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Bought these (retro) hardware today

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Reply 58480 of 58502, by devius

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LunarG wrote on 2026-03-10, 13:24:

I want to benchmark my Pentium 60 "like-for-like" against my Intel DX4 100.

When you do that, if you're planning on publishing the results, can you also include Diablo? Even if it's just how it subjectively feels. I was disappointed it ran quite slow, albeit somewhat playable, on a AMD 5x86 133MHz system I have. The minimum requirements listed include a Pentium 60, so it would be interesting to see how it runs on that CPU.

Reply 58481 of 58502, by Twisted Six

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bartonxp wrote on 2026-03-10, 00:26:
Found this locally on craigslist for $40. […]
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Found this locally on craigslist for $40.

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It was just the case, nothing else, except for a fan controller and ... 4 Deep Cool blue LED fans. Oh Yeah!

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Looks like one of those Apevia cases that were so popular in the early 2000's. I have a couple of them around here. At the time they were new, I always thought they were really cheesy looking....but now they definitely have some retro cred!! Nice score.

If you tolerate this, then your children will be next.

Reply 58482 of 58502, by giantenemycat

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To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact. I can't even see a single crack in any of the plastics.

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And there is a hard drive installed, which is actually working. Floppy drive doesn't seem to be reading disks though, but hopefully that's an easy fix.

The attachment ds.jpg is no longer available

Reply 58483 of 58502, by NeilKnows

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giantenemycat wrote on 2026-03-10, 15:30:

To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact. I can't even see a single crack in any of the plastics.

Well done seller!

Reply 58484 of 58502, by BitWrangler

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LunarG wrote on 2026-03-10, 13:24:
Got an appropriate graphics card for my Pentium 60 today. […]
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Got an appropriate graphics card for my Pentium 60 today.

I want to benchmark my Pentium 60 "like-for-like" against my Intel DX4 100. There have been so many debates over the years about which one was faster.
My impression back in the mid '90s, when my best friend had a Pentium 60, was that it was definitely faster than any 486. Granted, back then I didn't really know of people running AMD 5x86s clocked at 160+MHz, and I am absolutely certain they'd demolish a lowly 60MHz Pentium. But a mutual friend had a DX4, and it was definitely slower than my friend's Pentium 60... But I have no clue what hardware was in that DX4.
So in my own DX4 I have a VLB Diamond Stealth 64 DRAM (Vision 864 Chip) with 2MB, which should be basically identical to this PCI card, despite this one being the 868 (only means it's got added video playback acceleration). There is one major difference, the drive controller. My 486 uses a VLB IDE controller, while my Pentium uses a PCI SCSI controller, due to the onboard IDE controller being buggy. This was a common issue with Socket 4 motherboards, they seemed to favour a controller chip which unfortunately was highly buggy. This could explain why my friend's Pentium back in the day ALSO had SCSI.
Once I an certain both systems are running flawlessly, I'll run a bunch of different benchmarks, both MS-DOS and Windows 3.x to see how they compare.

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Interesting project. I can recall a few snippets from that area of comparison from back in the day. This was around the turn of the millennium, and I was deciding which machine should have most/best RAM, case and soundcard to be 3rd best machine in the house for office/web to keep the family from continually bugging my wife and I for our machines. So it was a Socket 4, Pentium 60, vs a UMC board with an AMD DX4. I think it was an 8kb write through setup, the DX4s with 16kb write back may do better on some things. The P60 had i/o disadvantage, because of nothing onboard, and having to use ISA i/o card, while the DX4 had fast onboard and VLB. I don't think the P60 got very good graphics either, maybe a GD5430 PCI which was slower than GD5429 in the VLB slot.

