newtmonkey wrote on 2024-10-20, 02:29:

I definitely recommend at least playing through PoR, which I consider one of the greatest RPGs ever made (definitely in the top five of all time for me). If you ever decide to play it, I can offer some general hints (no spoilers). 😀

Okay, I think I'm ready! First, should I follow the advice of GBC and create my party outside of GBC? They say to start the game in DOSBox, create characters, save, then start GBC. I'm not sure why...

Second, any party composition tips? I just read over at Gamebanshee the following:

Party Composition […]
Show full quote

Party Composition

Thieves have little to do in the game (any door that can be picked can also be bashed or knocked), but there is one sequence where a thief is useful. So you should have one thief in your party, but no more.

Mages start out pretty weak (they can only learn one spell), and even at later levels they'll blow through their spells pretty quickly. That means you should definitely multi-class your mages, preferably with the fighter class, so the mage can use all equipment and wield a good ranged weapon.

A potential party is listed below. Races and genders are almost immaterial, so pick whatever you want (as long as the race allows for the class combo you're aiming for).

1 x F: Fighters can go all the way to level 8, and they probably won't hit the cap until near the end of the game, so it's useful to have one pure fighter in your party.

1 x F/T: Thieves don't do a lot in the game, and a pure thief is a waste of time.

2 x F/C: You're only going to get one healing spell in the game, and that's the wimpy "cure light wounds" spell, so it's useful to have a couple of clerics in your party. Clerics can only reach level 6, so there isn't any reason not to multi-class them.

2 x F/M: Mages only get one spell at level 1, and they'll only get eight spells at level 6 (their maximum), so you'll need to multi-class them so they can help you out in battle after they've expended their spells. Since fighters get to use the best ranged weapons, and since you probably won't want your mages to get into melee range, the fighter class is the best way to go.

Seems reasonable. Any counter suggestions?

Thanks!

Finished the Mac version of the original Prince of Persia, for the first time in my life, using the in-browser emulator on Macintosh Repository. It's amazing, that other than the different, higher resolution graphics and different audio hardware, the game itself plays almost exactly like the DOS version, down to very subtle timing and position specifics. There were only a couple of places where I felt there might be a difference. One of which is the encounter with your reflection. Turns out he can stab and kill you in one-hit if you sheathe the sword immediately. This never happens to me in the DOS version. The solution is to hit him once (taking damage) so that he pauses, and then sheath the sword.

Now I want to try the Mac version of Prince of Persia 2.

In the past week I have beaten five Castlevania games for the first time, purely because I wanted a reason to play through Symphony of the Night again. I played through the NES games using modern romhacks like the retranslation of Simon's Quest and the translation for the Famicom version of 3 for extra sound channels and animations, and then IV/Bloodlines were just done as is. Next is Rondo, which I've also never gotten through.

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-02, 11:19:

Okay, I think I'm ready! First, should I follow the advice of GBC and create my party outside of GBC? They say to start the game in DOSBox, create characters, save, then start GBC. I'm not sure why...

Second, any party composition tips? I just read over at Gamebanshee the following:

I'm glad to hear you're going to give this game a try! I'm looking forward to reading your thoughts about this one.

I'm honestly not sure about that advice from GBC, though now that I think about it, I did create my party without GBC at first (I initially was playing PoR on my dedicated DOS machine). It's probably safest to do what GBC says and generate the party without GBC.

One crucial thing to keep in mind for Pool of Radiance is that the game allows you to either roll your stats during character creation, or modify them to whatever you want. The latter option is a bit of a trap, because the game scales the encounters based partially on your ability scores. If you modify everyone to all 18s, you will encounter massive hordes of random encounters, which makes the game extremely tedious. It's best to roll fairly (rolling decent characters really doesn't take very long). My advice is to roll until you get an 18 in your main attribute for the character (i.e. Wisdom for clerics, Intelligence for magic users, Strength for fighters, Dexterity for thieves), but also try to get as high scores as you can in DEX and CON for everyone. DEX is important especially if you want to take the same party through to Pools of Darkness, but not really that important in just PoR.

