newtmonkey wrote on 2026-04-21, 07:55:

Ultima V (Apple II)

when i played older games like this i would suspend my "analytical" mind and just go with the imagination and story, i find that more difficult to do now, such RPG's start to feel a bit to "rinse and repeat" or spreadsheet like... i'd like to enjoy them innocently again in a way, without knowing too much about how they actually work and so on, too much experience results in illusions shattered and curtains falling away, if you know what i mean

gerry wrote on 2026-04-21, 12:59:

when i played older games like this i would suspend my "analytical" mind and just go with the imagination and story, i find that more difficult to do now, such RPG's start to feel a bit to "rinse and repeat" or spreadsheet like... i'd like to enjoy them innocently again in a way, without knowing too much about how they actually work and so on, too much experience results in illusions shattered and curtains falling away, if you know what i mean

I think it's just a matter of sitting down and committing to playing a game and appreciating it for what it is. Modern games are generally so streamlined and "easy" to play that it's easy to just sit down and play for an hour without really putting any thought or effort into it.

When I decide to play an older game, I always "force" myself to spend at least 60 minutes (even if over a couple of days) playing it before deciding whether to continue. A lot of getting into an older game is just learning its interface, really, and 30-60 minutes is usually enough time to get used to its interface and quirks.

Ultima V (Apple II)
I could not believe how expensive food is in this game--I was finding it unbelievably difficult to get anywhere in the game, because I had to spend all of my money on food and only food.

I figured there was something I had to have been missing, so I started searching around. I checked every walkthrough and FAQs I could find, and no one mentions it being an issue at all (there is actually very little info on the Apple II version out there now). Then I found one resource that mentions that food is sold in packs of 25:
https://strategywiki.org/wiki/Ultima_V:_Warri … rectory#Taverns

Strange! In the Apple II version, food is sold for the same prices, but you only receive 6 units per pack. I started up the MS-DOS version (GOG) and, sure enough, food is sold in packs of 25 units! I guess Origin realized how brutal the Apple II version is and made the early game quite a bit easier in the DOS port. This explains why I never had any trouble at all getting started with the DOS version back when I tried playing it a few years ago!

I really like the idea of playing the original version of the game (and transferring my Ultima IV Avatar into it), but the food situation in the Apple II version is absolutely ridiculous. Maybe it's just a matter of slowly fighting battles I know I can easily win (making sure to save after each one) until I build up a decent stockpile of food, gold, and items (reminds me of Ultima II... ugh).

I'm seriously considering just playing the DOS port, now. In order to simulate transferring my Avatar over, I could always create a character in U5 and then edit the save file to boost my stats to where they should be for a transferred character.

newtmonkey wrote on 2026-04-21, 13:15:

gerry wrote on 2026-04-21, 12:59:

when i played older games like this i would suspend my "analytical" mind and just go with the imagination and story, i find that more difficult to do now, such RPG's start to feel a bit to "rinse and repeat" or spreadsheet like... i'd like to enjoy them innocently again in a way, without knowing too much about how they actually work and so on, too much experience results in illusions shattered and curtains falling away, if you know what i mean

I think it's just a matter of sitting down and committing to playing a game and appreciating it for what it is. Modern games are generally so streamlined and "easy" to play that it's easy to just sit down and play for an hour without really putting any thought or effort into it.

When I decide to play an older game, I always "force" myself to spend at least 60 minutes (even if over a couple of days) playing it before deciding whether to continue. A lot of getting into an older game is just learning its interface, really, and 30-60 minutes is usually enough time to get used to its interface and quirks.

it's a good approach, actually much like the 'old' days where buying a game was (proportional to income) a bigger investment, plus the fact we drove or caught a bus to the mall or wherever we bought it. that larger up front investment means we were more determined and motivated to give the game some time.

i'm not sure i have the motivation to enforce that investment time now, i'm sure if conditions returned (trapped in a cave with a pc and big box rpgs!) i'd soon adapt back 😀

Ultima V (DOS)
Well, I decided to try this version out just to compare, and several hours later I'm quite hooked! I still prefer the Apple II soundtrack, but the patched-in MIDI soundtrack of this version is fine. I also kind of prefer the Apple II graphics, though they are definitely technically inferior.

In all other ways, this is the version to play. It runs faster/smoother, though that's only because the game has no built-in speed limiter. If I dial DOSBOX down to around 1,000 cycles it runs roughly the same as the Apple II version, though it doesn't slow down as much when there is a lot happening on the screen.

What really makes this version nicer to play, however, is the easier start. I mentioned earlier how cheaper food is in this version, but it's hard to overstate how much of a difference this makes. Because you don't have to spend all your money on food just to avoid starvation, you can spend more money on crucial stuff like reagents and items, which makes it a hell of a lot easier to explore and actually accomplish stuff.

Anyway, I'll be sticking with this version. I don't mind a difficult game, but the early part of the Apple II version just seemed hopeless without massive saving and reloading just to slightly get ahead.

