New 3DCIF game to play with? ToCa 1 and Ati Rage II (Cif?)

This ToCa game does not use ati3dcif/ati3dcor.dll,not@cif
I think its Direct3D game, other card options work@R2R3

----------------------------------------------

Ok i tested lowest Rage2 card that i have with D3D / 3DCIF
Its Rage2+DVD PCI 2MB and 3D resolution 400 x 300 x 16
Default ATi uses 15bit color, 16bit is selected for 3 pictures
Someone can test it for Rage 2 non + cards, i have 2+ / 2c?
2MB and max resolution was 400 x 300x16@these games
If possible use Rage 2+ 4MB card or Rage 2C 4MB or more

Thank you!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

G-Police can be better with AGP cards and first real AGP card from ATi was original ATiRagePRO
ATi Xpert@Play from 1997 is one of my favorite Rage Pro cards and my first Rage Pro AGP card.
https://www.shacknews.com/article/100535/game … t-g-police-1997
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:ATI_X … _1997_front.jpg

I had a chance to test with 4 cards:

• Rage II PCI: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xpression-plus
• Rage Pro AGP: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati-xpert-work-agp
• Rage XL PCI: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xl-pci-8mb-sdr
• Rage XL AGP: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati-rage-xl

I tested on a K6-3 400 w/ 256MB ram, L3 cache disabled because it wasn't stable under windows.

I first tested with catalyst 4.3 and then installed the 5.40x2611x3D.7z driver.

I ran the MaxPerf batch file.

I tested 4 programs

• 3d mark 99 @ 800x600x16
• 3d mark 2k @ 1024x768x16
• Quake 2 crusher @ 800x600x16
• Quake 3 demo @ 1024x768x16

If a bench mark produced any unexpected result, I'd run it again to verify the result.

Direct X

• Rage Pro: Very nice improvements in direct 3d. 40-50% =)
• Rage XL was pretty much unchanged. Perhaps these "one ram chip" cards are bandwidth limited or maybe I need to check the driver or the direct X installation.
• Rage II didn't work in Direct 3d using the 5.40x2611x3D driver, but the Cat 4.3 drivers merely produced a slide show of rendering errors, so yeah.

OpenGL

• 20% improvement on Quake 2. Quake 3 took a step backwards in frame rate and image quality, but Quake 3 wasn't going to be playable at 1024x768 on this system with either driver.
• Rage XL also saw a 20% improvement on Quake 2. None of the Quake 3 scores are what I'd call "playable".
• Rage II didn't work with open GL on either driver

douglar wrote on 2025-10-31, 12:24:

I had a chance to test with 4 cards: […]
Show full quote

I had a chance to test with 4 cards:

• Rage II PCI: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xpression-plus
• Rage Pro AGP: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati-xpert-work-agp
• Rage XL PCI: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xl-pci-8mb-sdr
• Rage XL AGP: https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati-rage-xl

I tested on a K6-3 400 w/ 256MB ram, L3 cache disabled because it wasn't stable under windows.

I first tested with catalyst 4.3 and then installed the 5.40x2611x3D.7z driver.

I ran the MaxPerf batch file.

I tested 4 programs

• 3d mark 99 @ 800x600x16
• 3d mark 2k @ 1024x768x16
• Quake 2 crusher @ 800x600x16
• Quake 3 demo @ 1024x768x16

If a bench mark produced any unexpected result, I'd run it again to verify the result.

The attachment Untitled.jpg is no longer available

Direct X

• Rage Pro: Very nice improvements in direct 3d. 40-50% =)
• Rage XL was pretty much unchanged. Perhaps these "one ram chip" cards are bandwidth limited or maybe I need to check the driver or the direct X installation.
• Rage II didn't work in Direct 3d using the 5.40x2611x3D driver, but the Cat 4.3 drivers merely produced a slide show of rendering errors, so yeah.

OpenGL

• 20% improvement on Quake 2. Quake 3 took a step backwards in frame rate and image quality, but Quake 3 wasn't going to be playable at 1024x768 on this system with either driver.
• Rage XL also saw a 20% improvement on Quake 2. None of the Quake 3 scores are what I'd call "playable".
• Rage II didn't work with open GL on either driver

Thank you for your testings! All Quake results are way lower than expected, but then i saw that you use 800 x 600 and 1024 x 768 resolutions.

I have not tested Quake2 or Quake3 higher than 640x480 and all Rage2 cards cant use OpenGL for Win9x.