As for party composition, you have some flexibility. The demihuman level limits are not a problem for PoR (they only become a problem for the sequels). But even if your party would not be viable for the sequels, you could always just transfer over the humans and generate new characters for those games. One exception would be a dwarf fighter/thief, as he has no limit on thief levels and gains a second attack before hitting the level limit for fighter (assuming his ability scores are high enough). Personally, I stuck with humans for everything else. I disagree with the advice from Game Banshee with regard to mages, as I definitely recommend pure magic users (preferably two), because magic is extremely useful at both low and high levels, and it's beneficial to gain access to higher level spells more quickly.

My party was:
- Human fighter
- Human fighter
- Dwarf fighter/thief
- Human cleric
- Human magic user
- Human magic user

This got me through PoR without a problem at all, and also got me through Curse of the Azure Bonds and Secret of the Silver Blades pretty easily.

---

Some other general hints:

- Most areas have only a limited number of random encounters, and so you can exhaust them, making exploration safe. This means that the game is less about resource conservation over multiple battles (like Wizardry), and more about doing whatever you can to survive each individual battle (like Might & Magic). Every battle you win means you're one step closer to clearing that area.
- The game becomes quite nonlinear a few hours in, so if you encounter a tough fixed encounter that seems impossible, you can always go explore elsewhere and come back later.
- Enabling "search" mode will make time go faster each step, which means more encounters. It's best to use it pretty selectively; for example, you should turn search ON only when in rooms, and turn it OFF in hallways. It is extremely important to search, though, because there are a lot of hidden stashes in rooms, and this is the only way to find magic equipment (and also, you earn most of your EXP through finding treasure and solving quest). Another option is to use the "look" command which basically just searches the space you're standing on.
- The game doesn't tell you after battle if equipment is magical or not, so it's a good idea to have your magic users keep one "Detect Magic" memorized at all times; casting this will indicate magic items with an asterisk, so you know to pick them up. You have to take magic items to a store to actually ID them.
- Magic users can learn new spells when they level up, but can also learn new spells by scribing scrolls at camp, so it's worth hanging onto scrolls until you learn all the spells from them.
- The most useful spells are Sleep and Magic Missile early on, then Hold Person (cleric) and Stinking Cloud, then Fireball and Lightning Bolt. Other useful spells to cast before tough battles include Bless/Pray (cleric) and Haste. Casting Haste alone on a strong fighter or two can trivialize even tough fights.
- Money is mostly useless throughout the game (and the entire series), so it's enough to just have your fighters keep a few hundred platinum coins on hand to pay for training
- You can hire a couple of mercenaries if you need to beef up your frontline during tough battles. They'll steal some EXP, but you'll probably reach the level limits for the game anyway, so it's not a problem.
- You can abuse the rest command if you really need to, since encounters are random. Just save before resting, and if you get interrupted, you can just close the game, reload, and try again. But you probably won't need to do this.

newtmonkey wrote on 2024-11-03, 09:51:

I'm glad to hear you're going to give this game a try! I'm looking forward to reading your thoughts about this one. […]
Show full quote

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-02, 11:19:

Okay, I think I'm ready! First, should I follow the advice of GBC and create my party outside of GBC? They say to start the game in DOSBox, create characters, save, then start GBC. I'm not sure why...

Second, any party composition tips? I just read over at Gamebanshee the following:

I'm glad to hear you're going to give this game a try! I'm looking forward to reading your thoughts about this one.

I'm honestly not sure about that advice from GBC, though now that I think about it, I did create my party without GBC at first (I initially was playing PoR on my dedicated DOS machine). It's probably safest to do what GBC says and generate the party without GBC.

One crucial thing to keep in mind for Pool of Radiance is that the game allows you to either roll your stats during character creation, or modify them to whatever you want. The latter option is a bit of a trap, because the game scales the encounters based partially on your ability scores. If you modify everyone to all 18s, you will encounter massive hordes of random encounters, which makes the game extremely tedious. It's best to roll fairly (rolling decent characters really doesn't take very long). My advice is to roll until you get an 18 in your main attribute for the character (i.e. Wisdom for clerics, Intelligence for magic users, Strength for fighters, Dexterity for thieves), but also try to get as high scores as you can in DEX and CON for everyone. DEX is important especially if you want to take the same party through to Pools of Darkness, but not really that important in just PoR.

