VOGONS


First post, by VLIW

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VLIW processors in desktop computers: a (very) long story of alternative processor architecture with brief fame more than 20 years ago.

Thin-clients and nettop computers were all the rage in the 2000s with mobile or embedded processors and operating systems. A few years earlier in the late 1990s, Transmeta set out with much secrecy to revolutionize PC processors. Based on a simplified VLIW processor core, Transmeta Crusoe CPUs translated ("morphed") x86 in real time, promising higher efficiency with simpler cores. In the real world, TMS processors ended up in embedded and mobile applications.

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One specimen using Transmeta Crusoe CPUs is the Siemens Futro S220, an ultra small fanless thin-client. Released in 2004 with Windows XP embedded on 128MB flash, Futros were mostly used in the corporate regulated world. Never a fan of thinclients myself (embedded Windows, ugh), they are quite cheap nowadays.

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Processor: TMS5800 800MHz
Cache: 128KB L1 + 512KB L2
Chipset: VIA VT1211
RAM: one SODIMM slot, 512MB
Storage: one CF slot (8 GB), one IDE
Video: SiS315E onboard, DX7 (on AGP?)
Sound: VIA VT8233
Expansion: one PCI

This will be my small Windows 98 box, currently installing 98SE on the 8GB internal CF. Super quiet system, I am curious about the real world performance, prior mentions were "like a Katmai" or "more like a K6 200MHz". Hoping to play a few 2D games on it but will try out the SIS315E for simple 3D stuff too.

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NB: VLIW processing made a comeback in contemporary GPU designs.

Info and drivers: https://www.toughdev.com/content/2022/12/fuji … 10-thin-client/
Futro S200 + Windows 3.1: https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/Futro/s200/

Reply 1 of 13, by Jo22

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I like the Transmeta processors! ^^
They're more comfortable with clean 32-Bit code, maybe, though. Like the Pentium Pro is.
So Windows Me might be worth a try. Or Windows 98SE with NUSB or inofficial Service Pack.
Both used WDM drivers and used parts of code from Windows 2000.
Normal Windows 95/98 was a big intermix of 16-/32-Bit code.
Speaking under correction here, of course.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 2 of 13, by myne

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Good luck with it.
Personally I would have recommended one of these if you could find one.
https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t5720/

Mine was a decent little 9x box with a voodoo1. Sold now.

I built:
Convert old ASUS ASC boardviews to KICAD PCB!
Re: A comprehensive guide to install and play MechWarrior 2 on new versions on Windows.
Dos+Windows 3.11+tcp+vbe_svga auto-install iso template
Script to backup Win9x\ME drivers from a working install
Re: The thing no one asked for: KICAD 440bx reference schematic

Reply 4 of 13, by myne

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It's literally an Athlon XP at 1ghz.

Which means all the Athlon XP performance with clock speed being the only compromise.
Plenty enough for the vast majority of 9X titles that will run acceptably on a PCI gpu.

I built:
Convert old ASUS ASC boardviews to KICAD PCB!
Re: A comprehensive guide to install and play MechWarrior 2 on new versions on Windows.
Dos+Windows 3.11+tcp+vbe_svga auto-install iso template
Script to backup Win9x\ME drivers from a working install
Re: The thing no one asked for: KICAD 440bx reference schematic

Reply 5 of 13, by Jo22

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myne wrote on 2024-10-21, 03:43:

It's literally an Athlon XP at 1ghz.

Which means all the Athlon XP performance with clock speed being the only compromise.
Plenty enough for the vast majority of 9X titles that will run acceptably on a PCI gpu.

I went for a Transmeta Crusoe based thin client. It's nice for those visual novel games, for example.
They're from the 90s, too, but focus on 2D graphics. Win32(s) used to be quite popular as an emerging platform in their home country.

Re: How to install DX7 but there is limited space?

Early demos like the ATI dawning demo run, too.
Here's a video of the demo (not by me): https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Scyf-HvUuZ4

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 6 of 13, by VLIW

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Windows 98SE installed fine on the Futro S220, now on 8 GB compact flash.
Drivers worked from the archive fujitsu_S210_drivers.zip:
6103v2_7 for network
SiS315e for video
Vinyl_V700b for sound

It is supposed to be operated standing -- it does get warm as there is no active cooling.
Had my first BSOD already, how I missed W98!

Are there short PCI video adapters that would be an improvement over the SiS315E?

Reply 7 of 13, by Falco

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If you want to keep Windows 98 support, I think the fastest low profile PCI card would be a Geforce 6200. The SiS 315E couldn't hold a candle to it.

There were also a number of Geforce4 MX and GeforceFX cards with low profile PCI variants, those still are much faster than the 315E.

The problem with any of these is going to be compatibility. No Transmeta processor is 100% x86 compatible, which may cause problems with the option ROMs on these potential video cards.

Reply 8 of 13, by VLIW

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The system actually needs a full-height but short PCI adapter, not low profile.
Any recommendations on *short* PCI cards?

Reply 9 of 13, by Falco

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Short and low profile Geforce 6200 256MB Shipping is a bit of a killer though:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/176165878801

Low profile is a bit of a problem, but you can make an I/O plate pretty easily.

Reply 10 of 13, by Falco

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I just noticed when looking at that card again that it has at least one bulgy cap that needs to be replaced.

Reply 11 of 13, by VLIW

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Card actually looks interesting but from one of the seller's reviews: "in the tight slot in a small profile system it overheats in a few minutes and locks up."
That might be a problem with the Futro thin client, there is no active cooling at all

Reply 12 of 13, by Falco

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The card has a 2 pin fan header where a fan can be added.

Reply 13 of 13, by VLIW

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Got USB 2.0 working on the Futro S200.

Futro S200 have a VIA VT8235 chipset/southbridge with USB 2.0 ports. I used nusb36e.exe from Phils website. Installed the USB driver according to the instructions and now a USB 2.0 stick w/ compact flash works like a breeze.