I have a Logitech Wingman Extreme. Nice joystick, but there are a few little things:
a) no throttle/rudder
b) centre point may wander with temperature change
c) very slight dead area about the centre.

My one is ~20 years old so has some wear, but is still fully functional after a few complete disassemblies to look at and clean the insides.

Thanks for the reply.

This model does seem to have a throttle. Ah, it actually seems to be a Wingman Extreme Digital 3D. I wonder if that's different?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LOGITECH-WINGMAN-Ex … QoAAOSwr2ZZpe9Q

I would favor the SideWinder Precision Pro (although I don't know the Logitech model). I have one of those myself, as well as several SideWinder Game Pads (the gameport original), these controllers are almost indestructible, and will last forever.

The Precision Pro uses light sensors instead of potentiometers which means it virtually has an almost unlimited lifespan. The Precision Pro 2 went back to potentiometers to save costs... Just make sure you get one of the later revision which is USB compatible (comes with the original Microsoft Gameport --> USB adapter), part # X03-57540. It has improved electronics.

voodoo5_6k wrote:

I would favor the SideWinder Precision Pro (although I don't know the Logitech model). I have one of those myself, as well as several SideWinder Game Pads (the gameport original), these controllers are almost indestructible, and will last forever.

The Precision Pro uses light sensors instead of potentiometers which means it virtually has an almost unlimited lifespan. The Precision Pro 2 went back to potentiometers to save costs... Just make sure you get one of the later revision which is USB compatible (comes with the original Microsoft Gameport --> USB adapter), part # X03-57540. It has improved electronics.

That's really helpful, thanks.

I was also looking at the Force Feedback Pro, but this doesn't seem to be USB compatible. I get the impression that maybe it's the older model just with force feedback?

voodoo5_6k wrote:

The Precision Pro uses light sensors instead of potentiometers which means it virtually has an almost unlimited lifespan.

For those components yes, but like anything, the sticks do develop some mechanical looseness with a lot of use, and the buttons' microswitches have a limited lifespan. In active use, you're going to be replacing parts after a year or two, no matter what.

Performance wise, precision and external durability, Microsoft is pretty incredible. Logitech wasn't even in the same ballpark with their first Wingman Extreme Digital series, despite receiving a ton of (uneducated) positive reviews at the time. Even the 8-bit pots in the Precision 2 handily beat the older Logitech series I had, and all the other Precision/FF sticks are at least as good.

So, gameport era, defo MS over Logitech; the Precision Pro and for better DOS compatibility the Sidewinder 3D Pro.

I can't speak for the Precision Pro but I have a Precision 2 that has been working since oh I don't know, 2000? I even have a second one I bought boxed when MS stopped making them, just in case, and I didn't have to unbox it yet.

The original Precision Pro's were twice as durable IIRC, but with me banging 'em around competitively those Precision 2's trigger switches always went out inside the year. I had five or six of them. Chewed through a pair of Wingman Extreme Digitals in just a couple of months each, by comparison.

I think Logitech improved their game a ton with their USB models. Lots of good reports about the Extreme 3D Pro especially, but never had a reason to go back.

Thanks all. A SideWinder is heading my way.

I'll report back once I've had a chance to use it.

The Precision Pro doesn't work in DOS, as it axed the 3D Pro's analog fallback modes.

If you don't mind that or the short stick throw on earlier SideWinder sticks compared to most others, then the Precision Pro will serve you well. No worries about potentiometer wear thanks to the camera/LED sensor system on all the analog axes, for starters.

I'd still prefer a full-blown HOTAS + pedals setup, but not everyone has the budget or space for that.

Got a Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D sitting to my left, waiting for some gaming time.

One of the cool things about this stick - at the time - is that the controller circuitry inside could understand both Gameport and USB, and the gameport connector coming out of the joystick natively came with a passive USB adapter. Great for the time, the transition between Gameport and USB. Note that the adapter only works with very few Logitech sticks, and to the best of my knowledge, no other non-Logitech sticks.

The SideWinder Precision Pro is the same way, but only the second-revision Precision Pros that say so on the bottom, not first-revision "3D Pro Plus" units.

Alas, while I'd like to have a USB adapter for Logitech ADI digital gameport sticks like the WingMan Interceptor (the single best stick they've ever made), none exists to my knowledge, as they don't have the following Microsoft did for their SideWinder sticks (hence the 3DP-Vert being developed).

I have the Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D and a MS Sidewinder 3D Pro Plus, and was bummed to find neither work in DOS.

I had a Logitech Wingman Extreme about 17 years back -- I think it was the same model as this new one I came by, and I recall it having a noticeable deadzone, which drove me crazy when I was playing Freelancer.

During the DOS days I had mostly CH joysticks and one Thrustmaster( at my job ). CH's sticks are my personal favorite. I've never had one fail on me and their precision was never a problem. My modern HOTAS is CH. I love their buttons and overall quality feel.

I've never used the Logitech or Microsoft, but I beat the hell out of a CH Flightstick for about 2 years or so, mostly by playing X-Wing and NASCAR. X-Wing is torture on a stick, and NASCAR requires perfect precision.
After all the past abuse, today it only has some slight wiggliness in the very center of travel (inside of where you feel initial resistance - what would likely be a deadzone in many games), and one of the buttons requires extra pressure. Impact on gameplay is just about negligible. It held up very well.
I picked up a couple more CH sticks at Goodwills in recent years and they're both perfect, like new. I guess those people didn't have X-Wing. 😀

Kind of unrelated, but I also have a CH joystick for the Apple II which is outstanding. Before that I had a Kraft and some other cheap thing, neither of which lasted. But to this day I can still play Wings of Fury with the CH and it will play perfectly. They made great joysticks.