bakemono wrote on 2025-08-09, 08:55:
Jo22 wrote on 2025-08-09, 07:32:
Edit: Here in Germany, many years ago, when XP was going EOL, there had been heated forum discussions about liability (our forums, not on Vogons).
Some voices demanded that users who're keeping XP online against all odds should be made personally liable for the damage that infected XP PCs would cause (bot nets etc).
The equivalent to tar and feather people, in short. 😉
So users should be liable for the negligence and/or malice of developers? This is indeed a fascinating scenario. Essentially, non experts would not be able to use the internet at all, without endemnity. It'd be like rewinding to pre- eternal september days. Of course this won't happen.
The point of view of the critics in these discussions was that XP machines and their users were a threat to society.
Keeping these malware magnets running, on the internet, was seen as plain unresponsible and selfish.
Like driving a car without brakes and seatbelts.
Or something along these lines, speaking under correction here.
This was early 2010s, so my memory is a bit vague about the exact wording in the forums and comment sections on various sites.
Being online with XP at the time, it made feel guilty at the time and I was annoyed by this point of view.
In retrospect, though, I agree with the criticism, though.
XP used to be great in comparison to 98 when new, but quickly took its place.
Also in terms of popularity and vulnerability.
XP also has big market share in Russia, China and third-world countries in general.
So its no wonder that criminals are used to using XP.
Over the long period of time it was the leading Windows OS,
it has a large device driver library and runs on PCs that are assembled from cheap spareparts.
One of the biggest issues nowadays is that the default user account is the "administrator" and that unsigned drivers can easily being installed.
It makes hacking the OS so easy compared to other OSes.
Anyway, I've always like XP - still do.
But if I do surpress all my feelings and try to be entirely logical and reasonable, the XP and its variants aren’t any safe at all.
The world (internet) of 2025 simply is an extremely dangerous place, like a battlefield (IMHO).
Even Linux on the desktop is something to be questioned, eventually, maybe, considering its market share and the news about recent Linux malware.
AI will make these dangers even more serious.
Edit:
Directly exposing? Yes, but that was not safe for decades. Behind NAT and Firewall? Depends.
Hi! DSL or cable routers were the norm by 2010s here, it was long after dial-up.
We didn't really have cable modems without router functionality, these AVM Fritzbox devices did set sort of a standard over here.
In the US or so, plain cable/DSL modems were more common than here I assume.
- As in not letting XP directly touch the internet via TCP/IP, but use tunneling
- VM software that take exlusively control over ethernet port of XP host (making it unavailable to applications)
- using a dedicated hardware firewall (a commercial firewall or another PC, a Raspberry Pi etc)
IMHO, it's best to physically disconnect any Windows 98/XP machine from internet when leaving the room.
Just unplug the ethernet cable or remove the USB WiFi dongle.
It's a bit tedious to do each time, but it's safer and a matter of being responsible to others.
Edit: Please don't anyone get me wrong, it's likely okay to setup a vintage PC for gaming/hobby use.
I don’t mean to spoil anyone's fun here.
You'll likely notice if something very unusual happens.
The game might stutter when there's lot of background activity, the connection icon will flash when you're doing nothing and so on.
What I meant is leaving the PC being unattended for a longer time, connected to the internet. Without any supervision.
Because anything can happen when the PC OS runs with super user rights (as common on Windows).
User software (esprcially malware) could re-enable all network connections via Win32 API. On Vista+, the UAC would ask for permission, by contrast.
That's why I mentioned unplugging the cable, rather than disabling network connection via mouse click.
Just like some do physically "disable" their webcams using a shutter, tape or something similar. They have good reasons.
By the way: It's possible to spy on you through your wired pair of headphones.
Many soundcards can have their input/output jacks being re-mapped via included software.
So if software switches the mic and speaker jack, then the headphones' loudspeakers act as microphones.
No kidding. In general, you can use speakers similar to dynamic microphones.
Impedance and amplification are different, though, so it's not ideal.
(Another detail: Microphones are usually electret type, which speakers are not. However, soundcards do have microphone pre-amps which can compensate for weak input.)
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