MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:11:

Grem Five wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:04:

I'm confused with this 3.3 volt talk, the board PC@LIVE posted the manual states "ASRock Graphics Interface Slot (1.5V_AGP1) "

I don't know. I steered away from voltages - just saying the plastic slot itself should physically prevent users inserting cards that are electrically incompatible. I'm trying to focus on PCI/AGP bandwidth, when it matters, and when it doesn't.

I dont know I was just confused because in some posts there was being thrown out 3.3 volts and 33 mzh but being this board mentions 1.5 volt slot and if this AGI slot is based on the pci slots on the board which are spec 2.2 which can run at 66 mzh. <shrug> that sounds like at least AGP 4x and from what I remember back in the day most people couldnt notice a difference between 4x and 8x.

Edit: I took look at the TRW page for this board

Known issues […]
Show full quote

Known issues

Fake AGP slot

Any AGP cards inserted into this slot operate in PCI 33Mhz Fallback mode.

DO NOT use 1.5V exclusive AGP cards (rear notch away from IO side) in this board.
ONLY use true universal AGP cards with both slots, these support 1.5V and 3.3V operation.
This is a PCI bus connected to an AGP slot.
The PCI bus operates at 3.3V and may damage 1.5V exclusive cards.
AGP cards are backwards compatible with PCI signalling logic.
Performance is greatly reduced vs a true AGP bus.

Those know issues listed dont seem to be anything I gleam from looking at the manual but they seem to contradict what they decided to put in manual, I can see the voltage part but falling back to 33 Mzh doesnt really make sense unless a slower pci card is put in one of the other pci slots that is only a 33 mzh card. I mean even the agp slot is keyed for 1.5 volts. Guess ASRock was a bit shady back then as well.

I'm reading it as PCI 133 MB/s only because for a similar board Retroweb says, "Any AGP cards inserted into this slot operate in PCI 33Mhz Fallback mode"
https://theretroweb.com/motherboards/s/asrock-p4dual-915gl

But, Retroweb is not the authority and there is no official Intel AGP behaviour called "PCI 33Mhz Fallback mode". Intel says it is always 66 MHz but that the messages transmitted at 66 MHz can be with or without the AGP extensions to PCI,

"The A.G.P. interface specification ... provides three significant performance extensions or enhancements to which are intended to the PCI specification ... These enhancements are realized through the use of “sideband” signals."

So, if you disable sideband, you disable the PCI extensions! Typically, at least in AGP 1.0 era, we mostly disabled the sideband. Furthermore, Intel specifications show is that PCI signals and transactions are within in AGP standards,

"Figure 3-30 is a basic PCI transaction on the A.G.P. interface. If the PCI agent is a non A.G.P. compliant master, it ignores the ST[2::0] signals and everything appears to be a PCI bus."

"The earliest the A.G.P. compliant master can request a PCI transaction is on clock 3, and the earliest the arbiter can grant permission is on clock 4, which allows the PCI compliant master to initiate its request on clock 6. The two clocks between the PCI transaction and the read data is caused because of potential contention on TRDY#. This can occur when the PCI compliant master is the core logic and the target is the A.G.P. compliant master."
https://www.dcs.ed.ac.uk/home/ecole/agp/agp10.pdf

So, the Intel AGP 1.0 spec implies that all AGP cards must be aware of PCI-style signalling and those of us old enough to have used AGP 1.0 were disabling the AGP-specific extensions to achieve stability.

AGI seems to exploit the old PCI-compatible subset of AGP, but that does not mean later AGP 3.0 cards/drivers were optimised to exercise the PCI-style transactions.

Now it seems the 33 MHz detail might be erroneous. It may be that when the AGP cards try to use PCI extensions on the AGI slot to make AGP transactions, the AGP card needs to gracefully fallback to making PCI transactions instead - exactly as the AGP card would have to do if you entered BIOS setup and disabled AGP sideband, disabled AGP aperture, disable AGP fast writes, etc.

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:03:

Socket3 wrote on 2026-06-07, 19:53:

133MHz is a huge bottleneck for DX7+ graphics cards. Take the FX 5200 for example. I have two almost identical cards - a Zotac P […]
Show full quote

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 18:10:

Ok, but AGP 1.0 was 3.3V too. Is there any objection to treating AGI vs AGP as PCI vs AGP?

