The more I spend time with Windows 95/98. The more I honestly start to despise using them.

From all the verious issues running DOS games within 9X, to drivers, to tryna set it up just the way I want, to the instability, it's just tiring and often more pain then it should be.

Im so thankful for all the improvements windows has seen over the years. And for retro computers? I think I'm just gonna stay a DOS person when I don't need 9x specific apps.

SodaSuccubus wrote on 2020-12-10, 00:14:

The more I spend time with Windows 95/98. The more I honestly start to despise using them.

From all the verious issues running DOS games within 9X, to drivers, to tryna set it up just the way I want, to the instability, it's just tiring and often more pain then it should be.

Im so thankful for all the improvements windows has seen over the years. And for retro computers? I think I'm just gonna stay a DOS person when I don't need 9x specific apps.

I know that feeling, my enthusiasm for late 90's stuff plummets once I have to start dealing with Win9x even though I love the hardware and many games of that era.

What I despise the most is that when you mess up a driver installation or need to rollback something it's difficult to know how much garbage is being left behind that will come and bite you later on. DOS in comparison is so much lighter and easier to troubleshoot, just add or remove stuff from CONFIG.SYS/AUTOEXEC.BAT, and you can even install the OS on other machine and transplant it without much hassle... try doing that with Win9x 🤣.

Oh, and I've always despised the "Windows is rebuilding the driver database..." pop-up, that was usually a sign that your OS installation was about to be tainted with useless Windows bloat.

With me its the opposite. The more I use the older Windows 9x versions, the more I hate the actual version.

That's why I install essentials only, just enough to get a system running with apps, but minus drivers for devices that are likely to be swapped out, then make a backup. For me, that means everything except graphics drivers, as my intention has always been to test my collection - thousands of CPUs and graphics cards, plus well over 100 motherboards (motherboards will be tested, to keep the best with a small selection of decent CPUs). Having a basic backup with only graphics drivers needed means I can screw things up as much as I want, and it only takes an hour to restore it 😀

Got the old T2155CDS up and running. Had to install DOS 6.22 on my Contura 400C, as the T2155CDS didn't come with a floppy drive. Transferred the benchmark apps, drivers, and Windows 3.11 installs using my IDE to USB converter cable. The screen is in need of replacement due to bad shadowing. I might have to explore options for a CDT (Active TFT) replacement.

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 01:38:

With me its the opposite. The more I use the older Windows 9x versions, the more I hate the actual version.

Hah?

SodaSuccubus wrote on 2020-12-10, 00:14:

The more I spend time with Windows 95/98. The more I honestly start to despise using them.

From all the verious issues running DOS games within 9X, to drivers, to tryna set it up just the way I want, to the instability, it's just tiring and often more pain then it should be.

Im so thankful for all the improvements windows has seen over the years. And for retro computers? I think I'm just gonna stay a DOS person when I don't need 9x specific apps.

Unfortunately, a good chunk of the games I enjoyed in my teenage years are Win9x games so I can't discard them completely.

To be fair, they also add a fair amount of convenience to a DOS PC, particularly by enabling USB storage support and easy TCP/IP networking. That said, you can always boot a live linux distro aimed at retro computers such as Puppy Retro 4.1.2 to do these..

TheMobRules wrote on 2020-12-10, 00:32:

What I despise the most is that when you mess up a driver installation or need to rollback something it's difficult to know how much garbage is being left behind that will come and bite you later on. DOS in comparison is so much lighter and easier to troubleshoot, just add or remove stuff from CONFIG.SYS/AUTOEXEC.BAT, and you can even install the OS on other machine and transplant it without much hassle... try doing that with Win9x 🤣.

This is so true. At some point (that comes very soon) I do a clean install of W98. I've done this so many times that I remember the product key literally by heart. 😁

My Windows 98SE installation is 5 years old and rock stable. What are you all doing to your installations ?!
In comparison, I had to reinstall Windows XP (multiboot config) twice in the same span of time (HAL corrupted each time, seemingly for no reasons).
And activate the bloody thing via phone, of course. Each time.

xcomcmdr wrote on 2020-12-10, 09:31:

My Windows 98SE installation is 5 years old and rock stable. What are you all doing to your installations ?!
In comparison, I had to reinstall Windows XP (multiboot config) twice in the same span of time (HAL corrupted each time, seemingly for no reasons).
And activate the bloody thing via phone, of course. Each time.

The was my experience with the original version of Windows 98 as well. It was the main family computer for 5-6 years and the ppp gateway for two other systems via my 10Base2 home network. No re-installation carried out in that time just regular maintenance using Crap Cleaner and such. Kario was my firewall and AVG my systems virus scanner.

I mostly test different sound cards and softsynth MIDI software on the W98 machine. And it's not that it's unstable. But if something does not work, it's easier to do a clean install, rather that figure out what causes the issue.
And in reverse I have a 5-6 y.o. Win XP install that works absolutely perfectly, despite there is a TON of stuff installed.

Caluser2000 wrote on 2020-12-10, 06:10:

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 01:38:

With me its the opposite. The more I use the older Windows 9x versions, the more I hate the actual version.

