Added the GUSar Lite. Thanks, @gordon-creAtive.com.

@matze79, unreleased cards like the Bitchin' Audio are on the list because they're interesting. I put "unreleased" in the description of any card that I know of in that category. Since I started maintaining the list, the Orpheus has gone from unreleased to released.

I keep looking for updates from Alan Hightower, but haven't seen anything. Has he said anything about the progress of the Bitchin' Fast Audio 3000 / Audio Loca?

matze79 wrote on 2020-12-01, 08:30:

Also non working dss clone is on the list, there is no firmware so it is no clone 😉

How close is the DSS clone to working? I thought it was successfully tested at this point?

digger wrote on 2020-12-02, 10:55:

matze79 wrote on 2020-12-01, 08:30:

Also non working dss clone is on the list, there is no firmware so it is no clone 😉

How close is the DSS clone to working? I thought it was successfully tested at this point?

My two-part DSS clone is completely untested. I never built it.
It is on this list because the combined power supply and amplifier section is a replica of the real thing and you should be able to use it with the original DAC dongle.
The new DAC dongle is an ATTiny-based design that does not have any firmware, yet.

I don't know if every one of these fits the intent of the thread (since many are not reproductions of vintage cards per se) but I was browsing @dreamblaster's threads and well, here they are.

WP32 McCake : MT32 compatible waveblaster board - hosts an RPi Compute Module (unreleased)
McFly : a VS1053 based waveblaster compatible board
E-Wave : an ESS based waveblaster card (unreleased)
New DreamBlaster S2 !
Dreamblaster X1 - Waveblaster compatible board with 32 mbyte flash - Pre Order Thread
DreamBlaster X2M : New MIDI Module
DreamBlaster X8 (unreleased)
DreamBlaster X16 Prototypes/Development thread (unreleased)
X3M
CrystalBlaster C1
CMSLPT : Creative music system (game blaster) on parallel port
TNDLPT : Tandy Sound on parallel port
OPL2LPT
OPL3LPT : OPL3 FM Synthesis on parallel port
MIDILPT
CVX4 : high quality covox adapter

Pierre32 wrote on 2020-12-15, 10:08:

I don't know if every one of these fits the intent of the thread (since many are not reproductions of vintage cards per se) but I was browsing @dreamblaster's threads and well, here they are.

Thank you for gathering these links. I have added the E-Wave (since it takes the Compaq Business Wavetable Sound Card and puts it on a WaveBlaster module), the WP32 McCake (as it can act like an MT-32), and the CrystalBlaster C1 (the CS9236 was used on the AOPEN / AW35 PRO).

As for the others, each is interesting, but they do not fit the intent of the thread.

• As far as I know, the McFly's chip was never used on a PC sound card back in the day, so it's not vintage, as crappy as it sounds.
• The DreamBlaster cards sound great to varying degrees, but use newly developed chips that were not used back in the day.
• The X3M is the equivalent of a DreamBlaster X2 in an external box with USB and MIDI-IN jacks. Neat, but doubly not vintage.
• As I understand it, the CVX2 has been superseded by the CVX4, which is already on the list.
• The CMSLPT, TNDLPT, OPL2LPT, OPL3LPT, and MIDILPT are useful for vintage laptops without expansion slots or for very modern computers without ISA slots, but they require patches or TSRs to be used in DOS games. As explained in the original post, these are new products, and this list only covers hardware that you can use with unmodified software to get a vintage sound experience.

Cool, appreciate the detailed response and glad to have added a few to the list. 😀

did anything ever come of the bitchin fast audio 3000?

Sphere478 wrote on 2021-01-28, 06:42:

did anything ever come of the bitchin fast audio 3000?

I wish. There's nothing new on his blog, and no mentions on the VCFed forums.

If you watch the video, eeguru honestly gets ahead of himself with all of the things the card could do, just because there's space in the FPGA, as opposed to what the card should do, especially in a first version. Like, first he's talking about putting every sound card in a single FPGA. Ambitious, OK, I get it, but a lot of them are really very simple (Tandy 1000, SID, CMS), while others are very well understood (SoundBlaster) and there's even an open-source FPGA implementation out there already for the OPL3. Doing Gravis UltraSound? That's quite hard because the chip is pretty complicated, and is definitely not as throughly reverse-engineered as the SoundBlaster. Doing wavetable synth inside the FPGA instead of just letting a WaveBlaster module do it? The complexity of this thing keeps going up and up and up.

Then the feature creep really sets in. Adding an ESP32 to get WiFi, Bluetooth Audio, and USB audio is just way beyond what a sound card needs. Throwing the XTIDE in there is nice, but this is a 16-bit ISA card, and AT class machines already have an ATA connector (by definition, it stands for "AT Attachment"), and there's already easy ways to mate an SD card to IDE!