Even 3DMark scores are bit low, i have tested only 3D Mark 99 Max, i can comment about that at the moment.
My AMD K6II+400 3DMark99@800x600x16 with Rage XL AGP 8MB about 1350 up to 1375 points (all default).
What results you get with 640x480x16 res with Quake2 timedemo 1 and Quake3 640x480x16 if you can try it?

I will test the results with Rage Pro 8MB AGP card with K6-II+, just wait. 😀

Added one old info about monitor refresh rate, 85hz seems to be best for Rage Pro.
For testing i use Default settings,just my Fast or Max OpenGL settings for Rage Pro.

What refresh rate you used for testing?

Thank you!

Wait a minute, your Rage XL PCI card worked with my drivers, can you test 3DCIF game out?

Sorry for asking, but Catalyst 4.3 are from my point of view for Radeon cards and not Rage?
So RageII+ up to Rage XL works and Original RageII does not work, i have no Rage2, just R2+

Quake 3 maybe likes newer OpenGL more and some games need newer OpenGL, than 1091.

1091 is good for older Quake1 and Quake2, Hexen II (older OpenGL). Try v1073 from olders.
https://www.oocities.org/ziyadhosein/rprow98.htm

I have not tested what best suits for Quake3&newer!
Its easy to change OpenGL version with my OpenGLs

ATi Rage 3GL-Win9x.7z
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Tweak … GL-Win9x.7z?w=1
Re: ATi RagePro OpenGL files

Your Rage XL PCI and AGPs are 32bit lower versions, theres comes the lower score. Usually Rage XL 64bit should be quicker than Rage Pro.

Rage XL AGP 8MB 64bit that i use are with 4 memory chips:
Rage XL AGP 109-66700-01 / Rage XL AGP 109-66700-00

-----------------------------------------------

Here are my old Quake2 runs with Quake2 and AMD K6II+400Mhz and 500Mhz / Tweaked and non tweaked
I test them out with Original Rage Pro 8MB AGP as well and Motherboard was MVP3 with 256MB or less Ram.

First OpenGL version that works with SkipFlipWaitIdle is OpenGL 1084, all older versions not gain performance boost from SFWI command. Enable this option only with bilinear disabled + multitexture disabled (both disabled). Quake2 is playable with SkipFlipWaitIdle at the moment.

SkipFlipWaitIdle=1 works, i get 3fps more @ Q2 timedemo 1 demo1.dm2 640x480x16 and also no big keyboard/mouse lag for Quake2 now!

OpenGL 4.11.1091 quick test (does support SkipFlipWaitIdle=1 - enabled @ settings)
~40.5fps without vga overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + tweaked Q2 (k6-II+400@500Mhz)
~37.5fps without vga overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + original Q2 (k6-II+400@500Mhz)
~35.0fps without any overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + tweaked Q2 (k6-II+400)
~33.0fps without any overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + original Q2 (k6-II+400)

OpenGL 4.11.1073 quick test (does not support SkipFlipWaitIdle=1 - enabled @ settings)
~37.5fps without vga overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + tweaked Q2 (k6-II+400@500Mhz)
~34.7fps without vga overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + original Q2 (k6-II+400@500Mhz)
~34,4fps without any overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + tweaked Q2 (k6-II+400)
~32,0fps without any overclock and bilinear and multitexture disabled + original Q2 (k6-II+400)

These benchmarks are without sound, i add soon isa or pci soundcard and i make some Quake2 runs again.
Still SFWI is more experimental, Quake1 is not playable and Quake1 has no or minimal gain over OGL 1073.

OpenGL 4.11.1073 works now normally, like others, something with the chipset drivers did not like it sometimes.
Douglar you can try BencMark also with games, just Max and Fast settings are safe to use and try OpenGL v1073!
Quake3 needs more testing,i have tested more Quake1 / Quake2 from my side, my old Q2 result taken form here
Re: ATi RagePro OpenGL files

marxveix wrote on 2025-10-31, 13:18:

Wait a minute, your Rage XL PCI card worked with my drivers, can you test 3DCIF game out?

Sorry for asking, but Catalyst 4.3 are from my point of view for Radeon cards and not Rage?

I have the original ATI reference board that works on 5v PCI, not the stripped down knockoffs that don't work with 5v PCI.
Yes, it seemed like your drivers work with my Rage XL PCI card.