Hah?

Windows 3.11 = Great!!
Windows 95 = Good
Windows 98 = Very good
Windows 2000 = Awesome
Windows Me = Garbage
Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8 = Sh*t
Windows 10 = Even with all the Tylenol in the world, I cannot avoid the headache that is to use this pile of sh*t. Wait, I can. Just uninstall it.

IMO Microsoft stopped doing good stuff after 2000.

A rather ad-hoc cooling solution for a GeForce4 Ti4200-8X (winfast A280LE) that had a busted fan.

I realise that the case fan is pushing air away but its pretty drafty and the heatsink is never hot to touch so it seems fine. The sensor was saying 52deg c after running 3dmark 2001 a few times.

Glad it works, bought it in a combo P4 2.4 and intel 845 mobo deal for cheap (too cheap, i think he didnt know what kind of card it was due to the odd labelling), but its gone into my athlonxp 2200+ / asus a7n8x-x nforce board.

brief history 😁

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:14:

Windows 3.11 = Great!! Windows 95 = Good Windows 98 = Very good Windows 2000 = Awesome Windows Me = Garbage Windows XP, Vista, […]
Show full quote

Caluser2000 wrote on 2020-12-10, 06:10:

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 01:38:

With me its the opposite. The more I use the older Windows 9x versions, the more I hate the actual version.

Hah?

Windows 3.11 = Great!!
Windows 95 = Good
Windows 98 = Very good
Windows 2000 = Awesome
Windows Me = Garbage
Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8 = Sh*t
Windows 10 = Even with all the Tylenol in the world, I cannot avoid the headache that is to use this pile of sh*t. Wait, I can. Just uninstall it.

IMO Microsoft stopped doing good stuff after 2000.

Bondi wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:20:

brief history 😁
771px-Windowses.jpg

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:14:

Windows 3.11 = Great!! Windows 95 = Good Windows 98 = Very good Windows 2000 = Awesome Windows Me = Garbage Windows XP, Vista, […]
Show full quote

Caluser2000 wrote on 2020-12-10, 06:10:

Hah?

Windows 3.11 = Great!!
Windows 95 = Good
Windows 98 = Very good
Windows 2000 = Awesome
Windows Me = Garbage
Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8 = Sh*t
Windows 10 = Even with all the Tylenol in the world, I cannot avoid the headache that is to use this pile of sh*t. Wait, I can. Just uninstall it.

IMO Microsoft stopped doing good stuff after 2000.

Actually that's wrong, as it should have been:

3.0 Good
3.1 Shit
3.11 fWG Good
Win95 Shit
Win98 Good
WinMe Shit
Win2K Good
WinXP Shit
Win2K3 Good
Win Vista Shit
Win 7 Good
Win 8 Shit
Win 8.1 Good
Win 10 Shit

I would say something like this:

95 and 98FE - beta versions of 98SE, avoid
98SE - OK
ME - total mistake, avoid
the original release of XP - beta, avoid
XP with SP2+ - OK

Windows was a good name choice, for something that's never had doors, walls, a roof or a floor.

Shreddoc wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:41:

Windows was a good name choice, for something that's never had doors, walls, a roof or a floor.

More like:
first, let's install windows in the air
and then, let's build the wall around these windows

The history of Windows is probably the best example how an OS shouldn't be made:
in 1985, they made a GUI
in 1993, with the NT, they added an OS to that GUI

Shreddoc wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:41:

Windows was a good name choice, for something that's never had doors, walls, a roof or a floor.

It's also a good name for something that really didn't have windows in the sense we think of them today in its initial release (The shell is basically MS-DOS and windows can't really be overlayed, only tiled). If anything, the Amiga Workbench 1.x was closer in function to Windows we know today than Windows 1.0 was. Strange name. Though, I guess if you ever used Windows 1.0 (I did in 1991, for a single year) then you know where the Microsoft logo comes from..

appiah4 wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:24:

Actually that's wrong, as it should have been: […]
Show full quote

Bondi wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:20:

brief history 😁
771px-Windowses.jpg

Bruninho wrote on 2020-12-10, 10:14:

Windows 3.11 = Great!! Windows 95 = Good Windows 98 = Very good Windows 2000 = Awesome Windows Me = Garbage Windows XP, Vista, […]
Show full quote

Windows 3.11 = Great!!
Windows 95 = Good
Windows 98 = Very good
Windows 2000 = Awesome
Windows Me = Garbage
Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8 = Sh*t
Windows 10 = Even with all the Tylenol in the world, I cannot avoid the headache that is to use this pile of sh*t. Wait, I can. Just uninstall it.

IMO Microsoft stopped doing good stuff after 2000.

Actually that's wrong, as it should have been:

3.0 Good
3.1 Shit
3.11 fWG Good
Win95 Shit
Win98 Good
Win98 Shit
Win2K Good
WinXP Shit
Win2K3 Good
Win Vista Shit
Win 7 Good
Win 8 Shit
Win 8.1 Good
Win 10 Shit

Pretty close, I could agree