VOGONS


First post, by EvieSigma

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I'm dealing with a problem I can't even begin to understand. When I try to install Windows 98SE on my ThinkPad A22m, it gets to this point and then the entire laptop just...shuts off, with no warning.

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I've installed a brand new, working CMOS battery, thinking this was CMOS related, but it did not help. The laptop does seem a bit warm to the touch near the CPU but nowhere near warm enough to trigger thermal shutdown. Any ideas as to what's happening here? Could it be the hard drive somehow?

Reply 1 of 14, by PC Hoarder Patrol

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EvieSigma wrote on 2022-04-08, 23:56:

I'm dealing with a problem I can't even begin to understand. When I try to install Windows 98SE on my ThinkPad A22m, it gets to this point and then the entire laptop just...shuts off, with no warning.

PXL_20220408_232352747.jpg

I've installed a brand new, working CMOS battery, thinking this was CMOS related, but it did not help. The laptop does seem a bit warm to the touch near the CPU but nowhere near warm enough to trigger thermal shutdown. Any ideas as to what's happening here? Could it be the hard drive somehow?

Maybe not relevant, but are you using the supplement package during installation?

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You can download it from here (bottom of page) - https://thinkpads.com/support/Thinkpad-Driver … /A22m-2628.html

Reply 2 of 14, by Bondi

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I had exactly same problem with my A21p. It just shutted off while OS installation. I think this how the Blink of Death manisfests on early stages. I finally managed to install the OS, but It was like 5 years ago and I don't remember how exactly. I think I removed all extra devices like modem, network card, maybe FDD and one stick of RAM. The idea was to minimize the load on the power circuit. Tweaking BIOS settings for low power use can also help.
My A21p is kind of working since, but BoD was progressing. Sometimes it doesn't turn on.

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Reply 3 of 14, by EvieSigma

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PC Hoarder Patrol wrote on 2022-04-09, 06:06:
Maybe not relevant, but are you using the supplement package during installation? […]
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EvieSigma wrote on 2022-04-08, 23:56:

I'm dealing with a problem I can't even begin to understand. When I try to install Windows 98SE on my ThinkPad A22m, it gets to this point and then the entire laptop just...shuts off, with no warning.

PXL_20220408_232352747.jpg

I've installed a brand new, working CMOS battery, thinking this was CMOS related, but it did not help. The laptop does seem a bit warm to the touch near the CPU but nowhere near warm enough to trigger thermal shutdown. Any ideas as to what's happening here? Could it be the hard drive somehow?

Maybe not relevant, but are you using the supplement package during installation?

w98sfdiw.txt

You can download it from here (bottom of page) - https://thinkpads.com/support/Thinkpad-Driver … /A22m-2628.html

I did not know that was a thing, I'll try doing the install with that!

Reply 5 of 14, by shamino

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What are the specs on your power adapters? I don't remember the correct spec but there's a weaker PSU for older Thinkpads that sometimes gets incorrectly used on these. There's also a ton of dodgy knockoffs, the ones I've seen say "For IBM" on them - real first party PSUs don't say "for".

Reply 6 of 14, by EvieSigma

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shamino wrote on 2022-04-10, 00:17:

What are the specs on your power adapters? I don't remember the correct spec but there's a weaker PSU for older Thinkpads that sometimes gets incorrectly used on these. There's also a ton of dodgy knockoffs, the ones I've seen say "For IBM" on them - real first party PSUs don't say "for".

These are 16V 4.5A adapters, IBM branded.

Reply 8 of 14, by EvieSigma

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PC Hoarder Patrol wrote on 2022-04-10, 06:24:

Which BIOS version are you running (the latest?)

Are you using any setup.exe switches to account for ACPI / PnP BIOS - Generic Win98SE Installation & Setup Guide

I don't know the version number but it's dated 2003. Not using any switches when running setup.

Reply 9 of 14, by notsofossil

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Bondi wrote on 2022-04-09, 07:07:

I had exactly same problem with my A21p. It just shutted off while OS installation. I think this how the Blink of Death manisfests on early stages. I finally managed to install the OS, but It was like 5 years ago and I don't remember how exactly. I think I removed all extra devices like modem, network card, maybe FDD and one stick of RAM. The idea was to minimize the load on the power circuit. Tweaking BIOS settings for low power use can also help.
My A21p is kind of working since, but BoD was progressing. Sometimes it doesn't turn on.

You sure that isn't just being caused by bad capacitors in the laptop and/or the AC adapter?

