It is all in the tastes and prefrences, in reality you can do everything with slot 1 440BX board, with hardware throttle and disabling internal cache. Sooooo... it it all in the prefrences and tastes, I own Computers from P3 era to 486 era, but mu main retro battlestation is a P3 600Mhz 440BX board with a Nvidia Geforce MX440 + Voodoo 4MB it runs allmost everything form CGA(OK EGA) to ... Windows 9x Glide.

No you have just discovered what everyone else here already knows - 486s are poor retro PCs, unless it is for nostalgia skip it.

I think you are asking this question b/c you want some encouragement rather than "making you keep looking into your wallet".

I hope I'm wrong but if I'm right, I can only say, "go build one".

A well-built 486 rig with great components is an art all by itself. It's because that was the last time when PC HW were dumb enough to obey at your will.

YOLO.

Hey, you can allways build a newer PCI based 486 rig. Or older ISA based rig. You have the freedom to just skip VLB era alltogether. Somehow VLB stuff never gave me any problems, well i never went over 33Mhz FSB limit. And usually only thing VLB in your rig should be the Video Card.

Your spot on with your original post.
If you didn't have the 386 you could have a reason
Only thing a 486 will really do is give you a chance to play around with VLB if that interests you enough to justify the expense.

Almoststew1990 wrote on 2020-01-29, 07:14:

I have a Slot 1 Pc for Windows 98 and DOS, as well as a 386SX for very old DOS games. Just about the only PC era I haven't built […]
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I have a Slot 1 Pc for Windows 98 and DOS, as well as a 386SX for very old DOS games. Just about the only PC era I haven't built and played around with is a 486 (I've had socket 7 PCs before).

However I'm struggling to see a reason to make one other than to tinker with the hardware itself (especially VLB), as my Slot 1 PC can do everything a 66 to 100 MHz 486 could do, but better and more conveniently. Right?

It's quite an expensive new build as I would need a case, CPU/mobo/ RAM, vlb video card.

Are 486 PCs great at anything my Slot 1 and 386 PC can't do?

I only have my VLB system, because I used one as my main machine, between early 1995 to around 1998'ish. Mostly I am using my 486-dx33 system more than any of my other 486 systems, and I probably use the same kind of games and software that you are using on your 386 system. My dx33 system is an ISA-Only system, and for some reason it just runs whatever Dos software I used to use before Doom came out. That is anything from 1992 and down. To me, 486 systems are pure nostalgia. Or in other words, they are retro to me. Pentium1 and up are not that retro to me, as I started to look at computers as tools and I have only faint personal attachments to those systems.

Basically.... If you can run what you need on the systems you already have. Then you really do not need a 486 system. On the other hand, tinkering with hardware are cool, so why the heck not?

Cyberdyne wrote on 2020-01-29, 07:45:

Hey, you can allways build a newer PCI based 486 rig. Or older ISA based rig. You have the freedom to just skip VLB era alltogether. Somehow VLB stuff never gave me any problems, well i never went over 33Mhz FSB limit. And usually only thing VLB in your rig should be the Video Card.

I have never seen a 40mhz FSB VLB system in person, that had issues. They have all been running perfect. The only 40mhz VLB system's that I have seen after 1996, are the one I have personally. (DX2-80 as of now, and DX4-120 that I do not have anymore) That said. I have read tons of posts the last couple of years, were people have issues with 40mhz FSB.

It must be the age of the hardware that gives all them issues.

I would just try to find a 486dx2@66mhz computer. ( OEM ).
Or even a 486sx-33 with overdrive socket and then upgrade the CPU to 486dx2-66mhz

Forget about VLB and just get an all ISA computer.
PCI computer is NOT needed.

With a 486dx2-66 you will have a very versatile computer that can play all kids of games.
You will be able to down clock it to 286@10mhz. Using the turbo button and “Setmul” utility. ( Set Multiplier).
So you can play old DOS games like “Wing Commander”.

A good 486 specs could be:
486dx2-66mhz
8mb to 16mb of ram
Tseng ET4000 graphics
Sound Blaster 16 or Pro 2.0 or Vibra 16s or Edison Gold.
4x to 32x CDROM.
Floppy drives ( 1.44 and 5.25 )
Socket 3, ISA motherboard with 256kb of cache.

VLB is pretty much the main appeal of 486s to me... I've upgraded from a 386DX to a P90 back in the day, so I too skipped 486 entirely.

now I also use a 386 for older stuff and tinker with 486 mainly for the fun of VLB.
if you've already got a 386 you're happy with I don't really see the need of an all ISA 486.

VLB controller only works with a compatible hard drive. I IDE hard drive under 420mb.
Otherwise it runs at 16-bit.

If you are going to run the CPU at 66mhz or slower ISA is fine.
There are ISA , Tseng ET4000 , 2mb video cards available.

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2020-02-01, 09:51:

I would just try to find a 486dx2@66mhz computer. ( OEM ). Or even a 486sx-33 with overdrive socket and then upgrade the CPU to […]
Show full quote

I would just try to find a 486dx2@66mhz computer. ( OEM ).
Or even a 486sx-33 with overdrive socket and then upgrade the CPU to 486dx2-66mhz

Forget about VLB and just get an all ISA computer.
PCI computer is NOT needed.

