VOGONS


Reply 440 of 619, by Brute389

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ragefury32 wrote on 2021-04-01, 14:58:
Yes indeed, it was a 754. The later PCG-SRs (beyond SR9) are YMF754 machines, not 744. […]
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Brute389 wrote on 2021-04-01, 08:13:

In talking with him prior to this, he indeed does have a ymf754. I have the same sound chip in my C1VJ, and it plays out exactly as he describes. I used setupds 3.16 and even 3.17 to try to get it to work and it would only come back with 8 bit sound. I have been looking around on old sites and recovery discs for Sony vxd drivers for the 754, but I don't believe any official ones were made as wdm drivers became mainstay. It indeed seems like a modded pack needs to be made. I was wondering if maybe the wdm drivers could be installed first then slipstream the vxd drivers to trick the system?

Yes indeed, it was a 754. The later PCG-SRs (beyond SR9) are YMF754 machines, not 744.

I don't think the issue is the driver version per-se, since the VxD drivers that you have and the one for Phil's should support the 744s and 754s. I also got the audio working on Windows...once, but that was in the middle of me installing some other missing things...and somehow the config stabilized and the ability went away. I also know that the hardware is functional since I still have the original HDD with a working Win2K install (which came with the original Japanese Windows 2000 driver pack, plus the SR31k recovery disk ISO is on archive.org).

As Brute389 would've put it, there were no VxD drivers available from Sony in question, but I think the issue goes beyond simply the audio drivers. I think we need to initialize the other hardware in the machine so the resources are bumped into place correctly. Once that's done the hardware "should" work. The missing drivers are the ones for the Sony Programmable I/O controller (sonyPI), the Conexant WinModem and maybe the magicGate memory stick controller - like I've said, most of those missing drivers should be in the recovery image/driver archive for the SR1BP, which is one of the first in the series and runs Win98SE natively. it obviously doesn't help that Sony pulled the drivers back in 2017, and there's only a 455GB, multi-part driver set for vaio-link.com on archive.org that is not well documented.

I do not know how much it will help you, but I can upload the restore disks for my C1VJ to archive. It seems Sony laptops in this era all shared similar hardware and drivers, and I have all of those drivers you mentioned on those cds. As for you cyclone3d, the drivers on the cd are for windows ME if you are interested in them too.

Reply 441 of 619, by ragefury32

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-01, 16:36:
Ok... Gotcha. I don't think I have one of the Vaio laptops with the ymf754 but I'll double check. […]
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Ok... Gotcha. I don't think I have one of the Vaio laptops with the ymf754 but I'll double check.

The Vaio ftp backup that is on archive.org is from me as well so I am a little bit familiar with it.

If you can get me the PCI ID for the sound device in Windows on that laptop that would be great.

Edit:
I was actually going through stuff last night and pulled out a PCG-F680. Guessing it does have a YMF754 as it is a newer model and the drivers I found say DS-XG but even though the laptop originally came with Windows ME, the only downloads I see popping up are for 2000 and XP. Marketing specs say Hardware MIDI so that should mean it is really DS-XG and not XG-AC(AC97 only). And to top it off, the person that had it before me installed XP on it... grrrr. At least it will be super easy to see the PCI ID

I'll take a look at it a little while to see if I can get the 2019 VXD drivers working on it. Hopefully only a .inf edit will be required.

Not quite Windows, but I was able to pull the PCI ID from the Linux lspci command:

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(Yes, I tried adding the subsystem ID onto the inf file on your driver set - doesn’t seem to fix anything).

I also managed to find something...disturbing about these Sony Vaios - the power circuitry contains a ticking time bomb in the form of the ADI 3421 power regulator...the same chip at the heart of the ThinkPad A/T2x blink of death power issues.

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Not this crap again....??
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Better start looking into replacing them...

Reply 442 of 619, by cyclone3d

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Ok, so the PCG-F380 actually has the YMF744 as well.

But the 754 ID matches up with what I found by doing a search.