Good catch. I made a mistake. While I had Catalyst 4.3 installed for Radeon cards, I had these two installed:
mach64 4.35 drivers (1997/11/21) : https://theretroweb.com/drivers/1089
rage 128 5.14 drivers (1999/2/6) : https://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=341

What's the best way to verify what driver is currently in use?

What 3DCIF game would you like me to test?

douglar wrote on 2025-10-31, 17:25:

I have the original ATI reference board that works on 5v PCI, not the stripped down knockoffs that don't work with 5v PCI. Yes, […]
Show full quote

marxveix wrote on 2025-10-31, 13:18:

Wait a minute, your Rage XL PCI card worked with my drivers, can you test 3DCIF game out?

Sorry for asking, but Catalyst 4.3 are from my point of view for Radeon cards and not Rage?

I have the original ATI reference board that works on 5v PCI, not the stripped down knockoffs that don't work with 5v PCI.
Yes, it seemed like your drivers work with my Rage XL PCI card.

Good catch. I made a mistake. While I had Catalyst 4.3 installed for Radeon cards, I had these two installed:
mach64 4.35 drivers (1997/11/21) : https://theretroweb.com/drivers/1089
rage 128 5.14 drivers (1999/2/6) : https://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=341

What's the best way to verify what driver is currently in use?

What 3DCIF game would you like me to test?

Thank you for the info.

Good to use some ati driver cleaners, but i have countless times sometimes just overwritten drivers, but mostly Rage Pro / XL drivers.
Its good to use clean Win9x install and i have plans to use some image dos tools, i think Symantec Ghost 11.5 is good for Win backups.

Are these Rage XL PCI also 4752 cards? Tomb Raider 1 with ATi patch or Croc 1.0 would be enough with Rage XL PCI.
From Croc 1.0 select Rage II from menu.If menu screen and text is ok and game looks ok, then good news for XL PCI.

Could you make Rage XL PCI bios backup from you card as well, i can send you tools.
Some old info here: Chinese Rage XL PCI mods, improved compatibility and looking for a good overclock.

If possible make some screenshots with Rage XL PCI like i have done with Rage2+ (One post above, before your post)
If 3DCIF works@XLPCI,can i send you 5.40 driver where card info is back (to know model number better with Win9x)

As i member i removed 4752 that is RageXL PCI from 5.40 drivers and latest 5.38 still has it,i can add 4752/4753 back
Even without 3DCIF, my XL PCI card gives black screen@ 5.40 drv, so if the driver works for your LASB41,why not here

Can you give whats written on your Rage XL PCI?

My chinese Rage XL PCI has
Rage XL 215R3LASB41
maybe you have older?
Rage XL 215R3LASB22

From the card pics its Rage XL PCI and 215R3LASB41, like mine.

DXDIAG i have used for checking if card is working and with what driver it uses, if card is there and all ok then 3DCIF.

This is my card https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xl-pci-8mb-sdr

douglar wrote on 2025-11-01, 02:29:

This is my card https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xl-pci-8mb-sdr

Its Rage XL PCI (4752) or ATi Xpert98 PCI (4750) but the 215R3LASB41 chipset is the same like with cheap remade (4752) version
(i dont have your Rage XL PCI card). All 4750 PCI cards should be good for 3DCIF.

I removed 4752 inf from my latest 5.40 driver what you where testing as earlier mentions and my testing with this cut-down and very late (4752) version was not successful with 3DCIF driver.

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Oh only now i looked your link more carefully and if its Rage XL PCI (474D) then its should be 3DCIF compatible, like Rage XL AGP (474D) is.
Also inside ATII9XAD.INF i dont have no RageXL PCI with 474D,only AGP cards have 474D.I wait for your DXDIAG screenshot,take your time.

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Two Rage XL PCI exist, one with B22 and other B41, my eyes have seen only B41/LASB41/215R3LASB41

ATI RAGE XL PCI (B22)
ATI RAGE XL PCI (B41)

https://itpfdoc.hitachi.co.jp/manuals/3020/30 … 0e/DMRC0169.HTM

Added some files from before and added some new files for DOS and made one ATiDOS.zip.
If you know some useful Tool for ATi Mach64/Rage23 cards for DOS, let me know and i add.

marxveix wrote on 2025-10-31, 18:00:

Could you make Rage XL PCI bios backup from you card as well, i can send you tools.
Some old info here: Chinese Rage XL PCI mods, improved compatibility and looking for a good overclock.

