marxveix wrote on 2025-09-21, 19:13:

to get it going bit faster with fog@D3D, downgrade to 4.10.4002 D3D T1 without fog and D3D 4.11.4033 is faster and 3DCIF versio […]
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to get it going bit faster with fog@D3D, downgrade to 4.10.4002 D3D
T1 without fog and D3D 4.11.4033 is faster and 3DCIF version has fog!

To get to chooce CIF or D3D launch Turok1 with -alldrivers
"C:\Games\Turok Dinosaur Hunter\Turok.exe" -alldrivers

New setup for ATi Rage Pro / XL:Celeron 533MHz, Intel 440EX, 256MBx1RAM, 20GB HDD.
Now Turok1 D3D Fog works, no need to downgrade D3D version or it is about new OS / DX?

I will skip old VIA chipset for now, even 440EX is intel budget chipset.
Also Oni started, that i had starting issue before with old VIA chipset.

Clean install Windows 95B OSR2 / DirectX 8.0a
5.40/2611 with 4.11.4033 and CIF + D3D@FOG

Turok1 with fog and everything ATiD3D default (Xpert@Play setting)
Run1: 640x480x16 40.8fps - ATi RageLT PRO 8MB AGP - very long benchmark
Run1: 640x480x16 42.7fps - ATi Rage PRO 8MB 2xAGP - very long benchmark
Run1: 640x480x16 47.7fps - ATi Rage XL 8MB 2xAGP - very long benchmark

3DMark99Max at default 800x600 and no difference Rage Pro vs LTPro.
RagePro = RageLTPro, ATiRageXL is winner
3D Mark99 Max 1321p - ATi RagePro 8MB AGP
(Rage LT Pro, same 3DMark score as Rage Pro)
3D Mark99 Max 1465p - ATi RageXL 8MB AGP

Its Mendocino Celeron, it has only old MMX support from early 1997. 128MB updgrade to 256MB did not make speed difference in Win9x.
PIII with SSE gets better results, but i am happy as it is for now, Slot1 to Socket 370 converter + it has 2xISA, 2xPCI, AGP, built in ESS Solo1.
mATX motherboard CT-6ESA2,very tiny mATX case and 300W PSU,20GB HDD,DVD/RW+1.44MB FDD. PS/2 optical mouse,PS/2 keyboard.

vvbee wrote on 2025-12-04, 04:34:

Rage Pro Tweaker was able to change the pixel format to RGB565 so that direct buffer writes from Glide games do display correctly in CIF now. Just had to restart after applying the setting in the tweaker. Has to be a reason ATI defaulted to RGB555 though.

The wrapper isn't done yet but I'll put it out at some point.

565 i have seen inside System.ini file with ATi Rage Pro / XL (when Rage Pro Tweaker is installed and 565 selected - rage.dll file)

System.ini
[Display]
five6five=1

Without or with Rage Pro Tweaker is see these at regedit (if i search 565). Color Depth 16bpp has both options <565> and <555>

REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\ATI Technologies\CDS\0000\0\DAC]
"Type"="Internal DAC (0x00000000)"
"Sync-On-Green Support"="No (0x00000000)"
"Gamma Correction Support"="Yes (0x00000001)"
"256 Gray Scale Support"="Yes (0x00000001)"
"Sleep Mode Support"="Yes (0x00000001)"
"Color Depth"="16bpp <565>, 16bpp <555>, 24bpp <RGB>, 32bpp <xRGB> (0x00000087)"

Some documents for RagePro,maybe helps,565 and palette information
http://www.bitsavers.org/components/ati/RAGE_ … _1.0_200003.pdf
http://www.bitsavers.org/components/ati/RAGE_ … uide_199804.pdf
http://www.bitsavers.org/components/ati/RAGE_ … v_1.01_1997.pdf
Rage XL
https://old.vgamuseum.info/images/stories/doc … tions_dec03.pdf
https://theretroweb.com/chip/documentation/at … 3b508495717.pdf

Mach32/64 and all other older ati cards doc
http://www.bitsavers.org/components/ati

List of ATi 3DCIF Games and Utilites at more recent posts lately:
Re: 3D Accelerated Games List (Proprietary APIs - No 3DFX/Direct3D)
Re: 3D Accelerated Games List (Proprietary APIs - No 3DFX/Direct3D)

ATi Rage3 has Glide2CIF wrapper now, thank you vvbee, i am gona try it with Rage XL AGP first: Glide/CIF wrapper

From graphics side,ATi Rage Pro and XL are so underrated and they made them at huge quantities. If we do not throw them away, we are well covered at lower end graphics at Win9x. Tons of options in operating system support at these old ATi, not limited at dos and win9x systems only, OS support is greater than you might think, same goes with API support, like DDraw/3DCIF/Direct3D/OpenGL, all these at hardware acceleration, maybe Argonaut BRender/Criterion RenderWare API support as well and this all in Win95-ME enviroment. Not mentioning better DVD support.

