Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

[*]The CPU: That Duron isn't fast enough for a machine like this one, and even if it was I wanna preserve the little rascal for sentimental reasons, since I had it and used it since 2002 at least. I was thinking to an Athlon XP, maybe something not that fast (under 2Ghz, if possible, for compatibility with some games I wanna play), maybe even from the mobile series. What are your experiences with them? I was eying either a 2500+ or a 2600+ from the Barton series, that's very cheap and uses a little under 70W of power, wich shouldn't be a problem for the cooler I have.

Are there any games which actually have issues with faster CPUs at that point? I may be totally wrong but AFAIK at this point faster=better with no downsides.

That said 2500+ barton, AXDA2500DKV4D, 333x11 is a fun one as many (most?) of them run at 400x11 just fine, becoming basically 3200+ - the fastest S462 CPU.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

[*]The HDD: Currently I put in the machine a 2.5 inch 250GB sata HDD I recovered from an old laptop of one of my bosses, and it just works fine with this motherboard + Windows XP. Of course, I said I wanna use this machine for Windows 9x (probably Win Me, since I have slower machines that can be recicled for 98SE) so I must get a smaller HDD, that fits in the 9x HDD limitations, probably an IDE one to avoid any kind of incompatibilities. I probably have one 80Gb unit lying around, so I may use that one.

Cheap 120GB SSD. As long as you are not too attached to HDD noise or something. Fits 98 limitations and should work just fine on MCP2-R SATA.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

[*]The RAM: For now, the ram appears to be running at 200mhz DDR (equivalent to 400mhz), wich is the max speed this kit offers. Of course, the CPU I would get won't have a 400MT/s FSB, but at best a 333MT/s one, so I'll probably have to downclock the ram a bit, and gain a bit of latency out of it. But, if push comes to shove, I can get a better kit (even if used), but I would like to avoid it, since this kit is brand new.

Nforce 2 really likes CPU FSB and RAM frequency to be the same. It easily performs better with FSB/RAM at 333 than with 333/400. Does dual channel work? Be sure to run memtest, nforce2 can be quite annoying in terms of RAM.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-21, 02:00:

Are there any games which actually have issues with faster CPUs at that point? I may be totally wrong but AFAIK at this point faster=better with no downsides.

That said 2500+ barton, AXDA2500DKV4D, 333x11 is a fun one as many (most?) of them run at 400x11 just fine, becoming basically 3200+ - the fastest S462 CPU.

AFAIK, only Fifa 2002 fromy pool of games doesn't like 2ghz+ CPUs, but there could be more. I'm also doing this to avoid excessive heat, so I may be avoiding over clocking for this one.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-21, 02:00:

Cheap 120GB SSD. As long as you are not too attached to HDD noise or something. Fits 98 limitations and should work just fine on MCP2-R SATA.

Aren't SSDs a little bit problematic to run on Xp and older OSs? Because they don't perform some maintenance procedures that ssd requires?
I still kept an hdd in my definitive xp machine, so I don't really feel the need for faster ssd.
If I'll go with sata, I'll try and look for a smaller 120gb hdd.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-21, 02:00:

Nforce 2 really likes CPU FSB and RAM frequency to be the same. It easily performs better with FSB/RAM at 333 than with 333/400. Does dual channel work? Be sure to run memtest, nforce2 can be quite annoying in terms of RAM.

I'm pretty sure my kit does have presets for both 200 and 166mhz, and it does run in dual channel. But yes, is still worth trying a memtest just to check stability.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 06:51:

AFAIK, only Fifa 2002 fromy pool of games doesn't like 2ghz+ CPUs, but there could be more. I'm also doing this to avoid excessive heat, so I may be avoiding over clocking for this one.

It is possible to switch between 100/133/166/200 FSB on most motherboards without it affecting any other clocks, so worst case if you got 3200+, for example, and some game refuses to work at 2+Ghz you can always go into bios and set it to 166 instead of 200.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 06:51:

Aren't SSDs a little bit problematic to run on Xp and older OSs? Because they don't perform some maintenance procedures that ssd requires?
I still kept an hdd in my definitive xp machine, so I don't really feel the need for faster ssd.
If I'll go with sata, I'll try and look for a smaller 120gb hdd.

Not really. Lack of TRIM affects wear and performance, but is by no means critical. People are simply obsessed about it too much.

Can use HDD too, performance would not really matter for 98. For me the reason to prefer SSD is availability, price and reliability. You can not get new HDD small enough to not cause issues with 98, but new 120GB SSDs still exist. Also no noise.

