Why don't you just use dosstart.bat (Exit to DOS) Windows shutdown-menu item, or a boot menu during start-up to choose to not start into Windows, but load DOS instead?

Is there a specific reason to use DOS 6.22 instead of ... I think it's 7.0 that's running underneath Win95?

edit: Also, welcome to the community. 25 years... that's impressive. 😀

Thank you for the reply.

With a fresh DOS 6.22 and Win95 install, the first time I hit F8 during boot up and choose "load previous version of dos" it rewrites by boot sector and will only boot to DOS 6.22 from then on.

I just remember having problems with some DOS games running in DOS Mode (Dos 7)

Originally had DOS and Windows on the same C: partition. Reinstalled with separate partitions C:\DOS and D:\Windows and same problem 🙁

I'm also pretty sure you can just use DOS7 for everything. At least I never heard of major stuff needing DOS 6.22 specifically

But if you really need it, there seems to be a guide https://rubenerd.com/dual-boot-windows-31-95/. Seems like Win95 Upgrade Edition is better for this

Yeah... and just to clarify, I wasn't talking about booting into DOS-mode by hitting F8 and then just choosing "Command prompt only". I meant setting up a proper bootmenu so that Windows won't load by default, and the system will optionally load all those DOS-mode drivers and utilities you need to run games, like in the old days. The other option would be to skip all that and proceed to Windows. It's really very easy to set up... or at least no harder than setting up DOS just the way you wanted it used to be.

Edit: The previously referenced dosstart.bat sort of does the same thing, but not really. It is used when the option Restart computer in MS-DOS mode is chosen from the Windows Shutdown-dialog after Windows is already running.

No real need for MS-DOS 6 if you have MS-DOS 7 with:

BootGUI=0
Logo=0

So DOS 7.0 and Dos mode (Win95) I am assuming is the same thing.

Can you run EMM386 and other memory managers under win95 dos mode? I had problems with games not running in dos mode back in the day due to lack of conventional memory and or expanded/extended memory . Also my GLIDE games slowed way down and often crashed.

Anyhow; maybe I wants so clear on what is happening.

Hitting F4 (Boot to previous version of MS-DOS) or F8 (Boot menu and selecting previous version of DOS) at startup causes irreversible changes to my boot record so only DOS6.22 loads from then on. I have to rebuild the boot record with Windows 95 startup disk if I want Windows back. Some reason the startup files are not being renamed *.dos, *.w40 or whatever they are called. Maybe I will try the DOS, Win3.1, Win95 Upgrade path and see if that works instead of DOS, Win95 OEM.

Umm...yes, you can.

Doombringer4u2nv wrote on 2024-12-26, 14:28:

So DOS 7.0 and Dos mode (Win95) I am assuming is the same thing. […]
Show full quote

So DOS 7.0 and Dos mode (Win95) I am assuming is the same thing.

Can you run EMM386 and other memory managers under win95 dos mode? I had problems with games not running in dos mode back in the day due to lack of conventional memory and or expanded/extended memory . Also my GLIDE games slowed way down and often crashed.

Anyhow; maybe I wants so clear on what is happening.

Hitting F4 (Boot to previous version of MS-DOS) or F8 (Boot menu and selecting previous version of DOS) at startup causes irreversible changes to my boot record so only DOS6.22 loads from then on. I have to rebuild the boot record with Windows 95 startup disk if I want Windows back. Some reason the startup files are not being renamed *.dos, *.w40 or whatever they are called. Maybe I will try the DOS, Win3.1, Win95 Upgrade path and see if that works instead of DOS, Win95 OEM.

Well, DOS 7.x and MS-DOS mode are sort of the same thing, but there are a couple of caveats.

First of all, I mostly run my DOS-based games from within Windows 95 (ie. I just launch a MS-DOS Prompt). This works so well most of the time, it doesn't really make sense to boot into DOS without Windows.

