VOGONS


First post, by ERX400

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Hi all,

I recently picked up an original Adlib 1987 card.
Once installed in my test setup I noticed some faint smoke coming off the back of the board.
Shutting everything down & taking it out for inspection I found a burnt trace on the backside of the board as pictured. I repaired the trace but when testing again my PC won’t power on with the card inserted, Any ideas on how to repair this?

Reply 1 of 14, by zuldan

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Can you post a full (high res) picture of the card? Would be good to see what the trace is connected to. Possibly a shorted capacitor.

Reply 2 of 14, by ERX400

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Hope these are clear enough

Reply 3 of 14, by zuldan

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Looks like that trace is connected to one of these tantalum’s. Have you got a multimeter?

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Reply 4 of 14, by ERX400

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Yes

Reply 5 of 14, by zuldan

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ERX400 wrote on 2024-12-18, 11:52:

Yes

Ok check to see if there is continuity between the positive and negative of the tantalum’s

Reply 6 of 14, by Tiido

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That's the +12V line and it is definitely burned because of a shorted tantalum capacitor, circled by Zuldan.

Trace itself should be easy to fix, you can use a strand of wire to solder over the damaged area.
All 6 tantalum capacitors on the board should be replaced, to avoid similar problems from appearing again.

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Reply 7 of 14, by zuldan

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100% agree with Tiido. The tantalum’s should always be replaced before powering on these old cards. Learnt my lesson the hard way Smoke coming from PAS16 [FIXED]

Reply 8 of 14, by ERX400

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Tested those caps & three on that line test as bad.
I can replace the other caps as mentioned also, What are the values of those? Thanks for your help guys

Reply 9 of 14, by ERX400

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Removed the 10uf 16v cap & the short is gone

Reply 10 of 14, by ERX400

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This is the correct part? Mouser part no 581-TAP106M025CRW

Reply 11 of 14, by Benedikt

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Aside from the obvious voltage rating discrepancy - 25V vs. the original 16V - that part looks perfectly adequate.
It is probably even better than the original specifically because of the higher voltage rating, but might therefore also be a little bit bigger.

Reply 12 of 14, by Jo22

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Benedikt wrote on 2024-12-18, 19:32:

Aside from the obvious voltage rating discrepancy - 25V vs. the original 16V - that part looks perfectly adequate.
It is probably even better than the original specifically because of the higher voltage rating, but might therefore also be a little bit bigger.

I think the same. Back in the 70s and 80s it was good practice to oversize the capacitor, rating wise (voltage).

The idea was that a bigger capacitor would be less stressen than a small one.
A small one would (6v, 16v) always be running at near maximum specs by contrast (5v, 12v operation voltage).

Using an overkill capacitor would have cost more money and take up more size maybe, but it didn't require any meaningful maintenance on long run.
A big capacitor could be installed and forgotten, working for ages.
Heat development would be much lower, also because of the big size.

But that was in a time when we still had linear voltage regulators and conventional power supplies.
Thing's like ESR didn't matter yet. A big ESR was a non-issue in practice.

Back then, various smoothing caps had been generously installed, as well.
There were three values that had been used often, I think: 100 nF, 1 µF, 10 µF.
Maybe 10 nF, too, but often it was a bit too little to have any noticeable effect.
Combining them as individual caps was okay, too, in order to block ripple and various RF signals from wandering across the circuit.

Edit: I forgot to mention. The values used in practice weren't chosen because of physics, but price.
There had been certain standard types of capacitors that were produced due to high demand.
That's why motherboards and expansion cards had used them.
The values chosen were more of an approximation of the ideal value than the ideal value itself.
That's why homebrew circuits or prototype boards had used different values sometimes, money didn't matter so much and correct values could be used.

That's why I'm so critical about mass production, also.
In my perceived reality, as a ham radio fan, most if not all commercial products have a lot left to be desired and must be "fixed" from very start.
For example, useful diodes, fuses and capacitors are often not populated on electronic PCBs.
They're left out, the markings of the missing parts can still be seen in the PCBs.

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Reply 13 of 14, by ERX400

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Replaced the 6x 10uf 16v caps & the card is working fine now

Reply 14 of 14, by zuldan

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ERX400 wrote on 2025-01-01, 03:28:

Replaced the 6x 10uf 16v caps & the card is working fine now

Great work. It’s a very special card. Glad you’ve brought it back to life.