Abit nf7-s2g is a nice board that should provide a solid foundation for your system. That being said I got 2 of them and none works with a SSD. you need a regular sata HDD with a max capacity of 120gb and you are all set. Please be aware that archer57 is right: FSB:DRAM must be run in sync.
Any barton would be more than enough for 98se/me, 2500 is an excellent choice because most of the time it can be run at FSB 200 and is very cheap.
Do not skimp on the power supply: get one from a known manufacturer. Don't think that if the board has the p4 connector you can use any PSU. get one with a minimum of 20A on the 5v rail - i said this based on my experience with abit socket A boards.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-21, 09:26:

It is possible to switch between 100/133/166/200 FSB on most motherboards without it affecting any other clocks, so worst case if you got 3200+, for example, and some game refuses to work at 2+Ghz you can always go into bios and set it to 166 instead of 200.

Yup, that I know. Unfortunately, I just checked prices for 3200+ CPUs... It is painful. So I think I'll still go with a lower clocked one, more for heat/power than anything else. Unfortunately also good coolers for 462 are hella expensive, and I didn't even saw one that attach throught the mounting holes on the MOBO. Of course, I could always MacGyver my way around it and try to use a modern cooler...

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 06:51:

Not really. Lack of TRIM affects wear and performance, but is by no means critical. People are simply obsessed about it too much.

Can use HDD too, performance would not really matter for 98. For me the reason to prefer SSD is availability, price and reliability. You can not get new HDD small enough to not cause issues with 98, but new 120GB SSDs still exist. Also no noise.

Let's say that also HDD comes pretty cheap, but on the used market. Less than 10€ with shipping and you get either a SATA or even IDE unit, with ebay warranty attached to it. I also have a ton of them, but none is under 120GB. Only one NOS 80GB IDE that I put somewhere (gotta find it first)

nd22 wrote on 2025-10-21, 11:28:

Abit nf7-s2g is a nice board that should provide a solid foundation for your system. That being said I got 2 of them and none works with a SSD. you need a regular sata HDD with a max capacity of 120gb and you are all set. Please be aware that archer57 is right: FSB:DRAM must be run in sync.
Any barton would be more than enough for 98se/me, 2500 is an excellent choice because most of the time it can be run at FSB 200 and is very cheap.
Do not skimp on the power supply: get one from a known manufacturer. Don't think that if the board has the p4 connector you can use any PSU. get one with a minimum of 20A on the 5v rail - i said this based on my experience with abit socket A boards.

Yup, I burned myself with the first attempt at installing XP. I used a 2TB sata HDD and, when rebooting the system (or soft resetting) it would just hang after post, being unable to load any kind of storage devices. I ended up putting a small 250GB laptop HDD and it worked no issues. Of course, this HDD won't cut it for Win9x, and using an SSD feels overkill when, on my other 462 system, on a Maxtor 40GB IDE drive, Windows ME boots faster than Windows XP on a 7200rpm HDD. It even boot faster than my previous main rig on Ryzen 3600 (just because it needed 10+seconds to post). I'm into the OS not even 30 seconds after powering on the machine. Into a game less than 60 seconds.

Currently is running in a 2:1 sync, 200mhz on the RAM (dual channel, thus 400 effectively) and 100 on the CPU. I believe that this kit doesn't have a native profile for 100mhz, only for 166 and 200. Thus a CPU with 166 should be fine for a perfect 1:1 ratio. Of course, I could try the OC way and reach a 200 FSB, but I would like to avoid that for cooling reasons. This cooler is enough for a classic Athlon 1.4Ghz (with good airflow in the case), but I fear that OCing it to 200mhz FSB will bring the power usage up close to 80 Watts. That feels like a lot for the cooling setup I have.

The PSU will be from a reputable brand simply because I wanna get a good modular unit, since I want the least amout of cables around as possible, especially if I keep the machine in this case (instead of getting one of those wacky desings from the mid 2000s). The PSU that came with this case is a 500W Cooler Master OEM unit. It has around 10 years on it's back, and I tracked most of them, and has 30A both on the 5V and 3.3 V rail. It's a solid unit, in AIDA64 voltages never drops, so I may keep it for those builds that lacks a p4 connector. Of course, I'm pretty sure that 20 amps on the 5v shouldn't be a problem even for modern PSUs, so I can just buy a new unit from a big brand, the price can go to hell.

EDIT: What about XP-M Processors? What's your experience with them? Because I read they are much lower in power than the main series, while keeping the same clocks/FSB speeds. How much performances do you loose with them?

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 12:02:

EDIT: What about XP-M Processors? What's your experience with them? Because I read they are much lower in power than the main series, while keeping the same clocks/FSB speeds. How much performances do you loose with them?

