VOGONS


First post, by Cyanopsis

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I got this Miro Highscore Voodoo 1 card that is being recognized by Win98 including driver installation. So far so good. But whenever I try to initialize it (the VGA flip I guess), the computer completely hangs. The card is runnig quite hot, even when it's not in use. Running cold boot into DOS, I am able to get a complete reading using MOJO.EXE but let's say I go into Windows and start something 3dfx related (Valley of RA), the computer hangs and if I then boot back to DOS afterwards, it also hangs on MOJO.EXE. This feels hardware related, no?

I have done visual inspection and cleared out some pins on the 3dfx chips that looked a little bent towards eachother, but nothing changed. Haven't done any measurements. The system hangs on Direct3d setup, tech demos, Windows screen settings associated with 3dfx. The card is coupled with a pretty basic S3 Virge card and loop cable.

Is there any other diagnostics that could pin point the problem more clearly? I interpret the error being associated with the monitor VGA flip. Any PCI settings to look at? The fact that the card runs hot even when just idling from start makes me suspicious however. Thanks!

Reply 2 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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Shponglefan wrote on 2024-10-31, 10:57:

What are the specs of the system you are using it with? The Voodoo 1 is speed sensitive, so trying to use it in too fast a system can cause it to freeze up.

Yeah, I got that! It's a AMD K6-2 400mhz running at 300 (100x3). According to reports, that shouldn't be a problem.

Reply 3 of 14, by zwrr

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Same motherboard as the Canopus Pure3D, but what's here?

The attachment 1.png is no longer available
The attachment 2.png is no longer available

Pentium MMX233, Zida TX98-3D, 64MB, Riva 128, Aztech Waverider Pro 32-3D, HardMPU-wt


K6-III+550, FIC VA-503+, 256MB, Voodoo3 2000, Creative AWE32, HardMPU-wt


Tualatin-1.4G, QDI A10BM, 512MB, G400, Voodoo2 SLI, Creative AWE64

Reply 4 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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zwrr wrote on 2024-10-31, 11:44:

Same motherboard as the Canopus Pure3D, but what's here?

Yes, I already noticed. Its the same here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/common … oHISCORE_3D.jpg and here: http://users.atw.hu/3dfxcollection/cards/pic_ … _miro_front.jpg and here: http://www.tdfx.de/pic/hiscore3d_07b.JPG

Reply 5 of 14, by myne

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Looks like there's dried residue around c155.
Given the card a good wash at all?

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Reply 7 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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myne wrote on 2024-10-31, 12:39:

Looks like there's dried residue around c155.
Given the card a good wash at all?

I think it was mostly the camera reflection. Looks good!

Reply 8 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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Some further troubleshooting:
Started doing testing solely on TOMB3DEM.
The system hangs. Or at least my monitor is getting a signal any more.
MOJO always work from cold boot and sometimes after reseting. If the system hangs on MOJO, a shutdown always revives it.
Have fiddled with a few BIOS options related to either graphics or PCI. No difference, but most of these settings are really hard o grasp.¨
Connected seperate monitors for S3 Virge and 3dfx. The S3 one goes black but doesnt lose signal. The 3dfx one never gets a signal.
The above makes me think the systems doesn't completely hang.
Another clue is that I'm able to get a keyboard response when I'm running the Valley of Ra demo. The screen goes black as always, but if i press enter, there's hdd activity and I'm able to alt+f4 myself to boot (not exit back to windows). So maybe not complete system hang?
It's like right when the VGA switch occurs.

Is it possible to log what happens right up to that point when starting TOMB3DEM?

Reply 9 of 14, by rasz_pl

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Cyanopsis wrote on 2024-10-31, 21:46:

MOJO always work from cold boot and sometimes after reseting. If the system hangs on MOJO, a shutdown always revives it.

sounds like bad solder joints, very common on Voodoo cards, requires reflowing solder on app big chips and making sure all pins are solidly connected and you left no shorts

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Reply 11 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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Matchstick wrote on 2024-11-01, 02:57:

I recommend that you go watch Bits und Bolts series of videos on 3DFX cards, he goes through a whole series of repairs
And has documented troubleshooting tools

https://www.youtube.com/@bitsundbolts/search?query=3dfx

Watched one of the videos that had a similar problem and what he did was reflowing the 3dfx chips. Pretty advanced stuff but using my kid's microscope (not optimal in any way) I managed to actually do it. The joints were pretty crumbly I must say. Unfortunately, that didn't help with anything. I might reflow the switching chip but doing every single resistor or cap is probably something I wouldn't do unless I had a better understanding of the problem.

I'm thinking of trying it on another motherboard just to get that out of the way.

Reply 12 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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I've spent another day with this 3dfx board with no luck. I've checked it with my scope and reflowed every pin on both the TMU and FBI chips. They are good. Board gets detected in Windows but the computer hangs every time it gets initialized, DOS or WIN.

The thing is this: MOJO returns no errors on cold boot. And I mean COLD boot with a room temperature card. The card gets hot very fast without me using it, especially the chrontel ch7002 chip, which is the encoder chip for TV out (not used). Other components get warm also, but not like burning hot as the chrontel chip. Mem chips are cold.

So cold boot directy to DOS and then Mojo = no issues.
Wait a minute and start Mojo again or launch TOMB3DEM = computer hangs.
Wait for card too cool off = start all over

Apart from the main chips, I've checked most SMDs with a multimeter and they look fine. I have examined most traces for breaks. Any thoughts on where to look? What could make a PCB like this getting hot without it being used? A short somewhere? Faulty chip?

Reply 13 of 14, by weedeewee

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Shponglefan wrote on 2024-10-31, 12:42:
zwrr wrote on 2024-10-31, 11:44:

Same motherboard as the Canopus Pure3D, but what's here?

The attachment 2.png is no longer available

Looks like a bodge transistor?

Cyanopsis ?

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Reply 14 of 14, by Cyanopsis

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weedeewee wrote on 2024-12-27, 13:07:

Cyanopsis ?

Yes, it's the same board. Different name for Europe. I'm guessing the transistor was added on later revisions. I can see the same here: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/common … oHISCORE_3D.jpg and here: http://users.atw.hu/3dfxcollection/cards/pic_ … _miro_front.jpg

The pins on the mosfet also runs very hot.