However, there are some games that don't like this. For those, you can create a Boot-menu that does not depend on swapping your boot files around. I'll steal from my own guide (Tips & Tricks-section):

How to start in command-line mode instead of GUI:
Edit the BOOTGUI line in msdos.sys to read BOOTGUI=0. That way your system will alway boot to DOS. Starting Windows will require entering the command 'win'.

How to create startup-menus using config.sys and autoexec.bat
To create a menu that results in different things happening based on your selection, you must edit both config.sys and autoexec.bat.

The [COMMON]-section defines items that are run regardless of menu selection, [menu]-section defines your choices and menu presentation. Each menu item must also have a corresponding section, under which the desired drivers etc. are placed. Here is a sample config.sys:

1[COMMON]
2files=40
3buffers=20
4lastdrive=x
5
6[menu]
7menuitem=TSRS, Load mouse, CD-ROM and audio drivers for DOS
8menuitem=NoTSRS, Don’t load DOS drivers (run Windows)
9menucolor=15,1 
10menudefault=NoTSRS,10
11
12[TSRS]
13DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
14DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\EMM386.EXE RAM
15DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:DVD
16
17[NoTSRS]
18

Note that the choices defined in config.sys persist in autoexec.bat as well, but the sections are distinguished with a colon, like :SELECTION-NAME , instead of brackets, or [SELECTION-NAME]. In autoexec.bat one must also take care to direct the execution of the commands from the desired selection to the end of the batch-file with GOTO, otherwise you'll end up running all the commands below the chosen section top-down regardless of what choice the user made in their menu.

Here is the matching autoexec.bat sample file:

1goto %config%
2
3:TSRS
4SMARTDRV.EXE /X /V
5LH MOUSE.EXE
6LH MSCDEX.EXE /D:DVD /D:CDRW /E /V /L:E
7C:\ESSAUDIO\ESSCFG.EXE /A:220 /I:7 /D:1 /B:330 /J:E
8C:\ESSAUDIO\ESSVOL.EXE /V:8 /L:0 /W:8 /M:0 /C:8 /S:8 /A:0
9rem /A:0 is the wavetable header volume!
10goto end
11
12:NoTSRS
13@echo Type ‘win’ to start Windows.
14
15:end

edit: So the above will create pretty simple boot menu with two options. One option loads everything you need to game in DOS, while the other loads nothing, which is better for if you just want to start Windows.

edit2: ...and doing this also allows you to skip installing DOS 6, you can just install Windows 95 and use DOS 7, which is included.

Thanks for your extended efforts posting to help.

[/quote]

How to start in command-line mode instead of GUI:
Edit the BOOTGUI line in msdos.sys to read BOOTGUI=0. That way your system will always boot to DOS. Starting Windows will require entering the command 'win'.

[/quote]

So i tried this as well and when I type 'win' I get the warning changing boot record please 'Y' to proceed. Hitting 'Y' loads windows 95 but from then on I can not get back to dos 6.22. Its strange. I never remember this happening years ago. I will try the my prior stated window upgrade path and if that doesn't work out I guess I will just see how windows "dos" works out.

Thanks again.
JD

Doombringer4u2nv wrote on 2024-12-26, 14:28:

Maybe I will try the DOS, Win3.1, Win95 Upgrade path and see if that works instead of DOS, Win95 OEM.

That may be a good idea indeed.
OEM versions are generally supposed to be preinstalled on virgin machines.
If you want it to properly co-exist with a previous OS, you better use the UPGRADE version.

That's correct.

Doombringer4u2nv wrote on 2024-12-26, 14:28:

So DOS 7.0 and Dos mode (Win95) I am assuming is the same thing. […]
Show full quote

So DOS 7.0 and Dos mode (Win95) I am assuming is the same thing.

Can you run EMM386 and other memory managers under win95 dos mode? I had problems with games not running in dos mode back in the day due to lack of conventional memory and or expanded/extended memory . Also my GLIDE games slowed way down and often crashed.

Anyhow; maybe I wants so clear on what is happening.