You don't loose any performance if the CLOCK&FSB are the same. Being lower powered, you can overvolt and overclock them easily. Usually the 2500+ model would run fine at real 2500MHz or even more.

kixs wrote on 2025-10-21, 13:00:

You don't loose any performance if the CLOCK&FSB are the same. Being lower powered, you can overvolt and overclock them easily. Usually the 2500+ model would run fine at real 2500MHz or even more.

That is interesting to know... It would certainly help keep the CPU cool. Currently the Duron, wich is rated for 50 watts, runs at maximum 40° under 100% workloads.
So a low power chip would run pretty chill in the system, meaning I don't need to use high speed fans, reducing the noise the PC makes, wich is alredy relevant with the GPU fan from the FX5600.

I wonder why AMD had such differences in wattage with such minimal performance differences? And did they make 166mhz CPUs for 462? And what about the "Low Voltage" models I see around?

I do not have any athlon xp-m processors - those run at lower voltage and have a lower TDP. I got an xp 3200 on abit an7 and i have to use a corsair rm750 psu with 25A onthe 5v rail. So pick your psu carefully.

nd22 wrote on 2025-10-21, 15:38:

I do not have any athlon xp-m processors - those run at lower voltage and have a lower TDP. I got an xp 3200 on abit an7 and i have to use a corsair rm750 psu with 25A onthe 5v rail. So pick your psu carefully.

Geeee... I thought that having the CPU connector would free me of needing a strong 5V rail... 20 amps are pretty easy to find, even on budget 550w PSUs (that are still from good brands and rated good on SPL's Tier List). But 25 amps starts getting harder.

Of course, I'm not gonna get an XP 3200, since those would cost me more than the whole system I built right now, so I think I should be safe with 20A with around 110 watts on the rail, considering I'll use a low powered GPU (FX5600) and only two periferals (either sata or IDE). I don't think the sound card will use much power too. The whole system may pull a little over 200 watts under heavy loads, and most of those would be used by the CPU, wich should be fed enough power by the 12v rail.
But then, If I have to buy a PSU with 25A on those rails, that's from a reputable brand... Then the PSU will cost me even more than an XP 3200!

I feel like I'm back at the same issue I had with my mobo that lacked a CPU connector: finding a 25+ A PSU on both the 3.3v and 5v rail. Wich I did. I have two enermax that have 30+ amps on both rails. But they are almost 20 years old. I really don't want to use them that much on high power build, I'm alredy pushing it on the Athlon 1.4 build.

Is it really necessary to have that strong of a rail? Or is just hearsays and speculations? Because I swear I read people, on this very forum, running Athlon CPUs on 25 amps and no CPU connector, so wich is it?

EDIT: You mean THIS ONE? Because on the italian page for it the power table rates both the 5v rail and 3.3 at 20A, max xombined power of 150W. Is yours a different model?

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

Thus, now I need to decide how to complete this build, and here's what:
...
I was thinking to an Athlon XP, maybe something not that fast (under 2Ghz, if possible, for compatibility with some games I wanna play), maybe even from the mobile series. What are your experiences with them? I was eying either a 2500+ or a 2600+ from the Barton series, that's very cheap and uses a little under 70W of power, wich shouldn't be a problem for the cooler I have.

Totally, thumbs up for the Athlon XP 2500+ Barton.
Stock runs at 1.86 GHz (IIRC) when FSB is 333 MHz, and can be OC-ed to 3200+ via 400 MHz FSB without raising the voltage, so you get a neat speed boost without that much more added heat.

Alternatively, go with a Barton-based Semprons - i.e. something like a 2600+ or 2800+ or 3000+. These are Barton cores with half the cache, so they perform around the same as Athlon XP Thorougbred B cores with the same PR ratings (IIRC!) In other words, you probably won't be loosing more than around 10% in performance... which in games will translate to even less loss. The only reason I suggest the Sempron is because historically they were often cheaper and easier to find.

I don't have any experience with Athlon XP-M, so I cannot make further comments on those. But if priced much higher than standard AXP or Sempron, I'd skip them. Seems you have a good cooler already, so probably no need to worry about the heat too much. If anything, I would be more concerned about the lack of an exhaust fan in you case. s462 CPUs don't throttle much by default, so their TDP = heat they dissipate all the time inside the case. Without a case exhaust fan, that case will get pretty hot inside pretty quick.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

... since Volcano 11s go for around 70 to 100€ with shipping

Gee, that is pretty insane.
For that amount, I can go to a CNC shop around here and have them machine me an aluminum base to clamp onto the CPU, then install whatever cooler I desire.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

The PSU: Something that was a huge headache with my originals 462 and 370 builds, in this case is probably the simplest thing to replace.