LightStruk wrote on 2021-01-28, 14:47:

I wish. There's nothing new on his blog, and no mentions on the VCFed forums. […]
Show full quote

Sphere478 wrote on 2021-01-28, 06:42:

did anything ever come of the bitchin fast audio 3000?

I wish. There's nothing new on his blog, and no mentions on the VCFed forums.

If you watch the video, eeguru honestly gets ahead of himself with all of the things the card could do, just because there's space in the FPGA, as opposed to what the card should do, especially in a first version. Like, first he's talking about putting every sound card in a single FPGA. Ambitious, OK, I get it, but a lot of them are really very simple (Tandy 1000, SID, CMS), while others are very well understood (SoundBlaster) and there's even an open-source FPGA implementation out there already for the OPL3. Doing Gravis UltraSound? That's quite hard because the chip is pretty complicated, and is definitely not as throughly reverse-engineered as the SoundBlaster. Doing wavetable synth inside the FPGA instead of just letting a WaveBlaster module do it? The complexity of this thing keeps going up and up and up.

Then the feature creep really sets in. Adding an ESP32 to get WiFi, Bluetooth Audio, and USB audio is just way beyond what a sound card needs. Throwing the XTIDE in there is nice, but this is a 16-bit ISA card, and AT class machines already have an ATA connector (by definition, it stands for "AT Attachment"), and there's already easy ways to mate an SD card to IDE!

so it sounds like of the diy amalgamations Orpheus is only one truly available and the most developed?

Sphere478 wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:12:

so it sounds like of the diy amalgamations Orpheus is only one truly available and the most developed?

The Orpheus is not the only amalgamation worth considering.

• Tiido's KickAss Yamaha Based Sound Card has a YMF718 and a YMF721 on it, so it can do SoundBlaster Pro, Windows Sound System, OPL2, OPL3, OPL4, WaveBlaster modules, MPU-401 external MIDI, and Covox Speech Thing. It even adds another IDE port just in case you needed a CDROM drive connector.
• The AWE64 Legacy appears to be close to release. Its EMU8000 handles SoundBlaster 16 as well as wavetable AWE32/AWE64 MIDI. It adds a genuine OPL3 and a HardMPU to replace the CQM-synth and hanging-note-bug MPU-401 in the EMU8000.

I decided to put Tiido's card as a Yamaha card instead of an amalgamation because both of the primary chips are Yamaha chips. The AWE64 legacy is first and foremost a Sound Blaster, so it didn't feel like an amalgamation to me either, despite the presence of a HardMPU.

LightStruk wrote on 2021-01-29, 02:52:

The Orpheus is not the only amalgamation worth considering. […]
Show full quote

Sphere478 wrote on 2021-01-28, 19:12:

so it sounds like of the diy amalgamations Orpheus is only one truly available and the most developed?

The Orpheus is not the only amalgamation worth considering.

• Tiido's KickAss Yamaha Based Sound Card has a YMF718 and a YMF721 on it, so it can do SoundBlaster Pro, Windows Sound System, OPL2, OPL3, OPL4, WaveBlaster modules, MPU-401 external MIDI, and Covox Speech Thing. It even adds another IDE port just in case you needed a CDROM drive connector.
• The AWE64 Legacy appears to be close to release. Its EMU8000 handles SoundBlaster 16 as well as wavetable AWE32/AWE64 MIDI. It adds a genuine OPL3 and a HardMPU to replace the CQM-synth and hanging-note-bug MPU-401 in the EMU8000.

I decided to put Tiido's card as a Yamaha card instead of an amalgamation because both of the primary chips are Yamaha chips. The AWE64 legacy is first and foremost a Sound Blaster, so it didn't feel like an amalgamation to me either, despite the presence of a HardMPU.

Which of these (and Orpheus) would be most likely to work with later versions of windows? I may install up to windows 7 on this computer.

I talked with the guy behind Orpheus and he seems to think there is a chance windows xp and 2k have a included driver for their crystal chip but haven’t heard back any confirmation and I have no way to test that myself I don’t think?
Also, in your opinion which card is the best?

Is @Tiido 's card in stock though? Last I checked it wasn't available anymore..

appiah4 wrote on 2021-01-29, 07:52:

Is @Tiido 's card in stock though? Last I checked it wasn't available anymore..

I think you may be right, looks like the project may have died

Not dead, just on hold 🤣

Sphere478 wrote on 2021-01-29, 05:58:

Which of these (and Orpheus) would be most likely to work with later versions of windows? I may install up to windows 7 on this computer.