My view is that a technical comparison should boil down to 8xAGP 2133 MB/s vs PCI 133 MB/s, and to have any real-world differentiator there needs to be evidence that 133 MB/s is a bottleneck during DX9 gameplay. I have never seen any evidence of that. My challenge is to surface that evidence, which might exist! I only know that during the DX6 generation the 133 MB/s limit was more imagined bottleneck than actual bottleneck.

Radeon 9700 Pro pumps data with 19.4 GB/s VRAM bandwidth, and I suspect games running on a 9700 don't give one hoot about the bus bandwidth. And, I say that because games running on a Voodoo3 with 2.3 GB/s VRAM bandwidth didn't give one hoot about bus bandwidth.

133MHz is a huge bottleneck for DX7+ graphics cards. Take the FX 5200 for example. I have two almost identical cards - a Zotac PCI FX 5200 (blue PCB) - 256MB of 5ns DDR over a 128 bit bus, running at 333Mhz vram and 250MHz core - and an Inno3D FX5200 "ultimate" (that's the name of the card, it's on the box) - black PCB, same exact elixir 5ns memory with the exact same layout (all 8 vram chips on the front of the card) only AGP. The inno3d card is clocked at 250mhz core and 400Mhz vram. On my Pentium 4 3400Mhz testbench (abit AS8 mainboard) the Zotac PCI card scores a whopping ~5900pts in 3D Mark 01, and that's after I overclocked the vram to 400Mhz to match the inno3d card (it's the same ram so why not give the PCI card a fair shot). The AGP Inno3D at the same clocks scored 8300 pts - 30% difference. If that's not a bottleneck, I don't know what is.

Furthermore, in UT2004 the Inno3D AGP card offers somewhat playable performance @ 1024x768 medium settings - the PCI card is unfortunately stutterfest central. Similar FPS but horrible frametimes making the game unplayable.

I'll post proof in the weekend. I have the benchmarks saved. I don't know if vogons will let me upload video, but I'll film both cards in UT2004 and try to post it. I'll make a new thread in the "video" section.

" Zotac PCI card scores a whopping ~5900pts in 3D Mark 01 ... AGP Inno3D at the same clocks scored 8300 pts"

In other words, the slower PCI bus bandwidth is not the limiting factor? You appear to be strengthening my argument by saying a PCI card outpaces the AGP card

What now? The Zotac is PCI, and is 30% slower than the Inno3D AGP card. Please read again.

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:03:

- exactly the same thing we saw with Voodoo3 PCI cards outpacing Voodoo3 AGP cards.

From my testing on a fast PC (KT333 / Athlon XP 2600+) the PCI version looses to the AGP Voodoo 3 3000. On a period correct machine there is no difference.

Socket3 wrote on 2026-06-07, 21:41:

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:03:

Socket3 wrote on 2026-06-07, 19:53:

133MHz is a huge bottleneck for DX7+ graphics cards. Take the FX 5200 for example. I have two almost identical cards - a Zotac PCI FX 5200 (blue PCB) - 256MB of 5ns DDR over a 128 bit bus, running at 333Mhz vram and 250MHz core - and an Inno3D FX5200 "ultimate" (that's the name of the card, it's on the box) - black PCB, same exact elixir 5ns memory with the exact same layout (all 8 vram chips on the front of the card) only AGP. The inno3d card is clocked at 250mhz core and 400Mhz vram. On my Pentium 4 3400Mhz testbench (abit AS8 mainboard) the Zotac PCI card scores a whopping ~5900pts in 3D Mark 01, and that's after I overclocked the vram to 400Mhz to match the inno3d card (it's the same ram so why not give the PCI card a fair shot). The AGP Inno3D at the same clocks scored 8300 pts - 30% difference. If that's not a bottleneck, I don't know what is.

Furthermore, in UT2004 the Inno3D AGP card offers somewhat playable performance @ 1024x768 medium settings - the PCI card is unfortunately stutterfest central. Similar FPS but horrible frametimes making the game unplayable.

I'll post proof in the weekend. I have the benchmarks saved. I don't know if vogons will let me upload video, but I'll film both cards in UT2004 and try to post it. I'll make a new thread in the "video" section.

" Zotac PCI card scores a whopping ~5900pts in 3D Mark 01 ... AGP Inno3D at the same clocks scored 8300 pts"

In other words, the slower PCI bus bandwidth is not the limiting factor? You appear to be strengthening my argument by saying a PCI card outpaces the AGP card - exactly the same thing we saw with Voodoo3 PCI cards outpacing Voodoo3 AGP cards.

What now? The Zotac is PCI, and is 30% slower than the Inno3D AGP card.