Yup.
Seeing that your motherboard has a 4-pin 12v CPU connector, this one should be a no-brainer. 😀

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

This OEM 500w PSU currently in the system does report 30 amps on both the 5v and 3.3v rail, so I could use it in one of those older builds that lacks a CPU 12v connector.

Ha!
I wouldn't trust a single number on the label of that Thermal Master PSU, even if my sock's life depended on it.
Have you opened one? They are kinda gutless units. Well, not anywhere near the worst. If anything, they are "workable". But I would still not run one "as-is" in any PC I care about, mainly because the output filtering is concerningly lacking on these PSUs (1 cap per output rail, it seems.)

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

The case:
...
What do you say? Is it worth getting another case, leaving this one as a permanent test bench, or should I just spare me those 10/20€ of a wacky case and keep this one permanently?

I'd say, keep this case with this build. It has an opening on the back for a 120 mm fan, which I would highly recommend you install. The side and front ventilation holes should really help keep this s462 build cool, particularly with a higher-end CPU. Now, if you do go with an AXP-M or some other low-power CPU, then OK, you can probably go with some era-appropriate case with less-than-stellar cooling.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-21, 09:26:

It is possible to switch between 100/133/166/200 FSB on most motherboards without it affecting any other clocks, so worst case if you got 3200+, for example, and some game refuses to work at 2+Ghz you can always go into bios and set it to 166 instead of 200.

Actually, there might be an easier way here.
Instead of messing with FSB, you may be able to just lower the multiplier in Windows.
Now I don't remember if I tested that on s462, but I do know it works absolutely fine on just about any motherboard with Crystal CPUID. In particular, I can change both V_core voltage and multiplier on any of my s754, s939, and AM2 X2 CPU boards right on the fly. As I type this, I'm running my X2 6000+ at 2.4 GHz and 1.175V instead of the default 3 GHz frequency and 1.45V core. Result: much less heat. I can bog down the CPU at 100% load, and my temps won't go above 50C on the core. With the stock voltage, that figure changes to 59-63C, which is a little too close for comfort for me for these CPUs.

nd22 wrote on 2025-10-21, 11:28:

Don't think that if the board has the p4 connector you can use any PSU. get one with a minimum of 20A on the 5v rail - i said this based on my experience with abit socket A boards.

If the board does have a 4-pin 12V CPU connector, then there's absolutely no reason to hunt for a CPU with a strong 5V rail - I say this based on experience measuring current draw on old motherboards (including Abit.)
The chipset (Northbridge + Southbridge) on virtually any s462 motherboard does not use more than 10-15 Watts. The RAM would be another 10W in the absolute worst case. So you are looking at 20-25 Watts total.. which translated to either 4 Amps from the 5V rail if powered by that rail alone... *or* 8 Amps from the 3.3V rail if powered by that rail alone. Usually it's split, so either the chipset is powered by 3.3V and the RAM by 5V or the other way around... or a weird combo in between. Whichever the case, you do NOT need anywhere near 20 Amps on the 5V rail.
Make exception only if you plan to use a Radeon 9700 or 9800 video card, as those draw heavily from the 3.3V and 5V rails (about 40-45 Watts combined.)

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 06:51:

AFAIK, only Fifa 2002 fromy pool of games doesn't like 2ghz+ CPUs, but there could be more.

Interesting.
What happens to that game when the CPU is >2 GHz?
FWIW, NFS Porsche Unleashed also has some issues with CPU's over 2 GHz (game textures and world map default to lowest, among a few other smaller graphical issues.) Someone released a HOW-TO on Github to patch this and it works great. That said, I do wonder if this would be the same issue on Fifa 2002. Seems too new, as NFS Hot Pursuit 2 (a 2001 game - the next installement of the NFS series after Porsche Unleashed) doesn't have that issue. But with EA, you never know.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-20, 19:37:

And I bet it would've been painful to run a machine on 462 in 2007.

In 2007? - Not really.
But by the mid 2010's, it was.
Scripts in "Web 2.0" after around 2010 have simply gotten too "fat" for old CPUs.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-21, 20:43:

Geeee... I thought that having the CPU connector would free me of needing a strong 5V rail...

It does. If CPU VRM is 12V you do not need to worry about 5V at all. Load there is negligible, at worst videocard will use some if it is old enough.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Actually, there might be an easier way here.
Instead of messing with FSB, you may be able to just lower the multiplier in Windows.
Now I don't remember if I tested that on s462, but I do know it works absolutely fine on just about any motherboard with Crystal CPUID. In particular, I can change both V_core voltage and multiplier on any of my s754, s939, and AM2 X2 CPU boards right on the fly. As I type this, I'm running my X2 6000+ at 2.4 GHz and 1.175V instead of the default 3 GHz frequency and 1.45V core. Result: much less heat. I can bog down the CPU at 100% load, and my temps won't go above 50C on the core. With the stock voltage, that figure changes to 59-63C, which is a little too close for comfort for me for these CPUs.

