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First post, by IntelInsidest

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Hello everyone!

I have a mid nineties Pentium 120MHz computer built by a system integrator. It has an ASUS P/I-AP55T motherboard with 256K of cache soldered to the board. L2 is enabled in bios setup and the physical jumper for selecting cache size is set correctly, but for some unknown reason post fails to detect any L2 cache. Running speedsys also shows no L2 present (there's a plateau for L1, but no second plateau where L2 should be).

I've heard about fake cache chips, but I always thought that concerns only DIP packaged memory chips. In my case the chips are 100 pin QFP's (Winbond W25P010AF-8). I'll attach an image of the chip configuration.

The motherboard is same as this: https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asus-p-i-ap55t

Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot further, or does this look like a case of faux chips?

Thanks!

Reply 1 of 6, by dominusprog

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Maybe the TAG chip is causing the issue. Remove it, spray some contact cleaner on the socket and put the chip back on.

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Reply 2 of 6, by Nexxen

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IntelInsidest wrote on 2025-09-22, 22:54:

Also check if all the legs of the PCISet chips are solid and soldered to pads, and cache chips too as you are at it.
Any cut traces on the back of the board.

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Reply 3 of 6, by Shponglefan

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I wouldn't suspect fake chips on an Asus board and not when the traces are in place for the cache.

I'd echo the suggestions above to check for continuity for all pins for the cache, as well as loose pins. You could also check voltages and make sure the chips are getting the appropriate voltage.

Perhaps also check any adjacent components (capacitors, resistors) for any signs of failure.

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Reply 4 of 6, by IntelInsidest

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Thanks for the suggestions!

I went through all the pins of the chips and everything seemed solid. The tag chip and its socket got a squirt of contact cleaner and quick brushie-brushie.

I took out my scope and open the data sheet for W25P010AF-8 and sure enough everything seems to be there. I/O and supply voltages have a solid 3.3V, host clock is present and even data I/O pins show some serial data. Same applies for both of the chips, but one difference I noticed is that the one on the top in the image gets hot, while the lower one stays at room temperature.

What I'm now curious about is that why does it look like there data I/O on the chips while POST reports there's no external cache?

I even tried all BIOS roms I could find (0105, 0118 and 0205) just to see if that'd make a difference, but no luck.

What an annoying fault. I like the system very much and thought it'd be my ultimate Pentium/3Dfx DOS/W95 machine and could excuse me to get rid of a whole bunch of miscellaneous parts 😁

Reply 5 of 6, by Nexxen

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IntelInsidest wrote on 2025-09-27, 08:21:
Thanks for the suggestions! […]
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Thanks for the suggestions!

I went through all the pins of the chips and everything seemed solid. The tag chip and its socket got a squirt of contact cleaner and quick brushie-brushie.

I took out my scope and open the data sheet for W25P010AF-8 and sure enough everything seems to be there. I/O and supply voltages have a solid 3.3V, host clock is present and even data I/O pins show some serial data. Same applies for both of the chips, but one difference I noticed is that the one on the top in the image gets hot, while the lower one stays at room temperature.

What I'm now curious about is that why does it look like there data I/O on the chips while POST reports there's no external cache?

I even tried all BIOS roms I could find (0105, 0118 and 0205) just to see if that'd make a difference, but no luck.

What an annoying fault. I like the system very much and thought it'd be my ultimate Pentium/3Dfx DOS/W95 machine and could excuse me to get rid of a whole bunch of miscellaneous parts 😁

Usually they get hot under use, not at idle.
Could be a bad chip (they can die).

Like Shponglefan suggested:
any capacitor / resistance around getting hot as well? If you have some isopropyl alcohol you can splash the area and check what evaporates first.

Maybe something is pulling to ground and not allowing L2 sizing (my guess yet again).

PC#1 Pentium 233 MMX - 98SE
PC#2 PIII-1Ghz - 98SE/W2K

"One hates the specialty unobtainium parts, the other laughs in greed listing them under a ridiculous price" - kotel studios
Bare metal ist krieg.

Reply 6 of 6, by IntelInsidest

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Nexxen wrote on 2025-09-27, 08:29:
Usually they get hot under use, not at idle. Could be a bad chip (they can die). […]
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Usually they get hot under use, not at idle.
Could be a bad chip (they can die).

Like Shponglefan suggested:
any capacitor / resistance around getting hot as well? If you have some isopropyl alcohol you can splash the area and check what evaporates first.

Maybe something is pulling to ground and not allowing L2 sizing (my guess yet again).

No caps get extremely hot. I also measured all of them in that general area in circuit with power off and couldn't find any shorts or open circuits.

I also measured from ground (VSS) to power supply (VDD) on both of the chips and there's no short there either. Resistance starts to ramp up from sub-100 to ~300 ohms which to me looks like a healthy coupling capacitor charging up.