---

So far, I've explored Britain, Castle Britannia and it's surrounding villages, Yew, and Empath Abbey. I got a lead on someone who can give me some info about one of the Shadowlords, learned one of the words of power to access a dungeon, and learned a couple of the mantras (which I don't need, since they are the same as in Ultima IV and I still have my notes for that). I fought a few battles and actually got some nice equipment from them, including main-gauches for the Avatar and Shamino; these awesome offhand weapons give the character a second attack each round, which is very nice early on.

I'm having fun so far, but I don't know if I like it as much as Ultima IV. It adds a lot of complexity to the world, such as multilevel structures, a day/night cycle, and NPC schedules... but all of that makes gathering information kind of a pain at times. Due to how quickly time advances, you really only have a short window of time to explore a town when you get to it, before people start going to dinner and then sleeping. Your only choice then is to find a bed or camp outside.

I haven't stepped foot in any of the dungeons yet. My plan for now is to explore the locations I can access on foot to gather information, fight some battles along the way to earn gold to buy a bunch of reagents and items, and then check out a dungeon or two.

Ultima V
I complained about this game in my earlier post, but then immediately went back and played it some more. I still think that the day/night cycle and NPC schedules can be annoying, but it's a very cool game. The quest is completely different from that of Ultima IV, but it has a somewhat similar structure. It all starts with reading the documentation, of course, which gives you a really vague idea of what you need to do. As you talk to people, you slowly piece together information on several quests you need to figure out; it's somewhat similar to the moment in Ultima IV where you realize that you need to find 8 runes, 8 mantras, and 8 stones, and then figure out how it all fits together. Much like U4, the structure of the quest is nonlinear, so you're free to explore the world, gather information, and accomplish stuff in whatever order makes sense to you.

Even early on, it's clear to see that U5 is an improvement over U4 in at least a couple of ways.

First is the writing. NPCs have little personalities and backstories, instead of just being means of getting information on runes/stones/mantras like in U4. They respond to more keywords, so interacting with them feels a bit more like having a conversation.

Second is combat, which is a huge improvement over U4. Instead of attacking in the four cardinal directions as in U4, you get a cursor-based targeting system that allows you to attack enemies in any direction (including diagonals!) in melee, or any enemies within range when using ranged weapons. There doesn't seem to be any level scaling; instead, encounters get more difficult the further away from civilization you get. Unlike U4, you cannot just equip all your characters with bows and slings and slaughter daemons and dragons from range before they even get a chance to touch you. Powerful monsters will actually use special attacks and cast spells. Even better, monsters drop actual loot. It's unbelievably satisfying when you kill some monster and it drops a chest containing not only gold but some food, miscellaneous items, and even equipment.

Good stuff, so far!

Ultima V
This game has a bit of a slow start, but really picks up once you gather a bit of information. It feels just as addictive as Ultima IV was, but the world is actually even more open because you can buy a ship at any time, once you've got the money (and ships are not very expensive). Just like in U4, you can basically do anything once you've got a ship.

Sailing in U5 is a bit more complex, but is actually way less of a pain. There's still the concept of wind direction, but it only benefits you; sailing against the wind doesn't really hinder you like in U4. With the sails down, you simply move one space each time you press a direction. With the sails up, the ship sails automatically in whatever direction you press, as long as you aren't going against the wind... and if you sail with the wind, you go very, very fast! The danger here is that you can actually crash your ship in shallow water if you have the sails up, so you have to pay attention. I really like this!

I'm still piecing together what I need to do in the game, but I've gathered a lot of information and have a rough idea of what I'll need to do. You basically have several major quests, each of which consists of several steps. It's similar to how U4 is structured, but with much more variety. I have plenty of leads to follow up on, and I expect I'll be making some really quick progress now that I have a ship.

Honestly, I'm sort of tempted to go back to the Apple II version. Now that I know how the game works, I suspect that the "beginning hell" of that version is really not that bad. Even if you spend the first hour or two spending all your money on food, you'd slowly be gaining EXP and a bunch of useful items from enemy drops. I think a viable strategy would be to drop Iolo and Shamino off at the nearest inn to minimize food consumption, and then to just solo the first couple hours of the game, gathering information and winning battles. You could also go around gathering information and taking notes, and then simply not save the game so that you don't consume any resources.

[EDIT]
I have to mention something about this game that really impressed me. You come upon a father and son basically starving to death in stockades, which would be cruel even for a murderer, but you find out that they are there for very minor crimes (the boy is there because he didn't report his father). I went and talked to the inquisitor, who refused to do anything about it, so I figured it was some quest you had to figure out later on. It stayed on my mind as I was going around doing Avatar stuff, and then it hit me--why not just try to free them? So I went back, "jimmied" the locks with a key, and they escaped! It was wonderful. I didn't get anything for it (maybe some Karma), but I was happy to save good people from horrible fates... like an Avatar.