Yep, that's an option too. Especially good if it is needed temporarily to run a game. Not sure if possible on locked CPUs though, probably not. S754 and S939 CPUs are only locked in a sense that multiplier can not be increased above nominal, lower multipliers can be set. That is not the case for S462 AFAIK.

I also prefer to set this settings in bios if i am going to use it like this all the time, but that's just personal preference.

There is an offer on ebay for a Sempron 3000, it has a Barton core with 512kb of cache, FSB 333mhz and 2000mhz core clock. With a TDP of 62w you got 2 birds with 1 stone: barton core and low tdp - by socket A standards. It is 8USD - a very good offer.
Regarding the psu I stand by my assessment; case in point: XP 3200 with geforce 7600gt on abit an7 refused to start with an otherwise good FSP unit that has 15A on the 5v rail; it started immediately with a corsair rm750 with 25a on the 5v rail.
Please take into account that SATA optical units are hit and miss on socket A. I would use a IDE drive.
Also take into account that you got no fan control on that board.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Totally, thumbs up for the Athlon XP 2500+ Barton. Stock runs at 1.86 GHz (IIRC) when FSB is 333 MHz, and can be OC-ed to 3200+ […]
Show full quote

Totally, thumbs up for the Athlon XP 2500+ Barton.
Stock runs at 1.86 GHz (IIRC) when FSB is 333 MHz, and can be OC-ed to 3200+ via 400 MHz FSB without raising the voltage, so you get a neat speed boost without that much more added heat.

Alternatively, go with a Barton-based Semprons - i.e. something like a 2600+ or 2800+ or 3000+. These are Barton cores with half the cache, so they perform around the same as Athlon XP Thorougbred B cores with the same PR ratings (IIRC!) In other words, you probably won't be loosing more than around 10% in performance... which in games will translate to even less loss. The only reason I suggest the Sempron is because historically they were often cheaper and easier to find.

I don't have any experience with Athlon XP-M, so I cannot make further comments on those. But if priced much higher than standard AXP or Sempron, I'd skip them. Seems you have a good cooler already, so probably no need to worry about the heat too much. If anything, I would be more concerned about the lack of an exhaust fan in you case. s462 CPUs don't throttle much by default, so their TDP = heat they dissipate all the time inside the case. Without a case exhaust fan, that case will get pretty hot inside pretty quick.

Yup, been told that, even if I think that keeping it at stock would be safer on the long run. After all, it's gonna run Win9X games, so stuff made before 2001. For stuff after that, I have an XP build with a E8600 + HD6970. And if the HD6970 ever gives me troubles, I recovered a GT640 from my future Windows 7 build for older XP games that don't like Radeon, for some reason.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Gee, that is pretty insane.
For that amount, I can go to a CNC shop around here and have them machine me an aluminum base to clamp onto the CPU, then install whatever cooler I desire.

I know right? Even zalman units are hella expensive on ebay. I've had my eyes on a Volcano 11 sold here in europe, but the bloke wants 70€ + shipping for it. At that point it really is cheaper to MacGyver something through the mounting holes around socket 462, and just install a modern PSUs. After all, I'm pretty sure that the Ryzen stock cooler is more than enough even for the hottest of athlons, since it was designed for chips that would easily pull 80+ watts.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Yup.
Seeing that your motherboard has a 4-pin 12v CPU connector, this one should be a no-brainer. 😀

That was what I learned from that old thread about my other 462 board that lacks the connector: get a board with one or prepare to suffer looking for a suitable PSU. But I'm still getting conflicting infos here...

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Ha!
I wouldn't trust a single number on the label of that Thermal Master PSU, even if my sock's life depended on it.
Have you opened one? They are kinda gutless units. Well, not anywhere near the worst. If anything, they are "workable". But I would still not run one "as-is" in any PC I care about, mainly because the output filtering is concerningly lacking on these PSUs (1 cap per output rail, it seems.)

