Imgema wrote:

Ok guys, please don't burn me for this, but as a console gamer during most of the 90's i see this PC platform game and i can har […]
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Ok guys, please don't burn me for this, but as a console gamer during most of the 90's i see this PC platform game and i can hardly believe that it reviewed well or that it was popular. Compared to console platformers of the time, this looks like a C or D grade platformer. We're talking about 1994 where games like Sonic 3 & Knuckles and Donkey Kong Country were released...

Now, don't get me wrong, i know that the PC was never the best platform for platform games (no pun intended) and PC gamers were somewhat thirsty of any decent platform games. But this looks really below average, even graphically. In 1994 you could have at least better graphics on a PC than a 16bit console but this not only looks way inferior to the likes of Sonic, DK or even Mario, it looks like an early Amiga game. And the frame rate doesn't look smooth either, at least judging from the video. The level design looks poor also.

As for the sequel, yes, i can see why it reviewed poorly. Lets forget 3D platforms that were perfected already since 1996 by the way (Mario 64). Lets focus only on 2D platforms. I'm not even going to bring Yoshi's Island or DKC 2 into the discussion. But even on the PC you could find games like the Earthworm Jim ports, for example. I just can't see how anyone would be impressed by this when he had access to some of the best ports of Earthworm Jim 1 and 2. Oh and Rayman.

Like i said, don't burn me for this. I don't have much experience whatsoever from PC games before 1997 (except for the likes of Doom) and i'm mostly talk from the perspective of a console gamer (Awwww, yisssss).

Whilst I can see where you're coming from (as someone who played PC games since the 90's), you also seem to miss a few points here and there. Those Earthworm Jim and Rayman PC ports weren't released until 1996, and they weren't hyped up as much as the latest games coming out from 1996. Besides, by 1996, you would rather play games like Duke Nukem 3D or Quake on your PC than any of those platformers anyway (at least first person shooters had something new to offer compared to side scrollers which have over saturated the console market by that point in time). And what if I wanted to play some console platformers? I would just go to my friends who already owned them and just play with them. I would play console platformers with them, and they would play DOS games like Doom, DN3D, etc. when they wanted to come over to my place.

Yes, Jazz Jackrabbit may not have been that great compared to its' sequel (as Kris has already pointed out), but I can say the same of games like the very first Sonic the Hedgehog or the first Donkey Kong Country (the sequel beats the crap out of the first one). Also, 3D platformers HAVE NOT been perfected by 1996. What gave you that idea? If anything, Super Mario Galaxy 2 and Super Mario 3D World are much more complex and refined compared to Super Mario 64. Right now, 3D games like SM64 and Ocarina of Time are REALLY beginning to show their age. Oddly enough, the cel-shaded graphics of The Wind Waker still hold up well in my opinion.

But then again, all of this is coming from me (as someone who played PC games since the 90's).

EDIT: One more thing, the frame rate of Jazz Jackrabbit is much smoother than what you saw in the Blip video. You can blame Blip and YouTube for capping the frame rate of their videos at 30 FPS (although the game's menu is actually running at 70 Hz).

There's quite a number of reasons why platformers were mostly a console thing and it comes down to the technical aspects of the consoles versus computers. I keep this in mind when I talk about these old DOS games as most DOS platformers don't hold up versus even average-quality console platformers, but at the same time this doesn't negate their playability. A game can look terrible but still play well. ;)

As such, I mostly compare DOS games with other DOS games. I only talk about other ports that are related to the game in question, since otherwise it'd be like comparing apples and oranges. :P

One other thing to keep in mind: Not everyone had gaming consoles. I had access to a DOS PC two years before I got my first consoles. (A Gameboy first and an NES very shortly afterwards.) If you had a parent who bought a computer for business purposes, chances are, you grew up playing DOS games, not console games, since you could buy games for a computer whereas console games would require buying a console. Plus, most families only had a single TV, so if you wanted to play console games, everyone else in the house would have to give up watching TV to let you. This is why Dad bought a 20" TV for my bedroom back when I was 10, since he could afford to, whereas when I was at Mom's place, we only had one TV so we had to share. If someone wanted to watch TV, but I wanted to play games, I'd have to use the computer.

