VOGONS


First post, by alienmuffim

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Hi all,

I recently obtained a Dell Dimension T800r running Win98 SE and wanted to upgrade its video card, an old Rage Turbo Pro, to a GeForce 3 Ti200. I understood that the GF3 is a 4x AGP card (v2.0) and the motherboard found within my Dell, an SE440BX-3, supported AGP 2x (v1.0). However, the card has notches for both types of voltages, seemingly making it universal and compatible with the motherboard according this page that I have seen referenced oh-so-many times.

I’ve pored over the computer’s user manual, the motherboard’s manual, the AGPSet manual, and countless posts over the past decades that debate AGP compatibility. However, when I plug my GF3 in and boot the computer, it seemingly works with the fans running, but I get no display on my monitor, and I don’t hear the usual beep on start up. No beeps at all, in fact.

The service lights on the back do give me an indication of an error though, a PCI Bus Failure. So either it’s the card itself or it’s something with the motherboard not liking it? I know AGP compatibility has a very spotty history. When I restore the old card, it works just fine.

I haven’t really tried any troubleshooting since I’m unsure of what’s really worth trying. No clue if it’s some sort of BIOS thing, or chipset thing, or if it really could be the card itself. I might buy some other 4x card and try it out instead (or maybe just keep this as a DOS machine and source parts for an XP build), but really want to figure this out if possible. Any idea of what I could try? Thanks!

Reply 1 of 12, by leonardo

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Well really first you have to rule out card vs mobo. Can you get image out of the GeForce on any motherboard you connect it to? As soon as you do, you can call it a compatibility issue. Until then, I assume bad card.

[Install Win95 like you were born in 1985!] on systems like this or this.

Reply 2 of 12, by alienmuffim

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Ah, unfortunately, I just recently got into retro computing (this is my first foray into it) so I don’t have any other machine laying around that takes AGP cards… Definitely a valid assumption about the card though.

Reply 3 of 12, by Ozzuneoj

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I would check the card over for any bloated or damaged capacitors, and clean the AGP contacts with a pencil eraser.

Feel free to post some clear high-res pictures of both sides of the card if you want help looking it over. 😀

Now for some blitting from the back buffer.

Reply 4 of 12, by alienmuffim

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Can definitely try cleaning when I get a chance. You’re saying on the card or the motherboard (both?)? I do have some photos of the card. It looks okay I think. Granted I haven’t removed the heat sink or anything.

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Reply 5 of 12, by Ozzuneoj

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alienmuffim wrote on 2025-07-28, 21:18:

Can definitely try cleaning when I get a chance. You’re saying on the card or the motherboard (both?)? I do have some photos of the card. It looks okay I think. Granted I haven’t removed the heat sink or anything.

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In my experience, those passively cooled OEM Ti 200 cards are pretty reliable and the caps rarely go bad. At a quick glance I don't see any physical damage to any of the SMD components on the back either.

I would definitely take a pencil eraser to the AGP contacts on the card itself. I have revived a lot of cards that way and it is easy to do (you'll see it get real shiny).

I wouldn't do anything with the AGP slot on the board though since other cards work fine.

Also, have you tried both VGA and DVI? DVI output on cards of that era can be finicky.

Now for some blitting from the back buffer.

Reply 6 of 12, by smtkr

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If you're going to get into retro computing, I highly recommend getting some cheap junk for free to use for troubleshooting/backup. It's the best way to see if a part you have is defective/incompatible--swap it with a known working part.

For example, I have an old PCI Trident graphics card that was free (i.e., going to ewaste). And I have junk like that for every part that goes into a system from that era.

Reply 7 of 12, by alienmuffim

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Ozzuneoj wrote on 2025-07-29, 00:01:
In my experience, those passively cooled OEM Ti 200 cards are pretty reliable and the caps rarely go bad. At a quick glance I do […]
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alienmuffim wrote on 2025-07-28, 21:18:

Can definitely try cleaning when I get a chance. You’re saying on the card or the motherboard (both?)? I do have some photos of the card. It looks okay I think. Granted I haven’t removed the heat sink or anything.

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In my experience, those passively cooled OEM Ti 200 cards are pretty reliable and the caps rarely go bad. At a quick glance I don't see any physical damage to any of the SMD components on the back either.