I explained on the previous page that I made a numeric dyslexic misread. Shit happens.

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 21:43:

Socket3 wrote on 2026-06-07, 21:41:

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 20:03:

" Zotac PCI card scores a whopping ~5900pts in 3D Mark 01 ... AGP Inno3D at the same clocks scored 8300 pts"

In other words, the slower PCI bus bandwidth is not the limiting factor? You appear to be strengthening my argument by saying a PCI card outpaces the AGP card - exactly the same thing we saw with Voodoo3 PCI cards outpacing Voodoo3 AGP cards.

What now? The Zotac is PCI, and is 30% slower than the Inno3D AGP card.

I explained on the previous page that I made a numeric dyslexic misread. Shit happens.

oh, sorry about that.

Agp = pci 2.3 + sideband + later reimplemented layer 1 signalling (4x/1.5v,8x.0.8v).

Most agp gpu chips were designed for the possibility of being used in pci cards. It's just smart engineering to make something that works in whatever scenario the oems want.
Matrox survived long past their prime purely on multi-headed cards.
Go look at some pci cards. You're unlikely to see a bunch of level shifters.

So that essentially means that any core you can find a pci version of could tolerate 3.3v, maybe even 5v signalling without blowing up.

Iirc nvidia did this better at the time.

Pcie solved a lot of annoying engineering problems.
You want a "slow bus" card for multi head? OK. Just just 8, 12 or 15 lanes off.

Ahrle wrote on 2026-06-01, 12:23:

SC-88 Pro, first part of project 357575 (35th birthday, computer #75 in collection, P75 equivalent (already failed but yeah x)) […]
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SC-88 Pro, first part of project 357575 (35th birthday, computer #75 in collection, P75 equivalent (already failed but yeah x))

Also ordered and on the way:
MIF-IPC-B
MPU-401
SC-55 MK2
Gainward W32i 1MB
CT3900 + 4x16MB (upgrading an SB32 while at it)
Similar style miditower (vlb crippled/insufficient space in current case)
DFI 386 board + DX33 and 8MB RAM for desktop case

PC spending PR beaten by over 100%, otoh just half a 5090 for all this amazement 😁

The attachment IMG_20260601_131547707.jpg is no longer available

Victim in question, bonus points if you can guess the game 😁

The attachment IMG_20260601_034759049[1].jpg is no longer available

Lovely

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 18:55:

So what? Where is the evidence that PCI bandwidth is a real-world bottleneck?

was already posted but you decided to troll about K6-2 garbage cpu differences instead of admitting being YUGELY wrong 😀

Dell Precision M70 - Win98SE/XP Machine

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it looked bad-ass.

I'll be digging into it more today. I broke it down already and passed off a very interesting part to my brother. Now, I've never seen anything like this, anyone know anything? I have some write-up to do on what I found so far, so check my Computer Lab thread later if you're interested.

I also picked these boys:

I haven't checked yet, but it looks like a TNT2 and a GeForce 4 MX440. They need a cleaning and testing. Might get to that, so they can be bagged/tagged. I'm still working on cleaning the parts from the M.M., hope the board works!

I bought two of the most maligned graphics cards of the 2000s:

- FX 5600 XT to go with the Duron (although I at least got a 128-bit version)
- X1550 to go with the Athlon64.

Yes, I enjoy being kicked in the head.

But seriously, I just wanna know if they're as bad as people like to say.

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it […]
Show full quote

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it looked bad-ass.

The attachment Screenshot 2026-06-08 170734.png is no longer available

I'll be digging into it more today. I broke it down already and passed off a very interesting part to my brother. Now, I've never seen anything like this, anyone know anything? I have some write-up to do on what I found so far, so check my Computer Lab thread later if you're interested.

The WHAT?

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

The attachment 20260607_181612.jpg is no longer available

The attachment 20260607_181547.jpg is no longer available

I also picked these boys:

The attachment 20260608_172632.jpg is no longer available

I haven't checked yet, but it looks like a TNT2 and a GeForce 4 MX440. They need a cleaning and testing. Might get to that, so they can be bagged/tagged. I'm still working on cleaning the parts from the M.M., hope the board works!

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking!

Honestly, it has some of the features required to function like a heatpipe, so it could be a some crazy DIY attempt at that concept. A fan would blow through the radiator and cause water vapor to condense and fall (assuming it is oriented properly) back down the tube to the heat plate which has a heatsink inside it to increase surface area (much like heatpipes have a fine copper structure\texture inside). Judging from the photo of the PC, it looks like it would be oriented with the cold plate mounted to the CPU and the radiator at the top of the case with a fan blowing down through it? That would be the "right" orientation for such a thing, I guess.