I made to copies of the BIOS, one using ATIFLASH 1.0, the other by putting the eeprom in a TL866

Are either of these usable for you?

douglar wrote on 2025-11-02, 22:38:

I made to copies of the BIOS, one using ATIFLASH 1.0, the other by putting the eeprom in a TL866 […]
Show full quote

marxveix wrote on 2025-10-31, 18:00:

Could you make Rage XL PCI bios backup from you card as well, i can send you tools.
Some old info here: Chinese Rage XL PCI mods, improved compatibility and looking for a good overclock.

I made to copies of the BIOS, one using ATIFLASH 1.0, the other by putting the eeprom in a TL866

Are either of these usable for you?

The attachment Rage XL PCI BIOS.rar is no longer available

Thanks for the download, i dont know yet, but they are good at least for the same exact card, that you have.

douglar wrote on 2025-11-01, 02:29:

This is my card https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … -xl-pci-8mb-sdr

If you gona try 3DCIF game someday when you have time with XL PCI, overwrite this file with 5.40@install.
This has naming like 5.38 release with more information (4752) or some other, did not add 474D XLPCI yet.

So far i know that 474D is with AGP card, not PCI:

474c Rage XC
474d Rage XL AGP
474e Rage XC AGP
474f Rage XL
4752 Rage XL (so far not so good luck with 3DCIF)
4753 Rage XC (from its number same as XL 4752)

https://ftp.riken.jp/Linux/kernel/v2.3/patch- … ci_pci.ids.html

marxveix wrote on 2025-11-02, 23:37:

If you gona try 3DCIF game someday when you have time with XL PCI, overwrite this file with 5.40@install.
This has naming like 5.38 release with more information (4752) or some other, did not add 474D XLPCI yet.

Is that 3DCIF tech demo still available for download on the web ?

douglar wrote on 2025-11-03, 00:13:

marxveix wrote on 2025-11-02, 23:37:

If you gona try 3DCIF game someday when you have time with XL PCI, overwrite this file with 5.40@install.
This has naming like 5.38 release with more information (4752) or some other, did not add 474D XLPCI yet.

Is that 3DCIF tech demo still available for download on the web ?

All ATi 3DCIF Demos are here that i know about with my ATi 3D C InterFace.7z :
https://disk.yandex.ru/d/eV600jDAliJ_3w/Tweak … nterFace.7z?w=1

If ATi Knight demo works well @ XLPCI, then games also probably work ok.
Videos about demo1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mnahhue0VWs
Videos about demo2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C86fIHU6qro

If you download this, then it has almost all Rage3 stuff i have:
https://hingetee.ee/library/ATi3DRageProSoftwarebundle.7z

I lost a couple hours getting Windows 98 reinstalled on my system. I was trying to figure out if I could avoid using the Promise PCI card. I couldn't. Things would get unusably slow using the onboard IDE with my CF's after the 2nd reboot during the install. Like 100x slower. Next I had a curious episode where the entire windows directory went into lost clusters when I tried installing the Promise driver before the 4in1 driver. I just reinstalled at that point.

Here is the install order that I used:

1. Scripted install of WIN98se
2. Installed 4in1 v443 driver
3. Installed Promise TX2 driver
4. Installed Rage 5.14.159.0 (4.13.0001.2655 (English))
5. Installed Direct X 9C

My PCI Rage XL card works OK with the 4.13.0001.2655 driver---

1---------------
2Display Devices
3---------------
4        Card name: RAGE XL PCI   
5     Manufacturer: ATI Tech. - Enhanced
6        Chip type: Mach64: XL/XC
7         DAC type: Internal
8       Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27\BUS_00&DEV_11&FUNC_00
9   Display Memory: 8.0 MB
10     Current Mode: 800 x 600 (16 bit)(optimal refresh rate) 
11          Monitor: Smart Cable
12  Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
13      Driver Name: ati2drae.drv
14   Driver Version: 4.13.0001.2655 (English)
15      DDI Version: 8
16Driver Attributes: Final Retail
17 Driver Date/Size: 11/5/2001 11:26:06, 271952 bytes
18      WHQL Logo'd: No
19  WHQL Date Stamp: None
20              VDD: *vdd,*vflatd
21         Mini VDD: ati2vxae.vxd
22    Mini VDD Date: , 0 bytes
23Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-0412-11CF-2960-09A085C2C935}
24        Vendor ID: 0x1002
25        Device ID: 0x4752
26        SubSys ID: 0x80081002
27      Revision ID: 0x0027
28      Revision ID: 0x0027
29      Video Accel: 
30 Deinterlace Caps: n/a
31         Registry: OK
32     DDraw Status: Enabled
33       D3D Status: Enabled
34       AGP Status: Not Available

I didn't realize that your driver was older than my driver. When installing 4.11.0001.2611 driver over the 4.13.0001.2655 drivers, I didn't keep any of the newer files. I ended up with limited functionality.