As for party composition, you have some flexibility. The demihuman level limits are not a problem for PoR (they only become a problem for the sequels). But even if your party would not be viable for the sequels, you could always just transfer over the humans and generate new characters for those games. One exception would be a dwarf fighter/thief, as he has no limit on thief levels and gains a second attack before hitting the level limit for fighter (assuming his ability scores are high enough). Personally, I stuck with humans for everything else. I disagree with the advice from Game Banshee with regard to mages, as I definitely recommend pure magic users (preferably two), because magic is extremely useful at both low and high levels, and it's beneficial to gain access to higher level spells more quickly.

My party was:
- Human fighter
- Human fighter
- Dwarf fighter/thief
- Human cleric
- Human magic user
- Human magic user

This got me through PoR without a problem at all, and also got me through Curse of the Azure Bonds and Secret of the Silver Blades pretty easily.

---

Some other general hints:

- Most areas have only a limited number of random encounters, and so you can exhaust them, making exploration safe. This means that the game is less about resource conservation over multiple battles (like Wizardry), and more about doing whatever you can to survive each individual battle (like Might & Magic). Every battle you win means you're one step closer to clearing that area.
- The game becomes quite nonlinear a few hours in, so if you encounter a tough fixed encounter that seems impossible, you can always go explore elsewhere and come back later.
- Enabling "search" mode will make time go faster each step, which means more encounters. It's best to use it pretty selectively; for example, you should turn search ON only when in rooms, and turn it OFF in hallways. It is extremely important to search, though, because there are a lot of hidden stashes in rooms, and this is the only way to find magic equipment (and also, you earn most of your EXP through finding treasure and solving quest). Another option is to use the "look" command which basically just searches the space you're standing on.
- The game doesn't tell you after battle if equipment is magical or not, so it's a good idea to have your magic users keep one "Detect Magic" memorized at all times; casting this will indicate magic items with an asterisk, so you know to pick them up. You have to take magic items to a store to actually ID them.
- Magic users can learn new spells when they level up, but can also learn new spells by scribing scrolls at camp, so it's worth hanging onto scrolls until you learn all the spells from them.
- The most useful spells are Sleep and Magic Missile early on, then Hold Person (cleric) and Stinking Cloud, then Fireball and Lightning Bolt. Other useful spells to cast before tough battles include Bless/Pray (cleric) and Haste. Casting Haste alone on a strong fighter or two can trivialize even tough fights.
- Money is mostly useless throughout the game (and the entire series), so it's enough to just have your fighters keep a few hundred platinum coins on hand to pay for training
- You can hire a couple of mercenaries if you need to beef up your frontline during tough battles. They'll steal some EXP, but you'll probably reach the level limits for the game anyway, so it's not a problem.
- You can abuse the rest command if you really need to, since encounters are random. Just save before resting, and if you get interrupted, you can just close the game, reload, and try again. But you probably won't need to do this.

Thank you so much! Character creation time...

I played the first hour or so of Fallout 3 again! i hadn't intended too but i just love that sense of first coming out of the vault and stumbling to megaton and some of those things. in every playthrough i always end up "short circuiting" a feature of the game, eg disarming the bomb before seeing Burke or doing the replicated man missing options with Harkness 😀 i 'm not sure i'll play through again though, i just really like the setting and the environment. i notice that i play the same way each time anyway! i just don't get much from playing evil karma so tend to help npcs out and end up pretty much the same in skills etc

Dragon Age: The Veilguard.

It's beautiful, well-written, the combat is a lot of fun and I'm already 70 hours in. Well done, Bioware.

Pixel Gun 3D: https://youtu.be/VN7To-y5r8Y?si=isK3IG8oVvO5Fmll
World of Padman 1.7(new beta): https://youtu.be/WhuBS181w3E?si=uO_lVzXI76WH6iim

I've "kinda" started Pool of Radiance. Created my characters, walked around the Civilized District a bit, and parked myself in one of the weapons shops while I learn the interface. I had to find the reference card online to get a feel for the keyboard commands:
https://www.starehry.eu/download/rpg/docs/Poo … adiance-QRC.pdf
Using Gold Box Companion. Hoping to get some good time in this weekend!