Of course not, I alredy got burned once. But even those Enermax good units with 30+ amps will bog down to 4.80V under load on an Athlon 1.4Ghz. In the end I decided to stay away from power hungry systems without 12v connectors, even on the GPU side. In my PIII build i chucked in an MX440SE (in place of the dying Ti4200) and called it a day. Probably both the CPU and GPU runs on less than 50W combined.
I still need to replace the PSU on the XP build though... Maybe I can pick up a couple of used premium units from a friend here, but he still wants in the ballpark of 100€ each for them (they were 300+ when new). Then I can play it sae with both the XP and Win7 build.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

I'd say, keep this case with this build. It has an opening on the back for a 120 mm fan, which I would highly recommend you install. The side and front ventilation holes should really help keep this s462 build cool, particularly with a higher-end CPU. Now, if you do go with an AXP-M or some other low-power CPU, then OK, you can probably go with some era-appropriate case with less-than-stellar cooling.

I actually solved the other 462 mobo with double 80mm intake fans, leaving only the PSU as exhaust. Under load the Athlon 1.4 remains under 50, wich is impressive considering is still a PII style case.
I'm more in the "positive pressure" gang, even my main righ that, under load, pulls almost 1000W is pure positive pressure. So I am for keeping the front fan (wich is highly obstructed and connected to a MOLEX (?)), and add two intakes on the side, then let air just go out by themself or through the PSU, since I'm getting a good unit with good ventilation.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Actually, there might be an easier way here.
Instead of messing with FSB, you may be able to just lower the multiplier in Windows.
Now I don't remember if I tested that on s462, but I do know it works absolutely fine on just about any motherboard with Crystal CPUID. In particular, I can change both V_core voltage and multiplier on any of my s754, s939, and AM2 X2 CPU boards right on the fly. As I type this, I'm running my X2 6000+ at 2.4 GHz and 1.175V instead of the default 3 GHz frequency and 1.45V core. Result: much less heat. I can bog down the CPU at 100% load, and my temps won't go above 50C on the core. With the stock voltage, that figure changes to 59-63C, which is a little too close for comfort for me for these CPUs.

About that, I scavenge old forums and, for athlon XPs, some people used to tell that max CPU temp supported were around 80 to 85°, adn anything at 60 or below was fine.
But then, the manual of my Lucky Star mobo said that "if you read temps over 50, start thinking about better cooling". Now, mind you, they didn't say the CPU was cooking, but they kinda meant that "it's not good for the longevity of your hardware".
So now, with the Duron that pulls 50W, and without ventilation from outside, even under heavy loads it doesn't go over 42/43°. So I think that a CPU under 70W with good ventilation should be nice and cool, even if I replace the fan of that cooler (it really is annoying, especially when combined with the GPU one)

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

If the board does have a 4-pin 12V CPU connector, then there's absolutely no reason to hunt for a CPU with a strong 5V rail - I say this based on experience measuring current draw on old motherboards (including Abit.)
The chipset (Northbridge + Southbridge) on virtually any s462 motherboard does not use more than 10-15 Watts. The RAM would be another 10W in the absolute worst case. So you are looking at 20-25 Watts total.. which translated to either 4 Amps from the 5V rail if powered by that rail alone... *or* 8 Amps from the 3.3V rail if powered by that rail alone. Usually it's split, so either the chipset is powered by 3.3V and the RAM by 5V or the other way around... or a weird combo in between. Whichever the case, you do NOT need anywhere near 20 Amps on the 5V rail.
Make exception only if you plan to use a Radeon 9700 or 9800 video card, as those draw heavily from the 3.3V and 5V rails (about 40-45 Watts combined.)

My GPU of choice is an FX5600. That should pull max 37W under max load, wich I doubt I'll ever see. I saw in AIDA that the GPU has 4 profiles memorized, with one of them being the full clock one, and playing several games, even heavy ones like underground, it never triggered. Prolly because I was heavily CPU limited, thus the GPU wasn't working hard. And I doubt that the actual older games I wanna play will ever push the GPU that hard to reach 37W.

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

Interesting.
What happens to that game when the CPU is >2 GHz?
FWIW, NFS Porsche Unleashed also has some issues with CPU's over 2 GHz (game textures and world map default to lowest, among a few other smaller graphical issues.) Someone released a HOW-TO on Github to patch this and it works great. That said, I do wonder if this would be the same issue on Fifa 2002. Seems too new, as NFS Hot Pursuit 2 (a 2001 game - the next installement of the NFS series after Porsche Unleashed) doesn't have that issue. But with EA, you never know.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-22, 01:24:

Yep, that's an option too. Especially good if it is needed temporarily to run a game. Not sure if possible on locked CPUs though, probably not. S754 and S939 CPUs are only locked in a sense that multiplier can not be increased above nominal, lower multipliers can be set. That is not the case for S462 AFAIK.

I also prefer to set this settings in bios if i am going to use it like this all the time, but that's just personal preference.

