Namrok wrote on 2025-07-05, 17:41:

the3dfxdude wrote on 2025-07-05, 16:59:

Living wrote on 2025-07-05, 12:39:

that part comes when you want help online and find the toxic community that Linux is built around

Linux is not built around toxic online communities. The key to what you are saying is toxic online communities. It's toxic because it's online because there are cowards that wouldn't act this way otherwise because they get away with it online. Just find other people, preferably a friend you know that uses linux and it won't be toxic, and he'll show you things. Then you'll find that linux is just another OS when you remove yourself from toxic communities, getting away from the net a little. I know dozens of people that use linux, everyday, main OS, work, games, etc. They just use it, and just works. And nobody talks about toxic people online and then make the conclusion that linux is toxic.

You know, with the complete collapse of several communities I used to be a part of, I think I'm coming around to the idea that communities need a certain level of "toxicity" to maintain any sort of identity at all. And yeah, it's obnoxious when you ask a stupid question and some Linux nerd berates you for not knowing the shell script to fix it off the top of your head. But then again, that same community erupts in "toxicity" when Linux distros attempt to add telemetry, or drop 32-bit support, or other BS a meeker community might roll over and take in the name of not being "toxic".

Toxic != Having an opinion, explaining one's reasoning, citing facts, etc

Civil people can and do agree to disagree.

Having principles, ethics and a spine is not toxic.

IMHO, toxicity starts when humility and/or respect for others end.

Intel486dx33 wrote on 2025-07-04, 23:37:

Apple CEO Tim Cook said “what good is RAM if you are not using it”.

It's funny to hear that from the company that still puts 8GB of RAM in a lot of their computers (and claims that it's just as good as 16GB of RAM on Windows). I keep hearing about Apple Silicon Macs having high SSD failure rates from virtual memory usage.
[/quote]

It's funny that people seem to repeat the same message forever, even when facts have already changed. 😉

How do you expect Linux to thrive if most "programmers" can't even get their shit working properly on Windows in higher-level languages?

darry wrote on 2025-07-05, 23:29:

Toxic != Having an opinion, explaining one's reasoning, citing facts, etc […]
Show full quote

Namrok wrote on 2025-07-05, 17:41:

You know, with the complete collapse of several communities I used to be a part of, I think I'm coming around to the idea that communities need a certain level of "toxicity" to maintain any sort of identity at all. And yeah, it's obnoxious when you ask a stupid question and some Linux nerd berates you for not knowing the shell script to fix it off the top of your head. But then again, that same community erupts in "toxicity" when Linux distros attempt to add telemetry, or drop 32-bit support, or other BS a meeker community might roll over and take in the name of not being "toxic".

Toxic != Having an opinion, explaining one's reasoning, citing facts, etc

Civil people can and do agree to disagree.

Having principles, ethics and a spine is not toxic.

IMHO, toxicity starts when humility and/or respect for others end.

I basically agree with the both of you. People should be able to give feedback to their chosen vendor even if it sounds harsh. (one example is Microsoft, as with here) Because how else does a provider even know if know one speaks up? It's when the users, start taking sides, with one taking the side of the fanboys, that Microsoft can do nothing wrong, and best thing since sliced bread, and the users, threatening to leave, because they are dropping 32-bit support (or whatever TPM junky thing is required). But to the fanboys, it's always "get with the times". That's when I'm done with that conversation, because when it's users fighting users, it's just a waste of time. Linux does have both happening as well, and deserves feedback as well. But it isn't Linux's fault that a fight breaks out between the vendors and the users, but something just as necessary as when it happens with Microsoft, and the same will happen with Red Hat as that is likely a source people are getting Linux through. But when, online, the fanboys stand up in the way and disrupt the conversations, well... I'd just walk around them. Online forums are probably not really the place to provide feedback to the vendor. I do have to commend the people at vogons are generally pretty nice and don't wade into the weeds over controversies.

The most common linux failures I get involve /etc/fstab. It's still no windows volume management. Take a physical drive out before commenting the relevant volumes to mount? Have a power interruption and it has to fsck itself? Oh no you can't go to the desktop!!!!

leileilol wrote on Yesterday, 18:13:

Oh no you can't go to the desktop!!!!