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-08, 23:12:

I've "kinda" started Pool of Radiance. Created my characters, walked around the Civilized District a bit, and parked myself in one of the weapons shops while I learn the interface. I had to find the reference card online to get a feel for the keyboard commands:
https://www.starehry.eu/download/rpg/docs/Poo … adiance-QRC.pdf
Using Gold Box Companion. Hoping to get some good time in this weekend!

I'm excited to read about your adventures! What party did you end up making?

newtmonkey wrote on 2024-11-09, 02:01:

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-08, 23:12:

I've "kinda" started Pool of Radiance. Created my characters, walked around the Civilized District a bit, and parked myself in one of the weapons shops while I learn the interface. I had to find the reference card online to get a feel for the keyboard commands:
https://www.starehry.eu/download/rpg/docs/Poo … adiance-QRC.pdf
Using Gold Box Companion. Hoping to get some good time in this weekend!

I'm excited to read about your adventures! What party did you end up making?

I copied your party. 😀 Gave them names from Ultima, Dragonlance, and my unique name I made up for all of my main RPG protagonists.

edit: the interface learning curve is a bit steep. I'm having to literally read the manual, as there is no reference card that encompasses all commands, and the interface commands are interwoven in the text of the manual. Every playthrough I've watched, the player is very comfortable with the interface and breezes through it faster than I can watch and learn from. So RTFM it is.

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-08, 23:12:

I copied your party. 😀

Excellent choice! 😉
Backstabbing is very weird in PoR, so that fighter/thief might not seem useful at first, but he/she will become a powerhouse in Curse and Silver Blades (and even toward the end of PoR, once you figure out how it works). I don't remember the PoR rules 100%, but I think you have to attack the enemy with two different characters before you do the backstab. It's worth reading up on it, though, because you can do some crazy damage if you set it up right.
I really hope you like this one! If things get annoying/tedious/frustrating, please do post! I got frustrated several times, but it always ended up being due to my not understanding something correctly, but I ended up loving the game. It's a really fair game once you figure out how it works (definitely take advantage of the multiple save slots; I made sure to save on slot A only in town, and then use the other slots while I was in dangerous areas).

---

As for the UI, I agree. It's actually a step back imo from Wizardry and Might & Magic, but you will get used to it quickly. The Gold Box engine usually lets you just press the first letter of any command to execute it (I don't remember 100%, but am pretty sure PoR allows this too). Later games let you use the directional keys to control the menus, but I think PoR makes you use Home and End as Up and Down.

I think the only big UI issue other than that is having to juggle around gold (easiest is just to not pick up anything other than gems and jewels, and then to Pool then Share to split stuff up).

newtmonkey wrote on 2024-11-09, 12:43:

Excellent choice! ;) Backstabbing is very weird in PoR, so that fighter/thief might not seem useful at first, but he/she will be […]
Show full quote

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-08, 23:12:

I copied your party. 😀

Excellent choice! 😉
Backstabbing is very weird in PoR, so that fighter/thief might not seem useful at first, but he/she will become a powerhouse in Curse and Silver Blades (and even toward the end of PoR, once you figure out how it works). I don't remember the PoR rules 100%, but I think you have to attack the enemy with two different characters before you do the backstab. It's worth reading up on it, though, because you can do some crazy damage if you set it up right.
I really hope you like this one! If things get annoying/tedious/frustrating, please do post! I got frustrated several times, but it always ended up being due to my not understanding something correctly, but I ended up loving the game. It's a really fair game once you figure out how it works (definitely take advantage of the multiple save slots; I made sure to save on slot A only in town, and then use the other slots while I was in dangerous areas).

---

As for the UI, I agree. It's actually a step back imo from Wizardry and Might & Magic, but you will get used to it quickly. The Gold Box engine usually lets you just press the first letter of any command to execute it (I don't remember 100%, but am pretty sure PoR allows this too). Later games let you use the directional keys to control the menus, but I think PoR makes you use Home and End as Up and Down.

I think the only big UI issue other than that is having to juggle around gold (easiest is just to not pick up anything other than gems and jewels, and then to Pool then Share to split stuff up).

