VOGONS


First post, by gbeirn

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I took off the old caps from my Asus A7V and noticed something weird. Every other time I've replaced cpas the white silkscreen on the motherboard indicates the negative terminal. On this board the reverse appears to be true.

http://imgur.com/UR2ac6I
http://imgur.com/X7ed2If
http://imgur.com/4VfhyPa
http://imgur.com/NoC8pDx
http://imgur.com/5rQOgBR

Spefically look at the second and fourth picture. The two caps by the parallel port have the silkscreen closer to the VRM but the other image shows the white negative stripe on the cap facing closer to the port.

The board did work before storage so I am going to put the new ones on the same direction as the bad ones I took off just wondering if anyone else has ever noticed this?

Reply 2 of 13, by FesterBlatz

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Either the silkscreen is backwards or the original caps were installed backwards. If it were me, I'd verify with a multimeter before calling it good. It certainly wouldn't be the first time for a manufacturer to install caps backwards...

Reply 3 of 13, by SSTV2

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Sometimes manufacturers decide to mess up with you, white paint should indicate negative polarity, but in your case it's reversed, if you happen to be confused about right polarities, check continuity between ground and cap pins to be absolutely sure, also square copper pad should always indicate a positive polarity, while round - negative.

Reply 4 of 13, by kenrouholo

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FesterBlatz wrote:

Either the silkscreen is backwards or the original caps were installed backwards. If it were me, I'd verify with a multimeter before calling it good. It certainly wouldn't be the first time for a manufacturer to install caps backwards...

Go apply DC voltage to a backwards electrolytic cap ;) (not a non-polarized one; those are impractical to use when not required)

They definitely weren't installed backwards.

Yes, I always ramble this much.

Reply 5 of 13, by gdjacobs

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Jade Falcon wrote:

Don't mind the silkscreen. Go by the poles on the caps.

Also the yellow caps are probably perfectly fine.

Nichicon, maybe?

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Reply 6 of 13, by Jade Falcon

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gdjacobs wrote:
Jade Falcon wrote:

Don't mind the silkscreen. Go by the poles on the caps.

Also the yellow caps are probably perfectly fine.

Nichicon, maybe?

Yellow jackets. If I recall Toshiba or Panasonic makes them. But I could be wrong. I know there not Nichicon.

Reply 8 of 13, by Jade Falcon

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Yeah, they're certainly not bad caps. I seen them in a lot of server boards from around 2003-2006.OP will certainly have to pay up to get anything better then them.

Edit:
I have an Asus board with the same caps.
The silkscreens are the exact same way.

Reply 9 of 13, by Tetrium

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Didn't ASUS tended to install their caps backwards at some point? I can vaguely remember this being a typical ASUS thing (and it being a nuisance that was already mentioned on Vogons once or twice).

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Reply 10 of 13, by firage

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Tetrium wrote:

Didn't ASUS tended to install their caps backwards at some point? I can vaguely remember this being a typical ASUS thing (and it being a nuisance that was already mentioned on Vogons once or twice).

It's just that they employ nonstandard PCB markings.

My big-red-switch 486

Reply 11 of 13, by gbeirn

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firage wrote:
Tetrium wrote:

Didn't ASUS tended to install their caps backwards at some point? I can vaguely remember this being a typical ASUS thing (and it being a nuisance that was already mentioned on Vogons once or twice).

It's just that they employ nonstandard PCB markings.

Yes that's what it has to be since the board worked fine before being put into storage.

Reply 12 of 13, by FesterBlatz

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kenrouholo wrote:

They definitely weren't installed backwards.

Even though ASUS supposedly chose to ignore a long-established industry standard of capacitor polarity designation you're willing to say with absolute certainty, without checking for yourself, those caps were installed correctly by the factory?

kenrouholo wrote:

Go apply DC voltage to a backwards electrolytic cap 😉 (not a non-polarized one; those are impractical to use when not required)

Sure, I'll bite. Do you want to know what typically happens? They swell, leak, and fail prematurely--just like the caps on that board.

I do this stuff professionally and I can tell you from years of experience that catastrophic failure (venting/explosion) from reversed polarity is NOT a common failure mode for electrolytic capacitors. Designers deliberately de-rate capacitors' voltage rating for a margin of safety, which is precisely why the OP's caps are 6.3v parts on what is likely a 3.3v or less rail. So go ahead and take a 6.3v cap and reverse it's polarity across 3.3v--but don't hold your breathing waiting for it to fail.

And since I like to back up my arguments with facts in context of the conversation, I suggest you read up on the Amiga A3640 CPU board. The electrolytic bypass caps on those were stuffed backwards at the factory and eventually lead to LONG-TERM failures plaguing thousands of Amiga 4000 users as the leaking electrolyte permanently damaged countless boards.

Now I'm not saying ASUS installed them backwards, I'm saying since there is confusion about their unconventional choice of silkscreen orientation, as a best-practice it would be a good idea check and be certain. It wouldn't take but a few minutes. And to be honest I'm surprised that users of a technical forum are so reluctant to supporting the idea of spending a few minutes to verify something that's a definite possibility.

Growing up in a family of skilled laborers I was frequently reminded, "If you don't have the time to do the job right, then you don't have the time to do it twice..."