Hint: Linux is perfectly usable without the desktop.

UCyborg wrote on Yesterday, 12:51:

How do you expect Linux to thrive if most "programmers" can't even get their shit working properly on Windows in higher-level languages?

I have to wonder how much stuff even works by pure accident. (don't mind me I'm still amused by your notes when you were working on the I76 AiO patch)

Grzyb wrote on Yesterday, 19:59:

Hint: Linux is perfectly usable without the desktop.

Hint: Look at the bigger picture; no one is willingly dumping win10 to use GNU/emacs in a fucking prompt.

There's many usability issues with Linux currently and I'm not brushing those away. xfce4's my favorite DE and that has a lot of things it can't do that Windows 95 can.

Also good luck doing art and playing games without a desktop 🤣.

leileilol wrote on Yesterday, 18:13:

The most common linux failures I get involve /etc/fstab. It's still no windows volume management. Take a physical drive out before commenting the relevant volumes to mount? Have a power interruption and it has to fsck itself? Oh no you can't go to the desktop!!!!

If on windows, you can't boot from your system drive due to a corrupted environment, you'll get a black screen telling you to boot a setup disk to try to repair. You won't get a desktop either. How do you expect to get a desktop from a broken system? Either use the provided shell if possible or boot from a portable linux system or rescue disk and get a "desktop". There are many choices here if you like using a graphical desktop.

In 25 years of using linux, fsck was automatic, fixed and done, and continued booting the system, except once. That one time actually was due to faulty hardware.

Did you pull out a drive needed to boot the system?

the3dfxdude wrote on Today, 03:26:

If on windows, you can't boot from your system drive due to a corrupted environment, you'll get a black screen telling you to boot a setup disk to try to repair.

In linux's case, it didn't even have to be a system volume for it to panic- just one id it can't find and you're sent to shell. Nice try though

leileilol wrote on Today, 03:39:

the3dfxdude wrote on Today, 03:26:

If on windows, you can't boot from your system drive due to a corrupted environment, you'll get a black screen telling you to boot a setup disk to try to repair.

In linux's case, it didn't even have to be a system volume for it to panic- just one id it can't find and you're sent to shell. Nice try though

Nice try, what? You configured a filesystem to be required at boot, and to be checked. Then you either pulled the drive or corrupted the system to not boot. If the disk is not required to boot, then don't configure it to be required to be checked and mounted at boot. Besides, there are such things as rescue disks to save you from not having a gui desktop. This is not linux's fault. You'll get the same thing if you use windows that way.

DracoNihil wrote on Yesterday, 21:35:

I have to wonder how much stuff even works by pure accident. (don't mind me I'm still amused by your notes when you were working on the I76 AiO patch)

Oh that's one fun example. Don't get me wrong, programming is hard, hence why I'll never be one, I'm too dumb, admittedly. And I get overwhelmed quickly. I just got the hunch that most of us, including developers, don't even really know what we're doing.

I found a solution to further improve stability in Interstate '76, now nGlide wrapper and audio survive for longer periods, just have to tidy up a bit and transplant patches to the expansion, which I haven't got around to yet.

leileilol wrote on Yesterday, 18:13:

The most common linux failures I get involve /etc/fstab. It's still no windows volume management. Take a physical drive out before commenting the relevant volumes to mount? Have a power interruption and it has to fsck itself? Oh no you can't go to the desktop!!!!

What happened to me not too long ago on older KUbuntu, when Cloudflare still locked up Pale Moon web browser forever, the whole graphical session froze. Didn't respond to CTRL + Alt + Backspace either. I had to push reset button and when it was supposed to start booting, all I got was a blinking cursor. I ended up fixing it by running fsck on its partition from live distro on USB.

So if fsck was supposed to be kick in automatically, it didn't.

UCyborg wrote on Today, 11:03:

now nGlide wrapper and audio survive for longer periods, just have to tidy up a bit and transplant patches to the expansion, which I haven't got around to yet.

Unfortunately recent regressions in Wine make the nGlide wrapper impossible to use, it just causes Wine to segfault from some stack/buffer overflow.

I primarily play the game with the -gdi switch because the software renderer both looks nicer to me and does things the hardware renderers don't. (the "motion blur" when you get shellshocked from collisions)