I didn't figure just adding that ID to the 2006 set would work. I need to mod the 2019 set and hopefully get it working with the Sony Vaio laptops.

It would be really helpful if I had a VAIO laptop with the 754.. hmmm.

Edit.... It looks like I do actually have one. The PCG-SR17K. It came to me with Windows 2000 on it so I have a bit of work to do such as backing up keys and any other interesting stuff that is currently on it but at least I have something to test on instead of just trying to blindly put together a modded driver package.

Quite a while ago I went on a sort of rampage of collecting the old VAIO laptops that specified Hardware Wavetable in the marketing specification sheets and I have never really had time to mess with most of them.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 443 of 619, by ragefury32

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-02, 07:21:
Ok, so the PCG-F380 actually has the YMF744 as well. […]
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Ok, so the PCG-F380 actually has the YMF744 as well.

But the 754 ID matches up with what I found by doing a search.

I didn't figure just adding that ID to the 2006 set would work. I need to mod the 2019 set and hopefully get it working with the Sony Vaio laptops.

It would be really helpful if I had a VAIO laptop with the 754.. hmmm.

Edit.... It looks like I do actually have one. The PCG-SR17K. It came to me with Windows 2000 on it so I have a bit of work to do such as backing up keys and any other interesting stuff that is currently on it but at least I have something to test on instead of just trying to blindly put together a modded driver package.

Quite a while ago I went on a sort of rampage of collecting the old VAIO laptops that specified Hardware Wavetable in the marketing specification sheets and I have never really had time to mess with most of them.

The SR17k should be a 700MHz model model just like my SR9G/K - to be honest Sony could've done everyone and their mother a favor by releasing a single model and not "bin" the minor variations. I mean, just look at these block diagrams for the 2 major models.

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The service manual for the 27k should also apply for the 1,7,9,17,21, 31, 33 and other models in the PCG-SR series.
https://tim.id.au/laptops/sony/pcg-sr27%20sr27k.pdf

Reply 444 of 619, by cyclone3d

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Just some progress to report. I have the 2019 set installing and it is not giving me any errors or yellow exclamation marks in Device Manager but I am not getting any output.

I noticed on the 2006 VAIO set that the mixer settings were different so I think that may be about the last thing I have to mess with. I wasn't sure if the settings changed between the 2006 and 2019 set or if the settings in the 2006 set were what is needed for the VAIO laptops to output audio since there is of course no explanation.

I may also need to mess with a few other things as well, but I am only going to try changing one thing at a time.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 445 of 619, by Horun

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Isn't "The quest for the perfect retro laptop" sort of a conundrum. There is no such thing as is there is no such thing as "The quest for the perfect retro PC" .
Just my opinion but the title is wrong as it is very dependent on person perspective.
That said I do enjoy all reading all the entries and many are of great value. Just have an issue with the title ;p

Hate posting a reply and then have to edit it because it made no sense 😁 First computer was an IBM 3270 workstation with CGA monitor.

Reply 446 of 619, by dr_st

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Horun wrote on 2021-04-04, 03:34:

There is no such thing as is there is no such thing as "The quest for the perfect retro PC" .

Modern PC running DOSBox with SW MIDI synths?

*Anti-rotten-eggs defense systems activated*

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Reply 447 of 619, by cyclone3d

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Well... edited the main .INF file, saved it, and went to turn the PCG-SR17k on so I could test my new edit... and nothing. Completely disassembled it to check for back connections and to look for anything else obvious. After reassembly it still won't do anything at all. Maybe the power board went out. Or maybe the bboard that has the power switch on it. Who knows. UGGGHHHH.

I verified the power adapter is working by using it on another known working laptop (PCG-SR7k) and it worked so guess that laptop just bit the dust.

I can still sorta test my driver edit as I modified it to hopefully work with the ones that have the YMF744 in them as well.

I'm done for the night.. I'll mess with it again tomorrow and I guess keep an eye out for another working VAIO with the YMF754.

