I don't think you're doing anything wrong, the browser is simply too primitive.

2015 androids are now too primitive also. There's a method of hosting a proxy on a modern computer that might get you through, forgetting the name.

BitWrangler wrote on 2024-10-06, 01:41:

There's a method of hosting a proxy on a modern computer that might get you through, forgetting the name.

That'll be retro-proxy. There's also FrogFind!, which is a search engine for vintage computers. It will let you browse Vogons but it strips out a fair number of things including the ability to log in and even thread titles.

I just had a look on my win98se gaming machine. It has IE6, Firefox 2.0.0.22pre, and Opera 10.63 .

Opera instantly crashes on Vogons, so no use.

Firefox and IE displayed quite similar results - basically no formatting, text only, and shows avatars. IE was slightly better, showing the logon fields which are missing from Firefox.
I know it's rare for IE6 to be any good for anything these days, but in this case it's the winner.

Damnnn I kinda feel like vogons should work on okd browsers
Would kinda fit the theme 🙁

Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-10-06, 12:01:

Damnnn I kinda feel like vogons should work on okd browsers
Would kinda fit the theme 🙁

And it would be a security nightmare, with user data easily exposed to malicious actors.

No thanks.

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2024-10-06, 12:02:

Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-10-06, 12:01:

Damnnn I kinda feel like vogons should work on okd browsers
Would kinda fit the theme 🙁

And it would be a security nightmare, with user data easily exposed to malicious actors.

No thanks.

Yo Mr joestar that is a good point
Plus I meant to say old not okd
My friend wants me to watch Jojo is it actually a good show?
And what season should I watch

Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-10-06, 12:06:

My friend wants me to watch Jojo is it actually a good show?
And what season should I watch

If PewDiePie managed not to skip anything, you should be able to do so as well.

Watch them all in chronological order, using the Japanese dub with English subtitles. Thank me later.

Okay cool

Lately i have abandoned all network connections to my computer. Surf the met with my sub 200eur android. Download and use usb3 to usb stick copying. I have one Win11 computer for special occations. IDcard stuff. Older computers the internet is just too much trouble.

Cyberdyne wrote on 2024-10-06, 12:16:

Lately i have abandoned all network connections to my computer. Surf the met with my sub 200eur android. Download and use usb3 to usb stick copying. I have one Win11 computer for special occations. IDcard stuff. Older computers the internet is just too much trouble.

Well even if you don't use it it's pretty cool to just have it connected

Yea even Seamonkey 1.1.1.9 is barely able to render it properly.

Heh, reminded me, was rewatching Mr Robot again last month and noticed what seemed the most unrealistic thing in the whole show... he was using IceWeasel on Kali Linux and he was whipping through webforms on various sites he had hacked, some inside corporate intrawebs (Designed just for the browser they use) and they were all rendering correctly. 🤣

We are post IE now with Edge based on chrome, but particularly back when this was set in 2015, you'd often try to fill in a web form and it would either work on IE or Chrome, but not both.

Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-10-05, 22:09:

Heyyyyyyyyyyo,
I've just installed retrozilla and the normal vogons website doesn't work due to some "security reason" or something. So I tried the http version and I can't log in.

Not being able to log in on http is a vogons problem. It's like that in any browser (though some browsers will try to prevent you from browsing http in the first place).

Failing silently with no error = BUG.

Robbbert wrote on 2024-10-06, 06:03:

I just had a look on my win98se gaming machine. It has IE6, Firefox 2.0.0.22pre, and Opera 10.63 .

Oh my! Firefox 2! That's an 20 years old release, almost. I haven't seen it since the late 2000s!
And IE6.. Jesus. That's the bot net era IE, with all the plug-ins and vulnerabilities of XP era. 🙁
Seriously, please consider using KernelEx and Firefox 52/Palemoon or any other recent browser if the hardware supports it.

And please don't leave your Win98 system connected to the internet all time (unattended). It's a walking security hole by default.
But if your Win98 system has to be online, your cable modem/DSL router should have a firewall/IP filter, at least. 😀
You surely know this already, but I think I shouldn't keep quiet about this matter.

Cursed Derp wrote on 2024-10-05, 22:09:

I've just installed retrozilla and the normal vogons website doesn't work due to some "security reason" or something.

Which version did you try? The latest I know is roytam1's build RetroZilla 2.2 dated 2024/05/26 which supports TLS 1.3. There are also RZ browser 2.2 (2024/05/26) and K-Meleon 1.5.4 (2024/06/01) which also support TLS 1.3.

These builds are available from roytam1's pages (https://rtfreesoft.blogspot.com/) or my website's tools section (https://soggi.org/misc/tools.htm) - if you don't have one of these builds installed already.

BTW I recall I was writing something similar to someone some days/weeks ago...maybe it was to you!?

Jo22 wrote on 2024-10-06, 14:57:

Oh my! Firefox 2! That's an 20 years old release, almost. I haven't seen it since the late 2000s!