It just crash. There are a couple of community fixes, but one requires modern windows. One, maybe, doesn't. Also the problem doesn't appear in either FIFA 2001 and FIFA 2003, both of wich uses the same engine as 2002.
But, in the end, what's the point of going over 2GHz for 9X gaming? Maybe the latest game of the era will struggle a bit (like Max Payne...?) but even those can be ran on Windows XP without a fuss, and I alredy have a Windows XP OC'd power house.
My reasoning is: Lower clock CPU = less energy = less heat = less silicon degradation = cheaper to buy used (3200+ are 100+ € on ebay)

momaka wrote on 2025-10-21, 22:10:

In 2007? - Not really.
But by the mid 2010's, it was.
Scripts in "Web 2.0" after around 2010 have simply gotten too "fat" for old CPUs.

For real? I thought than any serious PC user would have gone Core2Due by 2007. At least, considering how precise was this guy with keeping this hardware spotless, it feels like he was one of those kind of persons. He was as old as my father, if not more, so probably someone that went through the entire IBM compatible era.
And I can testify that my Lucky Star mobo with a Duron and no AGP slot felt a slog by 2004 alredy. But that was all my family could afford, so I soldier on with it until 2009.
Of course that rascal still works to this day and I was finally able to put some upgrades I wish I knew how to perform in 2004... But that's another story.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-22, 01:24:

It does. If CPU VRM is 12V you do not need to worry about 5V at all. Load there is negligible, at worst videocard will use some if it is old enough.

I mean, it should be, right? Otherwise what's the point of a 12V P4 connector? The GPU is an FX5600 so, at worst, it'll pull 37W

nd22 wrote on 2025-10-22, 13:02:

There is an offer on ebay for a Sempron 3000, it has a Barton core with 512kb of cache, FSB 333mhz and 2000mhz core clock. With […]
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There is an offer on ebay for a Sempron 3000, it has a Barton core with 512kb of cache, FSB 333mhz and 2000mhz core clock. With a TDP of 62w you got 2 birds with 1 stone: barton core and low tdp - by socket A standards. It is 8USD - a very good offer.
Regarding the psu I stand by my assessment; case in point: XP 3200 with geforce 7600gt on abit an7 refused to start with an otherwise good FSP unit that has 15A on the 5v rail; it started immediately with a corsair rm750 with 25a on the 5v rail.
Please take into account that SATA optical units are hit and miss on socket A. I would use a IDE drive.
Also take into account that you got no fan control on that board.

Now, the MOBO's manual doesn't mention Sempron explicitly, but I don't think it should be a problem. Also, 62w aren't bad, but then is not that much lower than 68w from a Barton Athlon, which if they are 2500+ or 2600+ can be had for pennies.

Regarding the PSU, it's really weird that there are such different opinions, even on older threads about 462, 370 and suitable PSUs I recall reading people claiming you needing 25A minimun, with 30 being safe. While others claimed that modern reputable PSUs, being much better built than the past, would have no problems even with 20A. A 7600gt shouldn't be pulling that much extra power when compared to my FX5600, right?
Maybe something is off with the VRM on your board? Because even when I first booted the Athlon 1.4 in my other 462 built, with a 9250 PCI card and no P4 connector... I used the stock PSU that machine had since 2002. A 250 or 300 watt unit from a shitty brand, only advantage was that I knew the full story of that unit, and I knew it booted the system and... It still did with the Athlon 1.4 (74W!). Of course, the second I entered windows I shut down the machine, because the stock duron cooler had it running at 60° just idling on the desktop. But the PC booted. No matter what PSU I threw at it, it always booted. A no brand unit that claimed 25A on the 5V (wich would drop to 4.60V under load), two Enermax from 20 years ago that, even with 30+A on the 5V would still drop it to 4.88 or 4.80 under load...
No matter what, I never ONCE had that system refuse to boot or shut down on me for lack of power. Was I extremely lucky over the course of this past year to never experience that PC not booting or shutting off for PSU reasons?

About the DVD drive... it is indeed a "recent" ASUS unit (around 2012/2014), but it didn't give me any troubles up until now: I've installed XP multiple times, and only HDDs and bad chipset drivers (damn you nVidia IDE SW) borked those installations, forcing me to do them again. The DVD drive never missed a beat, even when installing games through it.
Of course, I also have three IDE DVD drives around (and working CD drive), one of them in the XP machine, so in case of problems it's a no brainer to swap them, putting the SATA in the XP build and the IDE in this one.

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-22, 20:33:

I mean, it should be, right? Otherwise what's the point of a 12V P4 connector? The GPU is an FX5600 so, at worst, it'll pull 37W

One caveat here - weirdly enough the fact that connector exists does not mean that CPU VRM uses 12V. There are examples of boards with the connector and 5V VRM. So to be certain take a look at VRM input caps - they should be 16V or something like that.