Edit: Went ahead and tried it on a PCG-XG29 and my edited .INF files did the trick to get version 2019 working.

Now I just need to try installing from scratch instead of upgrading from 2006 as it didn't seem to update the applications properly.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 448 of 619, by Bruninho

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The perfect retro laptop/pc is what serves the purposes of each individual person, not a single, unique computer for all.

"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.

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Reply 449 of 619, by cyclone3d

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So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning.

I tested my latest modded driver and it still doesn't output sound but it does make a click when the driver loads.

I decided to go looking for a specific YMF754 driver and actually found a full package with different .INF files for different codec chips. It also has instructions on what to do to make it work with the different codec chips.

It is basically the original 2019 vxd version from Yamaha but was released by a different company.

I am almost 100% sure I can get this version working. I just need to check what codec chips the VAIO laptops use with the YMF754.

I also ordered a spare motherboard which has a PIII 600, Neomagic 256XL+ and the YMF754. Not exactly sure what SR model it is from, but from the looks of it, the SR series all use the same exact form factor motherboard so i can put it in my other SR laptop that won't power up if I can't get it working.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 450 of 619, by Warlord

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sounds interesting. The Toshiba I got with the 754 worked with some Toshiba VXD drivers from another model I found but, I wouldn't mind having a look at that driver pack you found. Might have better drivers than the ones I got. Supposidly there is some gateway solo laptop with a geforce 2 go and some ESS chipset. Even though I already have the ultimate laptop imo its not without its flaws so the search continues.

I have an old IBM t41 that I don't think is a good laptop but I plan on using it as a testbench to get my audigy2zs pcmcia card working in 98se, I never actually tried this and everyone says it doesn't work, but I want to give it a go and see if I can force some VXDs to run on it.

Reply 451 of 619, by ragefury32

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-04, 21:48:
So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning. […]
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So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning.

I tested my latest modded driver and it still doesn't output sound but it does make a click when the driver loads.

I decided to go looking for a specific YMF754 driver and actually found a full package with different .INF files for different codec chips. It also has instructions on what to do to make it work with the different codec chips.

It is basically the original 2019 vxd version from Yamaha but was released by a different company.

I am almost 100% sure I can get this version working. I just need to check what codec chips the VAIO laptops use with the YMF754.

I also ordered a spare motherboard which has a PIII 600, Neomagic 256XL+ and the YMF754. Not exactly sure what SR model it is from, but from the looks of it, the SR series all use the same exact form factor motherboard so i can put it in my other SR laptop that won't power up if I can't get it working.

Yeah, that’s the symptom of a failing AD3421 chip - your power circuitry will not fire up after a period of usage, but after a day or 2 it’ll come back to life. Unfortunate the chip will eventually degrade and the machine will require that chip to be replaced.

As for the codec I’ll need to take the SR9GK apart and see which chip it uses. Yeah, we should be able to get it working...it’s just a matter of making the right tweaks to it. I would also like to have the machine not report a bunch of unknown devices in Win98, though.

Reply 452 of 619, by ragefury32

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Warlord wrote on 2021-04-04, 22:51:

Supposidly there is some gateway solo laptop with a geforce 2 go and some ESS chipset.

The Gateway Solo 9550 series? It’s an ESS Allegro. Don’t forget that the Tualatin machine runs off an 815EM with an ICH0/1 southbridge (which doesn’t do DDMA), so unless Gateway wired up the SB-Link from the audio chip’s pin out to the southbridge, DOS audio will be problematic.

Reply 454 of 619, by ragefury32

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Warlord wrote on 2021-04-04, 23:27:

my Toshiba 815em with XG works perfectly in every game I tried it on. It doesn't have sb-link, pretty sure DDMA is working though or the XG driver is magic.

@Kamerat how does the DS-XGs implement Audio on ICH machines? AFAIK the ICH series does not support DDMA. This was specifically mentioned in an Intel datasheet.