I've got about 2.5 hours in the game now, and just barely started exploring The Slums. I'm taking it slow with the UI and have quit and reloaded a few times when I unintentionally made a selection that I didn't understand. Go back to manual, read and realize that's not what I meant. 😉 There are lots of options that are not obvious to me, such as Wait, Advance, Parlay, Auto vs Manual Aiming, Target (who knew this actually Attacked?), Delay, etc.

The combat is fun, the spell-casting is slow, deliberate, and very limited at this stage. Watching YouTubers play this game so quickly (such as dfortae), I can't imagine how many hundreds of hours he had to play to get that quick and familiar with the interface. I'm literally hunting and pecking at this stage, after carefully reading the screen, consulting the manual and seeing the options and selecting the first letter of the option I want. 🤣.

Whenever I finish a game (in this case, Champions of Krynn), I install a few games and give them a shot to figure out what I want to finish next. So, here's what I've been playing:

Legend of Grimrock
I've had this in my library for many years, and although I've given it many tries, it never clicks with me. One reason is that I just don't really care for this particular sub-genre of RPG, and another reason is that the game lacks the atmosphere of classic real-time blobbers like Dungeon Master, Eye of the Beholder, and Lands of Lore. Anyway, this time around I decided to do some research and create a party that should let you get through the game with minimal "square dancing" around enemies. I went with two bare-fisted insect guys up front, backed up with two minotaurs throwing stuff from behind. This has worked pretty well so far, though I did have to square dance around the room during some of the tougher encounters.

Having said that, I just have very little interest in this kind of RPG. I'll keep it installed and put some time into it now and then, but won't really focus on it for now.

Solasta: Crown of the Magister
This is a party-based RPG with turn-based combat based on whatever the latest version of Dungeons & Dragons is. It's decent so far, with a definite focus on tactical combat with some minor resource management in between battles. In some ways, it feels like playing a modern interpretation of one of the B-tier Gold Box games.
The game actually comes with some extensive modding/design tools, and there is some interesting content available on Steam Workshop, including a conversion of a series of D&D pen-and-paper modules that is basically a free 30-hour expansion... so the game has some definite replayability if you're into it.
I think the two things this game is know for are verticality and lighting. The game is very dark when in dungeons, etc., and you are heavily penalized if your characters aren't carrying light sources. Battles also often take place in multi-level environments, so you can do stuff like push enemies off ledges.
So far, it's pretty cool. It feels very limiting to be able to make only a four-character party, but other than that I have no complaints. There's some fun "dungeoneering" stuff to do in between quests, like ensuring you have enough supplies to survive a few days away from civilization.

Warhammer 40,000: Inquisitor - Martyr
This is basically Diablo II in the future. I'd been interested in this one since it was released, but refused to play it because it requires an online connection even to play the single-player campaign. At some point, the developers promised to add an offline mode after they released the final DLC. True to their word, they did it, and so I finally bought the game.
It's an interesting take on Diablo II, and the developers actually tried to do some new things with the formula. Probably the biggest gimmick is that you can take cover behind stuff for a bonus to your defense, and shoot around corners (if you're playing a ranged character). The overall structure is kind of fun, too, in that the main story is very linear, but you're free to travel throughout the galaxy and take on optional missions if you want. You can even boost the difficulty level of each mission to earn better rewards.
If I have one complaint about the game, it's that the mechanics aren't explained at all, even during the tutorials. You have a screen chock full of stats and attributes, but it's hard to figure out while playing the game what these things all do. Another minor complaint is that the dialog is way too jokey for the setting, like the writers were afraid to totally embrace the OOT setting.

newtmonkey wrote on 2024-11-16, 19:04:

Whenever I finish a game (in this case, Champions of Krynn), I install a few games and give them a shot to figure out what I wan […]
Show full quote

Whenever I finish a game (in this case, Champions of Krynn), I install a few games and give them a shot to figure out what I want to finish next. So, here's what I've been playing:

Legend of Grimrock
I've had this in my library for many years, and although I've given it many tries, it never clicks with me. One reason is that I just don't really care for this particular sub-genre of RPG, and another reason is that the game lacks the atmosphere of classic real-time blobbers like Dungeon Master, Eye of the Beholder, and Lands of Lore. Anyway, this time around I decided to do some research and create a party that should let you get through the game with minimal "square dancing" around enemies. I went with two bare-fisted insect guys up front, backed up with two minotaurs throwing stuff from behind. This has worked pretty well so far, though I did have to square dance around the room during some of the tougher encounters.