I kind of doubt that it worked very well... but who knows? If it was found inside an otherwise working computer it must have at least done enough function for a while? Or, it may have brought the PC to an early end by leaking and allowing the CPU to overheat, or causing a short.

Regardless, that is one of the weirdest and most unique items I've ever seen come out of a computer. Nice find. 😀

Ozzuneoj wrote on Yesterday, 23:42:

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking! […]
Show full quote

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it […]
Show full quote

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it looked bad-ass.

The attachment Screenshot 2026-06-08 170734.png is no longer available

I'll be digging into it more today. I broke it down already and passed off a very interesting part to my brother. Now, I've never seen anything like this, anyone know anything? I have some write-up to do on what I found so far, so check my Computer Lab thread later if you're interested.

The WHAT?

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

The attachment 20260607_181612.jpg is no longer available

The attachment 20260607_181547.jpg is no longer available

I also picked these boys:

The attachment 20260608_172632.jpg is no longer available

I haven't checked yet, but it looks like a TNT2 and a GeForce 4 MX440. They need a cleaning and testing. Might get to that, so they can be bagged/tagged. I'm still working on cleaning the parts from the M.M., hope the board works!

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking!

Just to clarify... was that actually inside that computer? What was the metal "cold plate" connected to?

Honestly, it has some of the features required to function like a heatpipe, so it could be a some crazy DIY attempt at that concept. A fan would blow through the radiator and cause water vapor to condense and fall (assuming it is oriented properly) back down the tube to the heat plate which has a heatsink inside it to increase surface area (much like heatpipes have a fine copper structure\texture to do the same thing).

Without a pump it couldn't be a traditional water cooler, so I am it's guessing a poorly sealed DIY heatpipe that also contained some non-corrosion-resistant metals. I kind of doubt that it worked very well... but who knows? If it was found inside an otherwise working computer it must have at least done enough to not be worse than a standalone heatsink. Or, it may have brought the PC to an early end by leaking and causing something important to overheat, or causing a short.

Regardless, that is one of the weirdest and most unique items I've ever seen come out of a computer. Nice find. 😀

It was indeed inside. Someone modified the crap out of the case to fit it in and it was oriented in a way that that makes sense. My brother was thinking the same.

The radiator part was tilted 45° approx taking up 3 bays and the "cold plate" part was bolted to the board (with no back plate, grandpa's screws, (brass, flathead) and some giant, board-bending springs). The 2-pin connector dangling is a thermal probe that is attached to the CPU-side of the cold plate. The bit on the glass nipple is an LED (white). Had some GP wood screws holding the fan in the bay.

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it […]
Show full quote

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it looked bad-ass.

The attachment Screenshot 2026-06-08 170734.png is no longer available

I'll be digging into it more today. I broke it down already and passed off a very interesting part to my brother. Now, I've never seen anything like this, anyone know anything? I have some write-up to do on what I found so far, so check my Computer Lab thread later if you're interested.

The WHAT?

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

The attachment 20260607_181612.jpg is no longer available

The attachment 20260607_181547.jpg is no longer available

I also picked these boys:

The attachment 20260608_172632.jpg is no longer available

I haven't checked yet, but it looks like a TNT2 and a GeForce 4 MX440. They need a cleaning and testing. Might get to that, so they can be bagged/tagged. I'm still working on cleaning the parts from the M.M., hope the board works!

That looks like some kind of DIY heat pipe thingy... It would be really interesting to see how it performs...

classic_cola wrote on Yesterday, 22:56:

I bought two of the most maligned graphics cards of the 2000s: […]
Show full quote

I bought two of the most maligned graphics cards of the 2000s:

- FX 5600 XT to go with the Duron (although I at least got a 128-bit version)
- X1550 to go with the Athlon64.

Yes, I enjoy being kicked in the head.

But seriously, I just wanna know if they're as bad as people like to say.

Well they both do mediocre job at best... Depending on the spec FX 5600 XT can do ok with up to DirectX 8.1 titles.

Meanwhile I continued my shopping for early Radeons...

This time I got two models of 7500 DDR. The original ATI, and a Hercules one.