1---------------
2Display Devices
3---------------
4        Card name: ATi 3D Rage II PCI
5     Manufacturer: ATI Tech. - Enhanced
6        Chip type: Mach64: XL/XC
7         DAC type: Internal
8       Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27\BUS_00&DEV_11&FUNC_00
9   Display Memory: 
10     Current Mode: 640 x 480 (4 bit)(optimal refresh rate) 
11          Monitor: Smart Cable
12  Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
13      Driver Name: ati2ddad.drv
14   Driver Version: 4.11.0001.2611 (English)
15      DDI Version: 
16Driver Attributes: Final Retail
17 Driver Date/Size: 9/29/1999 10:01:18, 270720 bytes
18      WHQL Logo'd: Yes
19  WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
20              VDD: *vdd,*vflatd
21         Mini VDD: ati2ddad.vxd
22    Mini VDD Date: , 0 bytes
23Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-0412-11CF-B273-08A088C2CD35}
24        Vendor ID: 0x1002
25        Device ID: 0x4752
26        SubSys ID: 0x80081002
27      Revision ID: 0x0027
28      Revision ID: 0x0027
29      Video Accel: 
30 Deinterlace Caps: n/a
31         Registry: OK
32     DDraw Status: Enabled
33       D3D Status: Not Available
34       AGP Status: Enabled

Odd that is says AGP Status: Enabled

I'll reinstall windows and try doing a clean install of the 4.11.0001.2611 drivers

douglar wrote on 2025-11-03, 00:43:

I lost a couple hours getting Windows 98 reinstalled on my system. I was trying to figure out if I could avoid using the Promis […]
Show full quote

I lost a couple hours getting Windows 98 reinstalled on my system. I was trying to figure out if I could avoid using the Promise PCI card. I couldn't. Things would get unusably slow using the onboard IDE with my CF's after the 2nd reboot during the install. Like 100x slower. Next I had a curious episode where the entire windows directory went into lost clusters when I tried installing the Promise driver before the 4in1 driver. I just reinstalled at that point.

Here is the install order that I used:

1. Scripted install of WIN98se
2. Installed 4in1 v443 driver
3. Installed Promise TX2 driver
4. Installed Rage 5.14.159.0 (4.13.0001.2655 (English))
5. Installed Direct X 9C

My PCI Rage XL card works OK with the 4.13.0001.2655 driver---

Copy code to clipboard

1---------------
2Display Devices
3---------------
4        Card name: RAGE XL PCI   
5     Manufacturer: ATI Tech. - Enhanced
6        Chip type: Mach64: XL/XC
7         DAC type: Internal
8       Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27\BUS_00&DEV_11&FUNC_00
9   Display Memory: 8.0 MB
10     Current Mode: 800 x 600 (16 bit)(optimal refresh rate) 
11          Monitor: Smart Cable
12  Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
13      Driver Name: ati2drae.drv
14   Driver Version: 4.13.0001.2655 (English)
15      DDI Version: 8
16Driver Attributes: Final Retail
17 Driver Date/Size: 11/5/2001 11:26:06, 271952 bytes
18      WHQL Logo'd: No
19  WHQL Date Stamp: None
20              VDD: *vdd,*vflatd
21         Mini VDD: ati2vxae.vxd
22    Mini VDD Date: , 0 bytes
23Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-0412-11CF-2960-09A085C2C935}
24        Vendor ID: 0x1002
25        Device ID: 0x4752
26        SubSys ID: 0x80081002
27      Revision ID: 0x0027
28      Revision ID: 0x0027
29      Video Accel: 
30 Deinterlace Caps: n/a
31         Registry: OK
32     DDraw Status: Enabled
33       D3D Status: Enabled
34       AGP Status: Not Available

I didn't realize that your driver was older than my driver. When installing 4.11.0001.2611 driver over the 4.13.0001.2655 drivers, I didn't keep any of the newer files. I ended up with limited functionality.