Basically, the point I'm trying to get across is yes, overall, consoles had better platformers than DOS computers, but there are many reasons why the DOS games are still fun and still worth playing, and many reasons why they were played in lieu of console games to begin with. ;)

Imgema wrote:

it looks like an early Amiga game

This?

C64 perhaps.

The Amiga had games in 86-87 that beat the pants off what you're seeing above. 😀

SquallStrife wrote:

This? […]
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Imgema wrote:

it looks like an early Amiga game

This?

C64 perhaps.

The Amiga had games in 86-87 that beat the pants off what you're seeing above. 😀

is that 1 or 2? i have only seen 2 so far.

That's #1, it was linked to earlier on Mobygames.

Ancient DOS Games Filler #42 - Cube World is online!

I've actually been meaning to talk about this game for quite awhile now... :o

I find this game highly aesthetically appealing, and the gameplay, while difficult and grindy at the moment, is still very enjoyable and controls beautifully. I can't wait to see where the authors take this in the future, as there's so much content still in the pipeline... It's just a very long wait. The last update was way back when the game first went public alpha over a year ago so they've clearly decided to go the "larger, fewer updates" route, which is fine I guess but not very good when you want to retain your audience. :B

Cube World looks pretty fun, and it's surprisingly polished-looking for something in an alpha state. I'll definitely have to check it out, if I can afford it. 😉

i've looked at cube world before, and the 1 year lack of updates or any info on pay for games has alarmed a lot people and tarnished it's reputation, especially in my eyes. maybe when they get there stuff together and or more updates and or on steam i might buy a copy. Though I rarely buy games not on steam.

cdoublejj wrote:

i've looked at cube world before, and the 1 year lack of updates or any info on pay for games has alarmed a lot people and tarnished it's reputation, especially in my eyes.

I've been following the project for years and can safely say that the author has gone many months in a row before without saying anything about progress, even though progress does indeed continue. While there hasn't been any updates to the game itself, the latest progress update, including video footage, was back around the end of June and showed numerous things not presently implemented, plus if you carefully parse through the pictures on the Cube World page on the Picroma website, you will see a whole bunch of things not actually in the game yet, but clearly running from inside the game, so they're coded, just not complete enough for testing purposes, such as custom house building, a black character with a red visor, pet evolution eggs, four unused bosses, and an in-game player or NPC wearing a headband, which is not currently possible.

Making a 2D game on your own is hard enough, making a 3D game is extremely time consuming, and making a 3D game at the same time as your own graphical editing software's gotta be a massive time-sink. But I do agree those two could be making a stronger effort to keep everyone up to date on things. :P

Your videos dont play in my side for some reason. On both your site and on blip.tv the screen just goes black. Why did you stop posting videos on youtube? it's much better than blip's crappy player.

Gemini000 wrote:

cdoublejj wrote:

i've looked at cube world before, and the 1 year lack of updates or any info on pay for games has alarmed a lot people and tarnished it's reputation, especially in my eyes.

I've been following the project for years and can safely say that the author has gone many months in a row before without saying anything about progress, even though progress does indeed continue. While there hasn't been any updates to the game itself, the latest progress update, including video footage, was back around the end of June and showed numerous things not presently implemented, plus if you carefully parse through the pictures on the Cube World page on the Picroma website, you will see a whole bunch of things not actually in the game yet, but clearly running from inside the game, so they're coded, just not complete enough for testing purposes, such as custom house building, a black character with a red visor, pet evolution eggs, four unused bosses, and an in-game player or NPC wearing a headband, which is not currently possible.