As for different opinions - well, if CPU is powered by 12V then there is nothing else in whole PC which can use 125W (5V 25A) at all. Claiming that it is needed is simply illogical.

Systems with 12V CPU VRM have very similar consumption to modern systems and do not require anything special from power supply. Even worse - if you use old PSU intended mainly for 5V it will have the same issues as it would on any modern system and will not work well.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-23, 00:26:

One caveat here - weirdly enough the fact that connector exists does not mean that CPU VRM uses 12V. There are examples of boards with the connector and 5V VRM. So to be certain take a look at VRM input caps - they should be 16V or something like that.

As for different opinions - well, if CPU is powered by 12V then there is nothing else in whole PC which can use 125W (5V 25A) at all. Claiming that it is needed is simply illogical.

Systems with 12V CPU VRM have very similar consumption to modern systems and do not require anything special from power supply. Even worse - if you use old PSU intended mainly for 5V it will have the same issues as it would on any modern system and will not work well.

Please, don't tell me that abit boards are among those examples... Mine is a nf7-s2g.
(and the manual suggests for heavily loaded systems, to have at least 20A on the 5VDC, wich would mean a system with high power cpu, and multiple add on cards that pulls lots of power. I don't think I'm in that camp, having a single mid gpu and cpu, maybe just another sound card)

Mondodimotori wrote on 2025-10-23, 06:40:

Please, don't tell me that abit boards are among those examples... Mine is a nf7-s2g.
(and the manual suggests for heavily loaded systems, to have at least 20A on the 5VDC, wich would mean a system with high power cpu, and multiple add on cards that pulls lots of power. I don't think I'm in that camp, having a single mid gpu and cpu, maybe just another sound card)

Also i have no doubt it is possible to use 100W/20A 5V if you really tried, like old high end videocard, a bunch of HDDs, a bunch of PCI cards... but it will not be the case for a basic system.

Archer57 wrote on 2025-10-23, 07:11:

What values are this capacitors?

The attachment nf7-s2g-top-5ff776d19b.jpg is no longer available

Also i have no doubt it is possible to use 100W/20A 5V if you really tried, like old high end videocard, a bunch of HDDs, a bunch of PCI cards... but it will not be the case for a basic system.

Good question.

I'm not great at identifying capacitors... But yeah, my system shouldn't be that loaded.

So, quick update:
I scavenged some more the old forums, this time searching for the MOBO itself and, yeah. Let's just say people in 2004 didn't like it at all, some straight hated Abit for launchig the S2G. Why? Because it carried the legendary NF7 name but it wasn't a good follow up. Of course, most rage came from those extreme users that OC'd their systems, that found in the S2G a cut down MOBO with less OC options (no multiplier change via BIOS and only % changes to voltages), weaker VRMs and, on launch bios revisions, even instabilities. Now, these same forums claimed that, by BIOS revision 13, the instabilities were solved, and the mobo got better and better. Last revision is 15, which is the one installed on my board (I checked).

Now, when I get back home I'll examine the VRM caps better, maybe I can understand how many volts they are, but for sure they aren't the same found on the original NF7-S, which are four big gray ones with a nice "16V" printed on top of them. I still hope they are enough to give power to the CPU via the 12v connector, because then it just becames a pointless connector on the board, if it doesn't provide 12v current to any components on it.

But, even then, I checked more PSUs:

• One is a Sharkoon WPM Gold Zero, semi modular, which I've owned for almost 6 years, and used in my previous AM4 main rig up until this summer. It reports 22A on both 5V and 3.3V, with 120W of combined load
• One is an Asus TUF 750B, bronze, non modular, but with 25A reported on both 5V and 3.3V, with 130W of combined load

Both go from decent to high ratings on SPL tier list, so they should be quality units.

Now, here's what I can try to do:
Get the CPU I want, probably a 2500+ or a 2600+, which are very cheap, and chug it in the system, then power it on with the Sharkoon PSU and, if it works, good, I'll use that one in this system and get the asus for the AM4 former main rig (I like to keep it in bootable conditions).

I'll come back to yall with more info on those VRM capacitors.

A high-end copper Socket A cooler was needed back in the day in case of OC above 2.2Ghz. It was possible to run Athlon XP at 2.4Ghz. High-end coolers are also not quiet by today's standards as they use ball bearings and have very high airflow compared to Noctua fans. Back in the day cases had poor airflow so a good cooler was needed. It may not be necessary with a modern mesh case. An alternative excellent cooler is Thermaltake Volcano 7. TTC-CU5 TB is not bad either. There are very few of them surviving and owners do not want to part with them.