Voodoo1/2/3/4/5 we cant all buy for our RetroPC, thats for sure.

Rage XL 2xAGP is better version of Rage Pro 2xAGP and both of them are great old videocards.
Rage Pro has blocky, more retro feeling and effects and its bit slower if both at 64bit memory.
RageProPCI is more rarer and RageXLPCI misses 3DCIF support only not having driver support.
ATi Rage Pro/ XL/ XC and others are like Voodoo1 that have,has some of the Voodoo2 features.

Maybe i have shared alternate os support table, if not i will add it here soon, let me find it first.
Alternate Operating System Driver Support Chart missing many, MacOS, Win3.1, many others!

Added some more MultiTexture information pdf and ati multitexture software also included. 😀

As i shared already pdf about Alternate Operating Systems for Rage Pro and newer, here are Takedasun driver links not only for Win9x, but many more. This is the biggest driver collection for ATi Rage and Radeon cards, if someone knows better, let me know.This all thanks to Takedasun.

Anybody gona explore Rage/Radeon drivers out, this link is Golden. All possible older drivers and software for ATi, mostly for Windows OS!
Thank you Takedasun!

Collection of drivers ATi (by Takedasun)
https://disk.yandex.com/d/vfgML2Vm3TR4mw

Small update to the latest 5.40x2611 build, shorter name ARx2611x3Dfx.7z 2in1, same build, one bigger, other smaller. Take it as alpha build, added glide2cif and some other small changes are there. Out of the box over 10 Glide games are working, nothing to be add, i may make one barebone driver, just like regular driver as glide2cif gets more mature. Readme.txt is many readmes together, it can be slimmer in size, but 7z makes good compression with multiple same files. Glide2CIF thanks to vvbee , made by him.

Requirement of glide2cif is 8MB card, if anybody has Rage2+DVD or Rage2C with 8MB can try it, i have only Rage3 cards with 8MB.
Douglar, you have now XC AGP card, you can try maybe this 3DCIF driver with it and you can use XGL200 with it, Glide XL200.bat. 😀

Just for confirming XC AGP works as XL AGP is at CIF, no big testing, just one game@cif.

Glide2CIF - 3Dfx stuff that works
Croc 1.0
Die by the Sword
GLQuake MiniGL 3Dfx OpenGL32.dll
Ignition
Manx TT Super bike
Monaco Grand Prix: Racing Simulation 2 (1)
Monster Truck Madness 2
Motorhead
Pod Gold
X-Men: The Ravages of Apocalypse (GLQuake)
Pandemonium 2
Probable Worlds screensaver

Note (1) Inside view does not work

More games can be run,
not error free, alpha! 😀

You want to get more fps, make or copy .bat file
and add game exe file name to this bat file with
set FX_GLIDE_SWAPINTERVAL=0

Quake example1:
set FX_GLIDE_SWAPINTERVAL=0
GLQuake

Pandemonium2 example2:
set FX_GLIDE_SWAPINTERVAL=0
Pandy

Glide screensaver or demo Probable Worlds i can add.
Pod Gold 3Dfx@640x480 all maxed out,max@50fps.
Pod Gold game does no need the SWAPINTERVAL=0.

Bit late Happy new year wishes to all!

So now the Rage2/3 has full support for DX6, OpenGL, ATI CIF, and partial support for GLide.
It's a shame about the modern XL PCI (Rage3) cards, which are stuck with DX6 and OpenGL.
But the Rage AGP cards are becoming more interesting. They are quite abundant and much more reliable than most of the cards from that era; many do not use electrolytic capacitors, for example.
Thank you very much.

Rage3 always supported OpenGL; a solution for Rage2 is welcome. But doesn't this work only with miniGL?
There are games on the list with a D3D renderer - what is the point of using other APIs?