Reply 455 of 619, by cyclone3d

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All you need is a pci-isa bridge chip. There are boards with up to the ich5 with it.

There are industrial boards with isa slots with full isa support.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 456 of 619, by Bruninho

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I wish I still had this one with me: ?u=https%3A%2F%2Fc1.staticflickr.com%2F1%2F183%2F384504478_c587de5398_z.jpg%3Fzz%3D1&f=1&nofb=1

Was my first laptop back in 90's. That one would be the perfect retro laptop for me but after 30 years lost somewhere in a box full of dust, it was totally dead.

"Design isn't just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works."
JOBS, Steve.

List of ALL Android vulnerabilities

Reply 457 of 619, by schmatzler

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ragefury32 wrote on 2021-04-04, 23:13:
cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-04, 21:48:

So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning.

Yeah, that’s the symptom of a failing AD3421 chip - your power circuitry will not fire up after a period of usage, but after a day or 2 it’ll come back to life. Unfortunate the chip will eventually degrade and the machine will require that chip to be replaced.

I fear the day this happens (again) on my A22p. Although I have a bunch of ADP3421's lying around, you never know if they're good or not.
If there was a real replacement for that chip we could save so many machines...

Reply 458 of 619, by cyclone3d

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ragefury32 wrote on 2021-04-04, 23:13:
cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-04, 21:48:
So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning. […]
Show full quote

So... The laptop that stopped powering up last night was working again this morning.

I tested my latest modded driver and it still doesn't output sound but it does make a click when the driver loads.

I decided to go looking for a specific YMF754 driver and actually found a full package with different .INF files for different codec chips. It also has instructions on what to do to make it work with the different codec chips.

It is basically the original 2019 vxd version from Yamaha but was released by a different company.

I am almost 100% sure I can get this version working. I just need to check what codec chips the VAIO laptops use with the YMF754.

I also ordered a spare motherboard which has a PIII 600, Neomagic 256XL+ and the YMF754. Not exactly sure what SR model it is from, but from the looks of it, the SR series all use the same exact form factor motherboard so i can put it in my other SR laptop that won't power up if I can't get it working.

Yeah, that’s the symptom of a failing AD3421 chip - your power circuitry will not fire up after a period of usage, but after a day or 2 it’ll come back to life. Unfortunate the chip will eventually degrade and the machine will require that chip to be replaced.

As for the codec I’ll need to take the SR9GK apart and see which chip it uses. Yeah, we should be able to get it working...it’s just a matter of making the right tweaks to it. I would also like to have the machine not report a bunch of unknown devices in Win98, though.

Just took my SR17k apart to look at it. The codec chip is the AKM4543.

So now I am going to try this driver and see how it works.

Fun thing about this full driver set is that it should work for all 744 and 754 solutions... mwahahaha.

According to the release notes, 4.12.01.2019 only supports 744 and 754.

I'm also wondering about the 4.07.1040 driver set as the release notes mention that it was changed from 4.06 to 4.07 when DX7 support was added... I'm not finding any info on exactly what the 4.12 drive set added over the 4.07 set.... maybe 4.07.1040 is the best vxd set for the other chipsets.

Yamaha YMF modified setupds and drivers
Yamaha XG resource repository - updated November 27, 2018
Yamaha YMF7x4 Guide
AW744L II - YMF744 - AOpen Cobra Sound Card - Install SB-Link Header

Reply 459 of 619, by ragefury32

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cyclone3d wrote on 2021-04-05, 01:04:

All you need is a pci-isa bridge chip. There are boards with up to the ich5 with it.

There are industrial boards with isa slots with full isa support.

Yeah, but how many i815 laptops come with a PCI-ISA bridge chip inside? Yamaha does have that DSDMA TSR that's supposed to work on the ICHs, but no such luck with the ESS Allegro/Maestro series...not sure about ESS Solo-1 but the situation is probably similar.

Last edited by ragefury32 on 2021-04-05, 05:00. Edited 3 times in total.