No, it has been 15 years this year (2024) - Firefox 2.0.0.22pre is a nightly released on 2009/04/15. Together with the official version 20.0.0.20 and Opera 10.63 (released on 2010/10/12) it was THE browser for Win98(SE)/ME for many years until it stopped to work on more and more websites for several reasons.

Jo22 wrote on 2024-10-06, 14:57:

And please don't leave your Win98 system connected to the internet all time (unattended). It's a walking security hole by default.
But if your Win98 system has to be online, your cable modem/DSL router should have a firewall/IP filter, at least. 😀
You surely know this already, but I think I shouldn't keep quiet about this matter.

If there's a router providing the internet connection, there's no problem! I guess you know what NAT (network address translation) is - the router only sends data to the Win98 machine which has been requested by it (the very short story of what NAT means in that case) and the Win98 computer doesn't get the whole bombardment (of internet shit) which arrives at the router.

kind regards
soggi

Thanks for the info. I downloaded and installed RetroZilla 2.2 as you suggested on my 98 machine. It looks like Netscape.

It was able to visit any site that I chose without getting rejected because of security issues.

https vogons worked, but the same formatting issues as I had before, including no logon fields.

I then tried to visit Youtube, access was allowed, but of course it froze having run out of memory. No surprise there.

As for IE6, I think this was at the time when it couldn't be uninstalled because MS insisted it was part of the OS. I mean, I could stop using it, but the underlying tech is stuck there afaik.

@Soggi Hi! From what I remember, Firefox 3.0 was the first release to introduce Gecko 1.9, which did overhaul the rendering.
So quite a few modern websites from after 2010 may require Firefox 3. Gecko 1.9 also passed Acid2 test.

More Information can be found here:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gecko_(Software)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firefox_2#End_of_Life

Speaking of my experience with Win9x and Internet.. Well, I do remember this one person who had an Windows 95 PC and a modem..
Since then, I'm very careful when it comes to Windows 9x on the Internetz. Story here.

@all Tip: If you're leaving your Windows 9x systems online, you maybe want make sure that the Windows Scripting Host (WSH) is being deactivated.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Script_ … curity_concerns

Robbbert wrote on 2024-10-07, 05:42:

Thanks for the info. I downloaded and installed RetroZilla 2.2 as you suggested on my 98 machine. It looks like Netscape. […]
Show full quote

Thanks for the info. I downloaded and installed RetroZilla 2.2 as you suggested on my 98 machine. It looks like Netscape.

It was able to visit any site that I chose without getting rejected because of security issues.

https vogons worked, but the same formatting issues as I had before, including no logon fields.

I then tried to visit Youtube, access was allowed, but of course it froze having run out of memory. No surprise there.

As for IE6, I think this was at the time when it couldn't be uninstalled because MS insisted it was part of the OS. I mean, I could stop using it, but the underlying tech is stuck there afaik.

It is hardly possible to add the features to let www.vogons.org function correctly. But you can always ask for support, f.e. roytam1 himself at MSFN in his builds thread (-> My Browser Builds (Part 5)).

Jo22 wrote on 2024-10-07, 13:14:

@Soggi Hi! From what I remember, Firefox 3.0 was the first release to introduce Gecko 1.9, which did overhaul the rendering.
So quite a few modern websites from after 2010 may require Firefox 3. Gecko 1.9 also passed Acid2 test.

This is correct - I just said above that the latest Firefox 2 version isn't "mostly 20 years" old, but ~15 years. No matter which version you use, you won't have success, I guess - it's mostly about modern JS. Adding some polyfill add-on like palefill for Pale Moon (and forks) could help, but I don't know how difficult it would be and if it's possible at all.

Jo22 wrote on 2024-10-07, 13:14:

Speaking of my experience with Win9x and Internet.. Well, I do remember this one person who had an Windows 95 PC and a modem..
Since then, I'm very careful when it comes to Windows 9x on the Internetz. Story here.

You're talking about it yourself in the linked post... 😉

That was a connection by modem (dial-up), so you had a direct connection and the computer was directly visible to others over the Internet with its IP. I also remember the time of the early 2000s... We had a LAN party, WinXP was relatively new and the PCs of my friends got infected with Sasser because we all used dial-up connections (no matter if 56k/ISDN/DSL) back then - my PC didn't got infected because I still used Win98SE which doesn't have run services with open ports and stuff. So running Win98 behind a router is save, as save as your router and all the other devices are and as save as your behavior is (opening every e-mail attachment, downloading everything from everywhere, allowing all JS on websites, etc. !?).

Jo22 wrote on 2024-10-07, 13:14:

@all Tip: If you're leaving your Windows 9x systems online, you maybe want make sure that the Windows Scripting Host (WSH) is being deactivated.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Script_ … curity_concerns

Why? If you are using scripts which you don't trust and which are potentially infectious, you've got other security problems and already did something wrong. Then deactivating WSH doesn't help much.

kind regards
soggi