Putas wrote on 2026-01-05, 12:27:

Rage3 always supported OpenGL; a solution for Rage2 is welcome. But doesn't this work only with miniGL?
There are games on the list with a D3D renderer - what is the point of using other APIs?

Sometimes 3Dfx Glide API had better 3D implementation,even on POD S3D and 3DCIF was more between 3D and Software maybe.
Rage2 had only some OpenGL support on older NT OS-es and it was not hardware support, they implemented some CIF to OpenGL.
If vvbee removes 8MB limitation then i can try how Rage2+DVD 4MB can handle GLQuake, no real OpenGL support for Rage2, with
Rage3 - RageXL AGP its close, i am at 28.8fps@3Dfx MiniGL 640x480x16 and no 3DNow, SSE help, only old MMX is there to help it.

Hoping wrote on 2026-01-05, 12:13:

So now the Rage2/3 has full support for DX6, OpenGL, ATI CIF, and partial support for GLide. It's a shame about the modern XL PC […]
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So now the Rage2/3 has full support for DX6, OpenGL, ATI CIF, and partial support for GLide.
It's a shame about the modern XL PCI (Rage3) cards, which are stuck with DX6 and OpenGL.
But the Rage AGP cards are becoming more interesting. They are quite abundant and much more reliable than most of the cards from that era; many do not use electrolytic capacitors, for example.
Thank you very much.

I hope vvbee leaves Glide2CIF option open, its more up to him, i promised to test games if he wants it.
XLPCI cards are newer B41,but there should be some B22 PCI cards i think,still they are slower@32bit.
I am happy that XL AGP cards works and i have no Rage Mobility Notebook to check those out myself.
All Rage Pro ones are more Retro choices and XL / XC are its newer brothers, XC=budget version of XL.

Rage2 has DX5.0 and no real OpenGL support, but it has CIF and D3D, plus wrapper option, its way slower.
Rage2 has his own d3d file and Rage3 has his, Rage2 is much slower, even Rage1 had CIF, very early driver.
My drivers have Rage2+/Rage2+DVD/Rage2C support for sure and first Rage2 may need also older driver.
Minimally 4MB cards are good and 6MB and 8MB ones are better, 16MB ones we can dream it at IBM PC.

Somebody that uses my driver, can let me know and if someone has some good solution to recommend
that i do not use,i am always open for feedback and change something for the better at these ati drivers.
We are more stuck in @ 2611 driver release at the moment, just option to expand it some way or another.

Thank you!

Is the Mobility M1 8MB a Rage 3 that could use these drivers?

chronoreverse wrote on 2026-01-06, 05:05:

Is the Mobility M1 8MB a Rage 3 that could use these drivers?

From Rage3
Only card that is confirmed not work at all is Rage XL PCI (4752) and i think same boat is Rage XC PCI (4753). Other Rage3 cards should work.

From Rage1/2
Rage cards that do not work are Rage1 and probably original Rage2,Rage2+DVD and Rage2C is tested by me,they work as they can,no OpenGL.

Rage2
Rage2+ / Rage2C (DDraw/3DCIF/Direct3D)
Rage2+DVD (DDraw/3DCIF/Direct3D/DVD)

Rage3
Rage Pro/ Rage Pro Turbo/ RageLTPro (DDraw/3DCIF/Direct3D/OpenGL/DVD)
Rage XL AGP and Rage XC AGP (DDraw/3DCIF/Direct3D/OpenGL/DVD)
Rage Mobility P/M/M1/L (DDraw/Direct3D/OpenGL/DVD)

Someone has used Mobility in these driver types before, very beginning of this topic.I think they should work for DirectDraw,Direct3D and OpenGL, maybe DVD, XGL200 and dgVoodoo wrappers should do. DVD and CIF compability needs more checking, i dont have any Mobility cards in my hand.

I have those inf added with Mobility names:

"ATi 3D Rage Mobility AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_B1600E11, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_B1110E11, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-P AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_009E1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-P AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_009F1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-P AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00851028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00AA1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00AB1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00BB1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00BC1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00DC1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-M1 AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_00DD1028, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage MobilityP/M AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D&SUBSYS_4C4D1002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4D
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-L AGP"= MACXW4_AGP_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4E&SUBSYS_4C4E1002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C4E
"ATi 3D Rage Mobility-L PCI"= MACXW4_PCI_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C53&SUBSYS_4C531002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C53
"ATi 3D Rage MobilityP/M PCI"= MACXW4_PCI_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C52&SUBSYS_4C521002, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C52
"ATi 3D Rage MobilityP/M PCI"= MACXW4_PCI_ENU, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C52&SUBSYS_B1110E11, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4C52

Keep in mind to use 16 bit high colors at your desktop and let me know about M1 if you can, thank you.