Having said that, I just have very little interest in this kind of RPG. I'll keep it installed and put some time into it now and then, but won't really focus on it for now.

Solasta: Crown of the Magister
This is a party-based RPG with turn-based combat based on whatever the latest version of Dungeons & Dragons is. It's decent so far, with a definite focus on tactical combat with some minor resource management in between battles. In some ways, it feels like playing a modern interpretation of one of the B-tier Gold Box games.
The game actually comes with some extensive modding/design tools, and there is some interesting content available on Steam Workshop, including a conversion of a series of D&D pen-and-paper modules that is basically a free 30-hour expansion... so the game has some definite replayability if you're into it.
I think the two things this game is know for are verticality and lighting. The game is very dark when in dungeons, etc., and you are heavily penalized if your characters aren't carrying light sources. Battles also often take place in multi-level environments, so you can do stuff like push enemies off ledges.
So far, it's pretty cool. It feels very limiting to be able to make only a four-character party, but other than that I have no complaints. There's some fun "dungeoneering" stuff to do in between quests, like ensuring you have enough supplies to survive a few days away from civilization.

For whatever reason, I really got into Legend of Grimrock when I played it back in 2017. I played it beginning to end in 23 days. I've still got LoG2 on my playlist and will get to it some day.

Solasta is on my wishlist on GOG. I just haven't pulled the trigger yet because I have so many other games I own that are on my playlist. Looking forward to reading your playthrough, if you continue.

Quick question on POR: I'm still doing the beginning random combats in the Slums. How important is Parlaying, in general, and at this early stage of the game? Do you just approach and fight, or does Parlaying have any benefit when it's something like an angry group of Orcs?

I recently finished the first Prince of Persia, one of the first games that captivated me when I didn't even have a computer and to which I always returned but had never completed, until I got serious playing now in a 286.

clueless1 wrote on 2024-11-16, 22:21:

Quick question on POR: I'm still doing the beginning random combats in the Slums. How important is Parlaying, in general, and at this early stage of the game? Do you just approach and fight, or does Parlaying have any benefit when it's something like an angry group of Orcs?

The parley option is basically just another option for avoiding combat. I think it's random, but certain groups do respond better to certain attitudes (Haughty, Abusive, etc.). There's also an area later in the game where you can use the parley option to speak a password to patrolling guards to avoid random combat completely. You never have to use it to get useful information or solve a quest or anything, though.

If you want to read up on how the game works, this FAQ is extremely thorough:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/564785-pool- … ance/faqs/73869
It's far more than just a simple walkthrough, as it really gets into the details of how the game works, provides lots of tips (recommended spells, combat tactics, etc.), and even has a nice section on the game interface that does a better job of explaining how to play the game than the manual!

mannycalavera wrote on 2024-11-17, 01:24:

I recently finished the first Prince of Persia, one of the first games that captivated me when I didn't even have a computer and to which I always returned but had never completed, until I got serious playing now in a 286.

Wow, talking about finally touching a piece of history. 👍 It is one of my two favorite game series.

dr_st wrote on 2024-11-17, 10:54:

mannycalavera wrote on 2024-11-17, 01:24:

I recently finished the first Prince of Persia, one of the first games that captivated me when I didn't even have a computer and to which I always returned but had never completed, until I got serious playing now in a 286.

Wow, talking about finally touching a piece of history. 👍 It is one of my two favorite game series.

Really a fascinating and compelling game and it was big satisfaction to complete it thirty years later (that faith jump in the last stage got me trapped a good amount time) now i'm gonna try to play Prince of Persia 2 that i understand that it has a more complex gameplay.

mannycalavera wrote on 2024-11-17, 11:03:

now i'm gonna try to play Prince of Persia 2 that i understand that it has a more complex gameplay.

Indeed. The levels are bigger, enemies are more frequent and diverse, puzzles are deeper. Some like it, others not so much. To me PoP2 was completely magical. I wish you the same enjoyable experience.