Seemed that unless you were going to make things all about Quake, then you could "prove" it either way. Older stuff favored the DX4, think it did best on 386 and 16bit code, while the P60 beat the DX4 on anything more 486 specific, floating point and new stuff with pentium optimisations. But there is also stuff that will cache and optimise in the pentium pipeline and it will scream through. Subjectively, it was a bit of a wash in wfwg 3.11, testing because of familiarity, but it was losing browser support, but we had a lot of old windows software. DX4 and P60 felt about the same, if there was a gain in one app, there was a loss in another. Win95 was a different story, just ran way smoother on the P60, it felt built for a P60. Then the P60 could do things the DX4 could not do, like play mp3s from winamp while scrolling pages on netscape or using word. The DX4 would glitch and stutter, it could play mp3 OR do work. Forget what bitrate we were using then though, probably better than 56kbit but not as high as 192 or so. Also SWF, shockwave flash animations were the new thing and the P60 could play them, while the DX4 struggled badly.

So this was a system for use "going forward" the P60 thus "won" with whatever could be got working in win95 and tough luck about the old apps that wouldn't play nice. My Cyrix 5x86 which I had overclocked into close to P90 performance levels, which I was using at the time, was a bit faster, even on "pentium class" instructions but not "specifically intel pentium optimised" code. i.e. stuff like quake pretty much using timing hacks.

In theory though, a pentium can be brought to it's knees with some kinds of half word bit shifting operations which it takes twice the clocks to perform than a 486 does. Find code that does much of that and suddenly a P60 will look like a 486DX33.

In general though, the one thing you tend to notice on say 1995ish era games that are pentium recommended, 100mhz 486 can just about play it, is that it is a lot smoother on the P60, even if not technically giving higher frame rates, it just flows, where fast 486 might stumble and stutter a bit then gain speed for a moment, then drop back. I think the larger write back cache models improve things there too though.

From launch the P60 had some killer apps that were FPU intensive, but wasn't all that impressive on the installed code base of general 16/32bit DOS and Win3.x programs for a couple of years. Thus why people thought it was an overpriced dud, and also why a P75 was seen as "not worth it" vs a fast 486 in 1995 by a lot of people. However, by 1996 into 1997 there was a lot more pentium optimisation going on and a lot of discarding of old 16 bit stuff in Windows applications. So anyone on a 486 was starting to feel performance drop away on newer things while low end pentium users were feeling their systems gain. Of course this didn't last long as faster and faster pentium class sold and MMX and PII came on the market, thus software got more demanding and they had bottom end performance again.

Anyway, lot of avenues to explore there, have fun.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 58485 of 58502, by BitWrangler

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giantenemycat wrote on 2026-03-10, 15:30:

To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact.

I was gonna say originally that if it was built like most pre 1995ish IBM, someone could kick it all the way there and it would just arrive a little scuffed, but I didn't want to jinx you in case it had had plastic deterioration.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 58486 of 58502, by giantenemycat

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BitWrangler wrote on 2026-03-10, 15:57:
giantenemycat wrote on 2026-03-10, 15:30:

To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact.

I was gonna say originally that if it was built like most pre 1995ish IBM, someone could kick it all the way there and it would just arrive a little scuffed, but I didn't want to jinx you in case it had had plastic deterioration.

Seller did also pack it very well tbf.

The PCB on the front with the blue clips is actually the proprietary 512KB RAM expansion. Lucky it has that, otherwise would be limited to the 512KB onboard memory. Also the Dallas RTC is socketed, so that will be an easy replacement.

Reply 58487 of 58502, by PcBytes

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giantenemycat wrote on 2026-03-10, 15:30:
To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact. I can't even see a single crack […]
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To all the doubters (including myself)...by some miracle, the PS/1 somehow arrived fully intact. I can't even see a single crack in any of the plastics.

The attachment SONY PS1.jpg is no longer available

And there is a hard drive installed, which is actually working. Floppy drive doesn't seem to be reading disks though, but hopefully that's an easy fix.

The attachment ds.jpg is no longer available

I'm genuinely surprised. Probably a matter of the CRT chassis being reinforced, a bit similar to how Sony did to several Trinitrons?

file.php?mode=view&id=238057

(credit to andys-arcade for the photo - I wanted to show the specific chassis "reinforcement" some Sonys use)

"Enter at your own peril, past the bolted door..."
Main PC: i5 3470, GB B75M-D3H, 16GB RAM, 2x1TB
98SE : P3 650, Soyo SY-6BA+IV, 384MB RAM, 80GB

Reply 58488 of 58502, by PD2JK

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A (Dell?) Nvidia TNT2 AGP card. Nothing special apart from the four memory chips. (also two on the back) These are 5.5ns which I need for a project I'll be revisiting... I was going for 5ns chips, but these unfortunately only appear on G400 MAX cards?