I hope to get the one from Gigabyte as well in the future. These top Radeon 7000 series really hold a special unobtanium space in my memory since back then I couldn't afford them and I had to suffer with VE version... Can't wait to test these babies. 😁😎

Major Jackyl wrote on Today, 00:00:

It was indeed inside. Someone modified the crap out of the case to fit it in and it was oriented in a way that that makes sense. […]
Show full quote

Ozzuneoj wrote on Yesterday, 23:42:

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking! […]
Show full quote

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it […]
Show full quote

I got a mystery machine again! I got the thing because it was SCREAMING "unusual". Also, I really wanted that Abit 478 board, it looked bad-ass.

The attachment Screenshot 2026-06-08 170734.png is no longer available

I'll be digging into it more today. I broke it down already and passed off a very interesting part to my brother. Now, I've never seen anything like this, anyone know anything? I have some write-up to do on what I found so far, so check my Computer Lab thread later if you're interested.

The WHAT?

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

The attachment 20260607_181612.jpg is no longer available

The attachment 20260607_181547.jpg is no longer available

I also picked these boys:

The attachment 20260608_172632.jpg is no longer available

I haven't checked yet, but it looks like a TNT2 and a GeForce 4 MX440. They need a cleaning and testing. Might get to that, so they can be bagged/tagged. I'm still working on cleaning the parts from the M.M., hope the board works!

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking!

Just to clarify... was that actually inside that computer? What was the metal "cold plate" connected to?

Honestly, it has some of the features required to function like a heatpipe, so it could be a some crazy DIY attempt at that concept. A fan would blow through the radiator and cause water vapor to condense and fall (assuming it is oriented properly) back down the tube to the heat plate which has a heatsink inside it to increase surface area (much like heatpipes have a fine copper structure\texture to do the same thing).

Without a pump it couldn't be a traditional water cooler, so I am it's guessing a poorly sealed DIY heatpipe that also contained some non-corrosion-resistant metals. I kind of doubt that it worked very well... but who knows? If it was found inside an otherwise working computer it must have at least done enough to not be worse than a standalone heatsink. Or, it may have brought the PC to an early end by leaking and causing something important to overheat, or causing a short.

Regardless, that is one of the weirdest and most unique items I've ever seen come out of a computer. Nice find. 😀

It was indeed inside. Someone modified the crap out of the case to fit it in and it was oriented in a way that that makes sense. My brother was thinking the same.

The attachment 20260608_184826.jpg is no longer available

The radiator part was tilted 45° approx taking up 3 bays and the "cold plate" part was bolted to the board (with no back plate, grandpa's screws, (brass, flathead) and some giant, board-bending springs). The 2-pin connector dangling is a thermal probe that is attached to the CPU-side of the cold plate. The bit on the glass nipple is an LED (white). Had some GP wood screws holding the fan in the bay.

Spoiler

The board is dead, so maybe this DID have a hand in that. CPU is good still.(2.8P4HT)

Wow! That is an incredibly cobbled cooling setup! I love the grandpa's screws thing too! No disrespect to the older folks among us (I am in my 40s), but any time I have come into possession of containers of someone's misc computer or electronic parts I can immediately tell if it was an "old guy" if there is an abundance of flat head screws. 🤣

(Funny enough, I ended up buying some round top brass flathead screws for a speaker project I completed about 10 years ago. So, if someone ever gets my leftover pile of old screws they will probably think I was 40 years older when they find half a package of those, brand new.)

Must have been such a fun experiment! I have tried searching for several things and I cannot figure out what that 3M glass bubble thing actually is. It almost looks like some of these components are at least vaguely intended to be used together, but... 🤷

Are there any signs of water damage on the board? It's from peak cap plague era, so if it isn't working and there isn't any sign of water damage then there's a good chance it is due to bad caps.

Shader_BiH wrote on Today, 02:07:

Meanwhile I continued my shopping for early Radeons... […]
Show full quote

Meanwhile I continued my shopping for early Radeons...

This time I got two models of 7500 DDR. The original ATI, and a Hercules one.

I hope to get the one from Gigabyte as well in the future. These top Radeon 7000 series really hold a special unobtanium space in my memory since back then I couldn't afford them and I had to suffer with VE version... Can't wait to test these babies. 😁😎

Nice, 7500 DDR is the one of the best value cards of 2001. Always nice to finally afford dreams from younger days. Enjoy it!