I talked with the guy behind Orpheus and he seems to think there is a chance windows xp and 2k have a included driver for their crystal chip but haven’t heard back any confirmation and I have no way to test that myself I don’t think?
Also, in your opinion which card is the best?

The Yamaha YMF71x has drivers for Windows 2000 and XP. As for the OPL4 that's also on Tiido's card, I don't know what utilities are available for controlling it from any version of Windows NT. Tiido would know better than I. Once it's configured, Windows should have no problem playing MIDI through it. If you get an original YMF71x card that's not Tiido's, then it won't have the OPL4 on it, it will just be a good SB Pro compatible with a true OPL3 built in and maybe subpar noise on the analog outputs.

I think a better question is, why would you want to use an ISA sound card on a Windows 2K/XP system? There are no benefits, since Windows NT does not allow direct access to the hardware. Later versions of NT (like XP or 7) require much beefier hardware, so you're going to have a motherboard with PCI slots on it at least, at which point you'd be much happier with a Yamaha YMF724, Yamaha YMF744, Aureal Vortex 2, or Sound Blaster Live! card. Their wavetable MIDI capabilities sound better than anything on an ISA card, and in the case of the Vortex 2 or SB Live, they have 3D positional audio capabilities. They're cheap, and SB Live! cards are very easy to find. The SB Live! also has a great software package with all sorts of fun tweaks and utilities.

If you insist on dual-booting Windows 7 and MS-DOS on the same computer, then I would HIGHLY recommend the YMF724 or YMF744, since that's the best DOS PCI sound card by far. We'll see if that sparks a disagreement in this thread. 😉 I speak from experience, as I have all four of these cards.

For PCI I would rate FM801>Solo-1>YMF7x4 for DOS as far as compatibility is concerned. FM synth quality is in reverse order. It really dependa on the chipset to be honest. FM801 works wonders in many hopeless situations.

Vortex2 for DOS sounds so bad I wouldnt use it at all..

I have run out of pci slots 🤣. But have isa slots a plenty

Benedikt wrote on 2020-12-09, 15:20:

My two-part DSS clone is completely untested. I never built it. It is on this list because the combined power supply and amplifi […]
Show full quote

digger wrote on 2020-12-02, 10:55:

matze79 wrote on 2020-12-01, 08:30:

Also non working dss clone is on the list, there is no firmware so it is no clone 😉

How close is the DSS clone to working? I thought it was successfully tested at this point?

My two-part DSS clone is completely untested. I never built it.
It is on this list because the combined power supply and amplifier section is a replica of the real thing and you should be able to use it with the original DAC dongle.
The new DAC dongle is an ATTiny-based design that does not have any firmware, yet.

Not to be ungrateful to all the people working on all these cool projects and pouring their own free time into them, but given how relatively simple and well-documented the Disney Sound Source is, as well as the relatively long list of games that support it (much longer than the list of games that support the Covox Speech Thing), I am frankly surprised that someone like dreamblaster hasn't developed a CVX5 that you can switch between Disney Sound Source, Covox Speech Thing and Stereo-on-one mode. Something like that would be relatively cheap, and would provide sound support for a surprisingly extensive list of games to computers and older laptops lacking ISA slots. I'm pretty sure that Serdashop and 8-bit Guy could sell a lot of those.

The DSS is basically just a 16-byte FIFO buffer connected to a fixed-frequency 7KHz DAC, right? I would imagine that for an experienced hardware hobbyist, something like that would be quite trivial to reproduce.

I was wondering - and I hope this is an ok place to ask the question - which of the Serda waveblaster boards is considered to be "the top, premium one"? It seems that the Dreamblaster S2 is the most expensive, so should I assume it to be the one?

There are quite a few options now, and choice becomes harder (when budget is not unlimited!, unfortunately).

Shreddoc wrote on 2021-01-31, 21:46:

I was wondering - and I hope this is an ok place to ask the question - which of the Serda waveblaster boards is considered to be "the top, premium one"? It seems that the Dreamblaster S2 is the most expensive, so should I assume it to be the one?

There are quite a few options now, and choice becomes harder (when budget is not unlimited!, unfortunately).

My two cents:

With the two available Dream-based boards, you can safely go by price: Dreamblaster S2 vs X2

The overall "best" is probably a showdown between the X2 and the Yucatan FX (with its real Roland GS ROM). That's going to come down to your ears and feature preferences.

The Crystal Blaster, McFly and upcoming E-Wave are more 'special interest' items which aren't trying to compete with the above. My money's reserved for an E-Wave, personally 😀