Uhmmm.... If you go for a DX2-66, then at least VLB is required. ISA-Only is for DX-33 and down.

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2020-02-01, 12:36:

VLB controller only works with a compatible hard drive. I IDE hard drive under 420mb.
Otherwise it runs at 16-bit.

I call bullshit on that. I bought an Iwill SIDE Jr PRO VLB controller in 1995, and that ran with an Quantum Trailblazer 800mb.
It depends on WHAT controller you have, if it have a BIOS and in that case what features that BIOS have.

brostenen wrote on 2020-02-01, 15:16:

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2020-02-01, 09:51:

I would just try to find a 486dx2@66mhz computer. ( OEM ). Or even a 486sx-33 with overdrive socket and then upgrade the CPU to […]
Show full quote

I would just try to find a 486dx2@66mhz computer. ( OEM ).
Or even a 486sx-33 with overdrive socket and then upgrade the CPU to 486dx2-66mhz

Forget about VLB and just get an all ISA computer.
PCI computer is NOT needed.

Uhmmm.... If you go for a DX2-66, then at least VLB is required. ISA-Only is for DX-33 and down.

required? VLB would run at 33MHz on both the DX-33 and DX2-66, I fail to see how it's required in either case

I agree with above. The appeal of a 486 is playing with VLB and the huge flexibility that the turbo button adds in combination with SETMUL. It will play games from 286-era up to about 1994 very wonderfully. But from a practical standpoint, your 386 already handles the low end while your Slot 1 handles the rest. But does it? Check this list for games where "Maximum Suitable CPU" is in the 486 range. If any of those games appeal to you, try them on your Slot 1 to see how they play. That might help answer your question.
https://www.vogonswiki.com/index.php/List_of_ … sensitive_games

maxtherabbit wrote on 2020-02-01, 15:27:

brostenen wrote on 2020-02-01, 15:16:

Uhmmm.... If you go for a DX2-66, then at least VLB is required. ISA-Only is for DX-33 and down.

required? VLB would run at 33MHz on both the DX-33 and DX2-66, I fail to see how it's required in either case

Yes. It is required, if you wish to have full power for games such as Doom.
Try playing Doom on a DX2-66 with ISA-Only. For that you need to be a masochist.
And playing doom on a DX-33 with ISA-Only.... Oh boy.. That is for a pain-slut.

If you want to game on a DX2-66, then go for VLB as a minimum, else forget anything gaming after December 31'st 1992.

brostenen wrote on 2020-02-01, 16:25:

If you want to game on a DX2-66, then go for VLB as a minimum, else forget anything gaming after December 31'st 1992.

required for DOOM != required for literally everything after 1992

maxtherabbit wrote on 2020-02-01, 16:29:

brostenen wrote on 2020-02-01, 16:25:

If you want to game on a DX2-66, then go for VLB as a minimum, else forget anything gaming after December 31'st 1992.

required for DOOM != required for literally everything after 1992

Exactly. Doom was my goto example, as the 486 platform are always showed off with Doom. It seems like that game is what people mostly do a 486 build for.
Going for an ISA-Only DX2-66, then you gain so little that a 386DX-40 are just as good.

The thing is. Benchmarks will tell a big difference, yet using them in real life, you really do not notice the difference between 386DX-40 and 486-DX2-66.
(IF they are both ISA-Only that is)

And as I told you. It is required to get the most out of the system. Just answering your statement on that you fail to see why VLB is required.

if the OP's reference 386 system was a 386DX-40 you could have an argument, but he's got a 386sx. A ISA-only 486DX-33 will still slay a 386sx

(I just bought a 1991 vintage ISA-only 486DX-33 board CPU combo yesterday, so I'm just a bit personally invested in this position 😀)

maxtherabbit wrote on 2020-02-01, 16:39:

if the OP's reference 386 system was a 386DX-40 you could have an argument, but he's got a 386sx. A ISA-only 486DX-33 will still slay a 386sx

(I just bought a 1991 vintage ISA-only 486DX-33 board CPU combo yesterday, so I'm just a bit personally invested in this position 😀)

Yup. 486dx will beat 386sx. Yet not by much. Yet as we know, VLB is for 486's and I was originally replying to "Intel486dx33's" post, that it is insane to run a 486dx2-66 on ISA-Only systems. That is the only point that I am serving up here.

That said. I have a 486dx-33 system that are ISA-Only. That system are reserved for games up to around 1991. For games between 1991 and 1992, I have my 486-DX2-80 VLB system (40mhz FSB) and for Dos games from Doom and up, I have my 5x86-133 (PCI/ISA based) and I have my Pentium-166 system for that as well. I even have a 286 for Monkey island and earlier.

My blogpost that I linked to, are not updated.... I have swapped the VGA card with this one below here.
And it is a wonderfull card. Pure and crisp video output, fast for a ISA-Card and gives NO vertical lines on LCD monitors.