Thinkpad T42 Win9x Drivers | Latitude D600 Win9x Drivers
Next: Dell Inspiron 8000

Reply 10 of 14, by Bondi

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notsofossil wrote on 2022-04-10, 18:33:
Bondi wrote on 2022-04-09, 07:07:

I had exactly same problem with my A21p. It just shutted off while OS installation. I think this how the Blink of Death manisfests on early stages. I finally managed to install the OS, but It was like 5 years ago and I don't remember how exactly. I think I removed all extra devices like modem, network card, maybe FDD and one stick of RAM. The idea was to minimize the load on the power circuit. Tweaking BIOS settings for low power use can also help.
My A21p is kind of working since, but BoD was progressing. Sometimes it doesn't turn on.

You sure that isn't just being caused by bad capacitors in the laptop and/or the AC adapter?

I'm sure that in my case it was not the AC adapter, as I use it also with another laptop (A31p) and have no issues whasoever.
As for the caps in the laptop, theoretically it's possible.
Yet, BoD is a well known and widely spread problem of T20-T22, A20-22 and some X2x thinkpads. So it's likely the case. More precisely it's the precursor of the BoD.

PCMCIA Sound Cards chart

Reply 11 of 14, by EvieSigma

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Bondi wrote on 2022-04-10, 20:02:
I'm sure that in my case it was not the AC adapter, as I use it also with another laptop (A31p) and have no issues whasoever. As […]
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notsofossil wrote on 2022-04-10, 18:33:
Bondi wrote on 2022-04-09, 07:07:

I had exactly same problem with my A21p. It just shutted off while OS installation. I think this how the Blink of Death manisfests on early stages. I finally managed to install the OS, but It was like 5 years ago and I don't remember how exactly. I think I removed all extra devices like modem, network card, maybe FDD and one stick of RAM. The idea was to minimize the load on the power circuit. Tweaking BIOS settings for low power use can also help.
My A21p is kind of working since, but BoD was progressing. Sometimes it doesn't turn on.

You sure that isn't just being caused by bad capacitors in the laptop and/or the AC adapter?

I'm sure that in my case it was not the AC adapter, as I use it also with another laptop (A31p) and have no issues whasoever.
As for the caps in the laptop, theoretically it's possible.
Yet, BoD is a well known and widely spread problem of T20-T22, A20-22 and some X2x thinkpads. So it's likely the case. More precisely it's the precursor of the BoD.

If it is the "Blink of Death", is there any cure? Or is this machine just e-waste?

Reply 12 of 14, by Bondi

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EvieSigma wrote on 2022-04-11, 01:12:
Bondi wrote on 2022-04-10, 20:02:
I'm sure that in my case it was not the AC adapter, as I use it also with another laptop (A31p) and have no issues whasoever. As […]
Show full quote
notsofossil wrote on 2022-04-10, 18:33:

You sure that isn't just being caused by bad capacitors in the laptop and/or the AC adapter?

I'm sure that in my case it was not the AC adapter, as I use it also with another laptop (A31p) and have no issues whasoever.
As for the caps in the laptop, theoretically it's possible.
Yet, BoD is a well known and widely spread problem of T20-T22, A20-22 and some X2x thinkpads. So it's likely the case. More precisely it's the precursor of the BoD.

If it is the "Blink of Death", is there any cure? Or is this machine just e-waste?

Yes, there is a cure. German Thinkwiki https://thinkwiki.de/BoD suggests either replacement of ADP3421 controller or adding a 2,2 kOhm resistor to the circuit. I've read that the latter doesn't always work.
In the meanwhile I'd still try to install the OS with all possible devices removed including the main battery, and see i it makes a difference.

PCMCIA Sound Cards chart

Reply 13 of 14, by Thermalwrong

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Just replacing the ADP3421 chip with a fresh one usually helps in my experience. The resistor method didn't work at all for me on a Sony laptop with similar problem.
The ADP3421 is not too tough to remove either - I blob up solder on all the pins so I can heat all of one side up, then level it up a bit. Then do the other side and continue until the chip's off. Then clean up with solder braid and put the fresh one on there.
Take pictures before starting to compare with, they're useful to refer to and installing it backwards could be bad.

You could also potentially improve the issue by locking the CPU frequency at high or low speed in the BIOS, since it's the switching that often causes the problem.

Reply 14 of 14, by EvieSigma

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Thermalwrong wrote on 2022-04-11, 10:26:
Just replacing the ADP3421 chip with a fresh one usually helps in my experience. The resistor method didn't work at all for me o […]
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Just replacing the ADP3421 chip with a fresh one usually helps in my experience. The resistor method didn't work at all for me on a Sony laptop with similar problem.
The ADP3421 is not too tough to remove either - I blob up solder on all the pins so I can heat all of one side up, then level it up a bit. Then do the other side and continue until the chip's off. Then clean up with solder braid and put the fresh one on there.
Take pictures before starting to compare with, they're useful to refer to and installing it backwards could be bad.

You could also potentially improve the issue by locking the CPU frequency at high or low speed in the BIOS, since it's the switching that often causes the problem.

I'm going to try what I can without having to buy equipment to remove surface-mount ICs...