Seller pic;

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i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856

Reply 58489 of 58502, by havli

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Rarely also on Voodoo3 PCI SGR... but that is not the right card to steal memory from 😁

HW museum.cz - my collection of PC hardware

Reply 58490 of 58502, by PcBytes

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9800 XT acquired. Dell OEM card, runs great and artefact free.

"Enter at your own peril, past the bolted door..."
Main PC: i5 3470, GB B75M-D3H, 16GB RAM, 2x1TB
98SE : P3 650, Soyo SY-6BA+IV, 384MB RAM, 80GB

Reply 58491 of 58502, by BitWrangler

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Cool, cool, cool... no that wasn't an Abed impression, keep it cool 🤣

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.

Reply 58492 of 58502, by pete8475

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PcBytes wrote on Yesterday, 00:01:

9800 XT acquired. Dell OEM card, runs great and artefact free.

Very nice!

Reply 58493 of 58502, by PD2JK

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Useless, but fun when overclocking the ISA bus a bit.

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i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856

Reply 58494 of 58502, by Nunoalex

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PD2JK wrote on Today, 08:13:

Useless, but fun when overclocking the ISA bus a bit.

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Why do you say useless ?
I still use network cards to transfer files and get driveres from the internet for my old computers

Reply 58495 of 58502, by PD2JK

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Nunoalex wrote on Today, 12:08:

Why do you say useless ?
I still use network cards to transfer files and get driveres from the internet for my old computers

Of course, I agree! The useless part; imagine having a 100Mbps link connected indirectly on a 16 bit ISA bus.
I'm lucky to reach 15Mbps speeds. Eight to 10 will be more realistic I think.

i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856

Reply 58496 of 58502, by MattRocks

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Ordered an R200 just to fill a gap in my AGP cards: Rage6, R100, RV100, ..., RV250, RV280, R300, R350, RV350, RV360, ..., R530, R635.

My actual original card of that era is a GeForce 3, and I'll have to wait and see which clocks higher.

Reply 58497 of 58502, by dionb

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PD2JK wrote on Today, 12:19:
Nunoalex wrote on Today, 12:08:

Why do you say useless ?
I still use network cards to transfer files and get driveres from the internet for my old computers

Of course, I agree! The useless part; imagine having a 100Mbps link connected indirectly on a 16 bit ISA bus.
I'm lucky to reach 15Mbps speeds. Eight to 10 will be more realistic I think.

Most definitely not useless. Consider that back in the day you connected multiple devices together with hubs, not switches. Unless you had a dual-speed hub (which cost as much as a switch), all devices on a hub operated at the same speed. Connect a 10Mb card to a regular 100Mb hub and all speeds drop down to 10Mbps link rate. Connect this card and even though it can't fill the 100Mb link, the rest of the devices can keep running at 100Mb speeds. Even if all of them are ISA cards, the aggregate throughput will be much higher than if they were working at 10Mbps.

Today there's a new use case: an increasing number of network devices is dropping 10Mbps link support. For example I have a Comtrend PG-9083 G.hn powerline adapter that only works at 100 or 1000Mbps and I've heard Broadcom claim their 10GbE 'multi speed' ports only do 10Gb, 5Gb, 2.5Gb, 1Gb and 100Mb, not 10Mb. Realtek 10Gb ports handle 10Mb just fine though.

Reply 58499 of 58502, by PD2JK

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PcBytes wrote on 2026-03-06, 19:36:

In your case you can probably harvest one from even a WD800JD or WD800JS since I think they use the same type of connectors.

Found one 👍

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Time to heat up the station.

i386 16 ⇒ i486 DX4 100 ⇒ Pentium MMX 200 ⇒ Athlon Pluto 700 ⇒ AthlonXP 1700+ ⇒ Opteron 165 ⇒ Dual Opteron 856