Ozzuneoj wrote on Today, 03:02:

Wow! That is an incredibly cobbled cooling setup! I love the grandpa's screws thing too! No disrespect to the older folks among […]
Show full quote

Major Jackyl wrote on Today, 00:00:

It was indeed inside. Someone modified the crap out of the case to fit it in and it was oriented in a way that that makes sense. […]
Show full quote

Ozzuneoj wrote on Yesterday, 23:42:

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking! […]
Show full quote

Wow... that gizmo is STRANGE looking!

Just to clarify... was that actually inside that computer? What was the metal "cold plate" connected to?

Honestly, it has some of the features required to function like a heatpipe, so it could be a some crazy DIY attempt at that concept. A fan would blow through the radiator and cause water vapor to condense and fall (assuming it is oriented properly) back down the tube to the heat plate which has a heatsink inside it to increase surface area (much like heatpipes have a fine copper structure\texture to do the same thing).

Without a pump it couldn't be a traditional water cooler, so I am it's guessing a poorly sealed DIY heatpipe that also contained some non-corrosion-resistant metals. I kind of doubt that it worked very well... but who knows? If it was found inside an otherwise working computer it must have at least done enough to not be worse than a standalone heatsink. Or, it may have brought the PC to an early end by leaking and causing something important to overheat, or causing a short.

Regardless, that is one of the weirdest and most unique items I've ever seen come out of a computer. Nice find. 😀

It was indeed inside. Someone modified the crap out of the case to fit it in and it was oriented in a way that that makes sense. My brother was thinking the same.

The attachment 20260608_184826.jpg is no longer available

The radiator part was tilted 45° approx taking up 3 bays and the "cold plate" part was bolted to the board (with no back plate, grandpa's screws, (brass, flathead) and some giant, board-bending springs). The 2-pin connector dangling is a thermal probe that is attached to the CPU-side of the cold plate. The bit on the glass nipple is an LED (white). Had some GP wood screws holding the fan in the bay.

Spoiler

The board is dead, so maybe this DID have a hand in that. CPU is good still.(2.8P4HT)

Wow! That is an incredibly cobbled cooling setup! I love the grandpa's screws thing too! No disrespect to the older folks among us (I am in my 40s), but any time I have come into possession of containers of someone's misc computer or electronic parts I can immediately tell if it was an "old guy" if there is an abundance of flat head screws. 🤣

(Funny enough, I ended up buying some round top brass flathead screws for a speaker project I completed about 10 years ago. So, if someone ever gets my leftover pile of old screws they will probably think I was 40 years older when they find half a package of those, brand new.)

Must have been such a fun experiment! I have tried searching for several things and I cannot figure out what that 3M glass bubble thing actually is. It almost looks like some of these components are at least vaguely intended to be used together, but

Are there any signs of water damage on the board? It's from peak cap plague era, so if it isn't working and there isn't any sign of water damage then there's a good chance it is due to bad caps.

I found square head nut and bolt in a tin of hardware I picked up and thought "Whoa, this must be a 4th generation old guy stash."

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

The attachment 20260607_181612.jpg is no longer available

The attachment 20260607_181547.jpg is no longer available

sure looks like some sort of 3M Fluorinert system 😮

rasz_pl wrote on Yesterday, 13:18:

MattRocks wrote on 2026-06-07, 18:55:

So what? Where is the evidence that PCI bandwidth is a real-world bottleneck?

was already posted but you decided to troll about K6-2 garbage cpu differences instead of admitting being YUGELY wrong 😀

Not convincingly. PCI FX5200 faster than AGP FX5200 therefore PCI is bandwidth constrained = lazy analysis.

Attached photo shows a PCI GeForce2 MX with visible extra silicon to bridge the AGP GPU to the PCI port. Very few cards deliver balanced AGP vs PCI comparison because the signal paths are often modified to make cross-compatibility possible, which means you're not purely testing the ports in gaming - you're testing various other things including latency over an improvised signal paths, and possibly different driver optimisations. 3Dfx chips did not need any bridging hardware - and 3Dfx chips on AGP ports did not outpace 3Dfx chips on PCI ports. In fact, anecdotal Voodoo3 evidence suggests AGP complexity might have introduced latency.

rasz_pl wrote on Today, 04:41:

Major Jackyl wrote on Yesterday, 22:38:

I can't even make a good guess on this one (aside from the fact that it is a cooler of some kind). Sealed system with a gas? The clear part is glass. The little nipple on the pipe looks like where it was sealed.

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sure looks like some sort of 3M Fluorinert system 😮

I have no idea and have never seen anything like it, but the end with the filter makes me think that it was attached to a fan and was meant to send cold air right to the CPU?
Interesting though