I would definitely take a pencil eraser to the AGP contacts on the card itself. I have revived a lot of cards that way and it is easy to do (you'll see it get real shiny).

I wouldn't do anything with the AGP slot on the board though since other cards work fine.

Also, have you tried both VGA and DVI? DVI output on cards of that era can be finicky.

Tried this out. While the contacts did look shinier, it had no effect unfortunately 🙁 Thanks for the suggestion though.

smtkr wrote on 2025-07-29, 01:39:

If you're going to get into retro computing, I highly recommend getting some cheap junk for free to use for troubleshooting/backup. It's the best way to see if a part you have is defective/incompatible--swap it with a known working part.

For example, I have an old PCI Trident graphics card that was free (i.e., going to ewaste). And I have junk like that for every part that goes into a system from that era.

I am quickly learning this 🤣!

Reply 8 of 12, by alienmuffim

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Ozzuneoj wrote on 2025-07-29, 00:01:

Also, have you tried both VGA and DVI? DVI output on cards of that era can be finicky.

Oh, and I've only been using VGA. My monitor just sits in an idle state as if the PC had never turned on. I doubt it's a display issue though considering the BIOS isn't even POSTing and the diagnostic lights don't seem to point to that.

Reply 9 of 12, by chinny22

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I've personally run a GF4 Ti 4600 just fine in the same motherboard and the FX series are also a popular choice so would think your GF3 Ti should also work.

One thing you can try is resetting bios back to default with the "System Board Configuration Jumper" (Page 50 in the user manual you linked)

as others have said my next step would be test with another card, Your parts list will grow with time, eg you already have a Rage Turbo Pro to test with after this upgrade

Reply 10 of 12, by Grem Five

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alienmuffim wrote on 2025-07-28, 20:16:

Ah, unfortunately, I just recently got into retro computing (this is my first foray into it) so I don’t have any other machine laying around that takes AGP cards… Definitely a valid assumption about the card though.

I have a Dell T600r board and it works just fine with my MSI (Medion) GF3 Ti200.

Since this is your 1st foray into retro computing I will mention this if you do not know it. With Dell machines (and a few others) make sure you use only the psu that came with it as it has a non standard ATX pin out. A Permanent Solution to the Dell 'Fake ATX' Power Supply Problem?

Reply 11 of 12, by leonardo

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Also, that card runs super hot - as in I burnt my fingers touching the heatsink after a short test round. If the card lives, you'll want to strap a fan on it for sure.

[Install Win95 like you were born in 1985!] on systems like this or this.

Reply 12 of 12, by alienmuffim

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chinny22 wrote on 2025-07-29, 03:23:

I've personally run a GF4 Ti 4600 just fine in the same motherboard and the FX series are also a popular choice so would think your GF3 Ti should also work.

One thing you can try is resetting bios back to default with the "System Board Configuration Jumper" (Page 50 in the user manual you linked)

as others have said my next step would be test with another card, Your parts list will grow with time, eg you already have a Rage Turbo Pro to test with after this upgrade

No dice. It was interesting though since after I set the BIOS back to default and installed the GF3 (with the jumper still on maintenance mode), I actually got the initial beep, but still no display. I waited a little longer only to hear the 1-2 beep code (indicated on page 4of the manual) meaning it doesn't even detect the card.

Before all this, I installed the latest chipset drivers for the motherboard (3.20.1008) in case that was part of the issue, but it obviously had no effect.

Grem Five wrote on 2025-07-29, 13:34:
alienmuffim wrote on 2025-07-28, 20:16:

Ah, unfortunately, I just recently got into retro computing (this is my first foray into it) so I don’t have any other machine laying around that takes AGP cards… Definitely a valid assumption about the card though.

I have a Dell T600r board and it works just fine with my MSI (Medion) GF3 Ti200.

Since this is your 1st foray into retro computing I will mention this if you do not know it. With Dell machines (and a few others) make sure you use only the psu that came with it as it has a non standard ATX pin out. A Permanent Solution to the Dell 'Fake ATX' Power Supply Problem?

Yup, I've known about these proprietary PSUs that come with Dell machines. So I really hope this isn't an issue with that. It's just odd since I've seen plenty of posts about other t-series Dells having no problems with 4x or even 8x cards such as the FX! We all share the same motherboard! Sigh.