Having a bit of trouble with "newest" right now. Appears to install fine and reboots into Windows 98SE the first time. Then BSODs for subsequent reboots. Tried a couple more times (booted into Safe Mode, removed the adapter, reboot and reinstall. let me know if I did this wrong).

I'll try the other two sets and see what happens.

5.38 installs correctly but 3DMark99 is completely broken in terms of textures. I previously had some driver I randomly found online. I'll reinstall those and see if it fixes my textures or if I had inadvertently broken my Win98 install.

It looks like the driver I had before from here (https://www.dell.com/support/home/en-ca/drive … driverid=r24179) is newer, being 4.12.2168 and also had non-broken textures, at least for my ATI Mobility M1. Hopefully it'll be helpful for anyone looking for M1 drivers (and if anyone finds something newer than 4.12.2168 it'll be interesting to test).

chronoreverse wrote on 2026-01-06, 17:59:

Having a bit of trouble with "newest" right now. Appears to install fine and reboots into Windows 98SE the first time. Then BSODs for subsequent reboots. Tried a couple more times (booted into Safe Mode, removed the adapter, reboot and reinstall. let me know if I did this wrong).

I'll try the other two sets and see what happens.

chronoreverse wrote on 2026-01-06, 18:10:

5.38 installs correctly but 3DMark99 is completely broken in terms of textures. I previously had some driver I randomly found online. I'll reinstall those and see if it fixes my textures or if I had inadvertently broken my Win98 install.

chronoreverse wrote on 2026-01-06, 19:07:

It looks like the driver I had before from here (https://www.dell.com/support/home/en-ca/drive … driverid=r24179) is newer, being 4.12.2168 and also had non-broken textures, at least for my ATI Mobility M1. Hopefully it'll be helpful for anyone looking for M1 drivers (and if anyone finds something newer than 4.12.2168 it'll be interesting to test).

It needs some thinking if the 5.38 somehow works and 5.40 not. 5.38 has older files and newest main 2611 drv file and 5.40 is up to date with some edited files from 5.38 to add rage xl support and added rage2 support back. Mach64w9x538x3D2611B.zip was before and other Mobilty M user used those for his D3D and OpenGL games, both API worked. 5.38x2611x3D.7z is bit updated one and has XGL200 Glide Wrapper.

donluca4 with his mobility m (Mach64w9x538x3D2611B.zip)
Re: ATi RagePro drivers and software
Re: ATi RagePro drivers and software

Oldest ATi drivers up, newest down. Newest does not always mean, its better.
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Win9x … 64_Rage_PRO?w=1

If i look and i look only 3DCIF results @ 5.38 vs 5.40, then Mobility-L is better with 5.38. Mobility-L has less CIF errors with 5.38.
https://gona.mactar.hu/ATI3DCIF/

marxveix wrote on 2026-01-06, 19:12:

Oldest ATi drivers up, newest down. Newest does not always mean, its better.
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Win9x … 64_Rage_PRO?w=1

4.12.2647 works but have to select Xpert98 since M1 doesn't exist. Textures in 3DMark99 look good and performance is the same even.

chronoreverse wrote on 2026-01-06, 20:00:

4.12.2647 works but have to select Xpert98 since M1 doesn't exist. Textures in 3DMark99 look good and performance is the same even.

Its good driver for its 8 bit paletted textures support.

Doesn't seem like older drivers work with the M1 which I guess makes sense since it's a 1999 chip. So no CIF unless someone finds a way to port it forward. D3D seems good, over 1600 on my Duron 800.

chronoreverse wrote on Yesterday, 04:57:

Doesn't seem like older drivers work with the M1 which I guess makes sense since it's a 1999 chip. So no CIF unless someone finds a way to port it forward. D3D seems good, over 1600 on my Duron 800.

I still think that M and M1 works with 5.38 or 5.40 drivers, just some configuration or chipset drivers or something it did not like this time.
As Mobility M an M1 are the same, just M has 4MB and M1 has 8MB. Mobility M with 4MB has been used succesfully at least with 5.38 drv.

CIF has been missing from it and i need some old notebook to test it out to be 100% sure.

https://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/ATI_Rage_Mobility_M
https://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:A20m