use has the fans and can't fit on this system. Either way, the now suspect faulty bridge is going in the trash.

The attachment 20240824_171648.jpg is no longer available

Benchmarks look good and screen is clean! 😂 👍👍👍👍

The attachment 20240824_171713.jpg is no longer available

Thx for the advice... Feel kind of stupid I didn't check further! 🙄 Now this is a proof of concept, the other project has a better chance of working out.

Thx again!

Reply 4 of 8, by Tevian

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
The attachment 20240824_183953.jpg is no longer available
The attachment 20240824_183942.jpg is no longer available

Ya! Going to work on building a proper case but here are a few more shots. So cute!

2 X Voodoo 2's
PISA SBC Celeron 400 Mhz
AWE64 ISA sound card

Reply 5 of 8, by rasz_pl

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

Hmm, so why didnt single voodoo work with ATI in different slot before? weird. Personally I would move that wire to the back and solder directly between PCI and ATX pins.
Probably could use some airflow pushing from the back and few holes between Voodoo brackets to let air escape.

https://github.com/raszpl/FIC-486-GAC-2-Cache-Module for AT&T Globalyst
https://github.com/raszpl/386RC-16 memory board
https://github.com/raszpl/440BX Reference Design adapted to Kicad
https://github.com/raszpl/Zenith_ZBIOS MFM-300 Monitor

Reply 6 of 8, by Tevian

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
rasz_pl wrote on 2024-08-25, 02:49:

Hmm, so why didnt single voodoo work with ATI in different slot before? weird. Personally I would move that wire to the back and solder directly between PCI and ATX pins.
Probably could use some airflow pushing from the back and few holes between Voodoo brackets to let air escape.

Ya, I have no explanation why the ATI + Voodoo 2 doesn't work when the ATI is in slot 2. I just rechecked a moment ago and it still doesn't work that way. The ATI must be in slot 1! The system still works, I get game sounds and everything but no screen. Oh, well. That's not the config I was aiming for so no bother. I'm just happy the SLI works now.

Air flow will be important for sure. With a smallish enclosure, those Voodoo2's will get pretty warm! 😎

Reply 7 of 8, by H3nrik V!

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

It looks just like you could throw an 80mm fan in the end of that and have a cooling tunnel setup 😎

If it's dual it's kind of cool ... 😎

--- GA586DX --- P2B-DS --- BP6 ---

Please use the "quote" option if asking questions to what I write - it will really up the chances of me noticing 😀

Reply 8 of 8, by G-X

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Awesome setup! Looks very cool. Glad to hear you figured out the problem.