Making a 2D game on your own is hard enough, making a 3D game is extremely time consuming, and making a 3D game at the same time as your own graphical editing software's gotta be a massive time-sink. But I do agree those two could be making a stronger effort to keep everyone up to date on things. 😜

I see. ALSO as to you last 2 line checkout open mw, it has to be aside from Dolphin one of the most well run open source projects i have ever seen ever! Those crazies pump out update like clock work. They are doing just that, 3d WITH editor!? Def not the same as cube world, bigger team no art/gfx has to be done (already done)

oldgreatgames wrote:

Your videos dont play in my side for some reason. On both your site and on blip.tv the screen just goes black. Why did you stop posting videos on youtube? it's much better than blip's crappy player.

Try different browsers. I know Firefox is having issues with the Blip player, possibly due to the latest Flash updates.

I stopped updating on YouTube in September because of Content-ID muting that didn't appear to be muting which resulted in downvoting because it made me look like I didn't know what I was doing. That video is working properly now and the Content-ID nonsense with it is over, but NOW I'm having connectivity issues with YouTube that are still ongoing, though slowly seem to be getting better, so I'm not sure if the problem is on YouTube's side, my ISP's side, or both. Uploading a single video to YouTube can take up to two hours when everything is working properly and I have to be present when it finishes in the event that something goes wrong with the upload, otherwise it will permanently get downvoted by anyone who tries to watch it and is unable to or can't tolerate whatever's wrong with it... and past experience has taught me that problems with uploads don't show up until the upload is DONE, this includes a failed upload due to temporary disconnects which screw up maybe a handful of bytes in the middle of the process.

TL;DR: Uploading to YouTube is a freaking pain when things go wrong and my current connectivity issues with YouTube specifically ensure things will go wrong routinely. I even have trouble watching videos at 480p when it's at its worst. Once I'm satisfied I can maintain a solid connection for more than a minute or two at a time, I'll get back to uploading there.

Not sure why YT gives you so much trouble. I live in the Australian Outback and upload speed is very slow but it still works. Some videos take several hours to a day or two depending on the size.

So far I only had issue with a X-Wing video. Everything else no issues so far 😀

Now with 60 fps support even more exciting 🤣

I must be doing something right since all the videos work for me - and I just upgraded both Firefox (33.0.1) and Flash (15.0.0.189) a few days ago.

Most of your YT problems seems to be from ISP and/or router stuff. No problems here.

vetz wrote:

Most of your YT problems seems to be from ISP and/or router stuff. No problems here.

It's entirely possible my ISP is to blame considering some of the other troubles I've run into, but my father is against changing to a new ISP, even if I paid for it. >_>;

I think he'll change his mind about that if and when we have a couple more moments where it's down for an hour or more. :P

tried with opera. it works. Thank you. I used one of your videos for my game design class, got an A+. Learned more about game design from that video than in this entire course. You should probably be in the faculty. 🤣

oldgreatgames wrote:

tried with opera. it works. Thank you. I used one of your videos for my game design class, got an A+. Learned more about game design from that video than in this entire course. You should probably be in the faculty. :lol:

Probably. But those teachers have to keep a whole classroom in mind so it may not be that their teaching sucks, rather that they're having to teach much more basic concepts for the moment so that the entire class will understand it better. I could be wrong; there are some lousy teachers out there. My experience though is that they're the minority... thankfully. :P

Actually, my first professional programming job was due to my high school computer class teacher seeing my potential, as he also runs a small business devoted to producing and selling math software for schools to use. Didn't last because my sleeping issues got in the way, combined with having to spend a total of three hours in transit every day. :/

A friends of mine runs an anime news and interviews multimedia website/service, they gave up on youtube all together.

My connectivity problems with YouTube seem to be gone at the moment and YouTube's HTML5 player is no longer infinitely buffering. (Though unlike the Flash player, it's buffering whole videos now instead of only a period ahead of the current playback timecode.)

I'm gonna give it a day or two to be certain and if my connectivity continues to be OK I'll get back to YouTube uploads... finally. :B