Hitting F4 (Boot to previous version of MS-DOS) or F8 (Boot menu and selecting previous version of DOS) at startup causes irreversible changes to my boot record so only DOS6.22 loads from then on. I have to rebuild the boot record with Windows 95 startup disk if I want Windows back. Some reason the startup files are not being renamed *.dos, *.w40 or whatever they are called. Maybe I will try the DOS, Win3.1, Win95 Upgrade path and see if that works instead of DOS, Win95 OEM.

Dos 7 is the informal name of Dos that comes with Win9x (say if you booted into Safe Mode Command Line only"
It's got a few benefits over Dos 6.22 or earlier like supports long filename's and Fat32, as well as slightly better memory management (thanks to updated Emm386.exe) For Gaming it's rare to run into compatibility issues. Applications especially file management software can have issues though.

You also have a few options on how to play dos games.
- From within Windows itself, aka dos windows. Most convenient but has most compatibility issues
- Boot into Dos mode, aka Pure dos. This means Win9x is not loaded at all and the computer behaves like dos is the only installed OS.

You have a few options on how to boot into pure dos, you can edit the bootgui line like you already have.
Setup a shortcut within windows to command.com and select the force reboot checkbox.
Windows has a Shutdown to dos mode option ...but I've never had this work properly.

But you would still need to fix the strange boot record change issue. Quickest way would be with a Win95 boot disk typing sys a: c:
This would replace the boot files with standard windows 95 boot files, but completely kill the ability to boot into dos 6.22

Conversation reminds me of those lock/unlock commands in Win95 that use a blocklist of disk utilities to stop you from destroying all your long file names

" Quickest way would be with a Win95 boot disk typing sys a: c:"

I did that as one way to go back and froth from Dos 6.22 and Windows95.

So, I pulled out a OEM version of Windows 98 instead of 95 and started from scratch. Dos 6.22 then Win 98. Works fine now. I can now load the previous version of Dos (6.22) without it changing around my boot record permanently. Its was a mystery why it would not work with windows 95 and I am fine with that at my age. 😀

I would like to say thank you for the refresh in education and suggestions. It really helped me remember these things.

End of line.........

Just another data point for the use of the Dos which sits underneath Win98(se).

It's all I use now on my (>286) builds and I've yet to find a game which doesn't work correctly. I admit that I don't have every single installed, but some 300+ titles have been tested over the last 12 months and not one failed to work.

I suspect applications which hit the disk directly and don't know what FAT32 is may be more problematic though.

I suspect that certain copy-protection schemes may be incompatible with FAT32, and maybe even with MS-DOS 7.x running on a FAT16 partition.
But it's 2024, hopefully everything of value already got unprotected...

Doombringer4u2nv wrote on 2024-12-25, 15:48:

Hi!. Small Intro. My first forum post anywhere in maybe 25 years or so be nice. :) I built a computer I had in 1990's to pla […]
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Hi!. Small Intro. My first forum post anywhere in maybe 25 years or so be nice. 😀 I built a computer I had in 1990's to play around with my old games I keep. I put my original setup on the curb in around 2000 with a GUS, 2 VOODOO cards and a 21" CRT. Ouch! What with these prices today? Dang it!

I am trying to setup a basic dual boot 6.22/Win95 system.

I am having issues making it work correctly. Fresh format. Single FAT 2gb partition on a IDE drive. Installed DOS 6.22 first then Windows 95. After the first restart of Win95 I get a low level warning "confirm boot record change press Y" or something to that effect before it will start WIN95. If I hit yes it will not allow me to boot back into DOS6.22. I have to insert DOS 6.22 Setup Disk 1 and exit to C:>prompt and type SYS C: to get DOS 6.22 back but then I can not boot to WIN95. I can load one or the other but have to rebuild the boot record to do so. I would like some advice on how I can get this resolved. Thanks for any suggestions.

JD

You can do what I did and have DOS 6.22 and Win 3.1 on one hard drive and Windows 95 on another drive , then disable the drive you don't use in the bios drive manager and it should boot to the one that is enabled.

Its working so I am just keeping everything formatted as FAT. I thought about that. thxs.