Copy code to clipboard

1---------------
2Display Devices
3---------------
4        Card name: ATi 3D Rage II PCI
5     Manufacturer: ATI Tech. - Enhanced
6        Chip type: Mach64: XL/XC
7         DAC type: Internal
8       Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4752&SUBSYS_80081002&REV_27\BUS_00&DEV_11&FUNC_00
9   Display Memory: 
10     Current Mode: 640 x 480 (4 bit)(optimal refresh rate) 
11          Monitor: Smart Cable
12  Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
13      Driver Name: ati2ddad.drv
14   Driver Version: 4.11.0001.2611 (English)
15      DDI Version: 
16Driver Attributes: Final Retail
17 Driver Date/Size: 9/29/1999 10:01:18, 270720 bytes
18      WHQL Logo'd: Yes
19  WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
20              VDD: *vdd,*vflatd
21         Mini VDD: ati2ddad.vxd
22    Mini VDD Date: , 0 bytes
23Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-0412-11CF-B273-08A088C2CD35}
24        Vendor ID: 0x1002
25        Device ID: 0x4752
26        SubSys ID: 0x80081002
27      Revision ID: 0x0027
28      Revision ID: 0x0027
29      Video Accel: 
30 Deinterlace Caps: n/a
31         Registry: OK
32     DDraw Status: Enabled
33       D3D Status: Not Available
34       AGP Status: Enabled

Odd that is says AGP Status: Enabled

I'll reinstall windows and try doing a clean install of the 4.11.0001.2611 drivers

Its the newest that still has CIF, but other than that, its one modded driver.
5.38 release has more changed files than 5.40 release if i am more honest.

To repeat exactly the same situation again can be sometimes not that easy.

You may have experienced similar that i have here with multiple driver install.
Still clean install with one driver i have not managed to have with Rage XL PCI 4752.

Re: Proprietary 3D API's
Re: Proprietary 3D API's

I can send here driver with Old and New Control Panel working together if someone is intrested, not well working for the 3D part, both ATi Control Panels present.I have made many tests and ATI2DRAB 3DCIF driver is in the making, i just take it easy and like before, 4.11.1xxx has no Rage XL PCI 4752 support.

Take it easy and game some CIF games with AGP card if you want and have fun, dont worry if its not gona work with Rage XL PCI (4752). Its the only card that does not work at the moment, maybe same with Rage XC (4753) that someone dont have. PhilsComputerLab and Gona have tested it, i have tested it, all is good. Most Demos i can get to work with Rage XL PCI 4752 and thats it. Of course D3D and OpenGL also works, but not all 3DCIF games and no Knight demo so far.

If someone with more experieneced at hexedit could help, i can point what is needed to change in some of the newer driver files. File names are different lenght inside dll, that maybe easier part for someone and so far i have edited names only with the same lenght. Other and bigger part that is missing from newer driver is atid16ab.dll or atid16ae.dll files and missing atid16ab.dll or atid16ae.dll names from inside some driver files.

When someone wants to know when my ati driver making started,
then read from here and continue reading below with other pages:
Re: Proprietary 3D API's

Started collecting drivers and OpenGL files even before that time.
Takedasun has better ATi drivers collection and i use his site a lot.

douglar wrote on 2025-11-03, 00:43:

Here is the install order that I used: […]
Show full quote

Here is the install order that I used:

1. Scripted install of WIN98se
2. Installed 4in1 v443 driver
3. Installed Promise TX2 driver
4. Installed Rage 5.14.159.0 (4.13.0001.2655 (English))
5. Installed Direct X 9C

I like version 405b agp driver and via 4.17 agp, also via 4.23 agp seems to work well for my via mvp3. I dont use newer ones for my mvp3.
I know many reccommend 4.35 or 4.43, not for me. I send some results later today. K6II+ 400Mhz machine is up and running and well.
With K6-III/III+ it should be bit better, but i have K6-II+, i will send results with 3D Mark99 Max first to compare Rage Pro vs Rage XL.
No fast ata or sata, plain old integrated udma 33, win98se, dx6.1 or dx7a and my 5.40x2611x3D.7z driver, this time i add soundcard.

System specs AMD K6-II+ 400MHz/256MB SDRAM.
This time its Rage XL 8MB AGP vs Rage Pro 8MB AGP.
3DMark 99 Max Game 1 and Game 2 runs @ Default.
Limiting factor is CPU, this time i wanted all @ stock.
Like you see Rage XL is bit faster card if both @64bit.
Here i used pn 109-66700-01 / pn 109-40200-20
Rage Pro vs Rage Pro Turbo is only marketing thing!

pn 109-66700-01
https://universaldatasystems.org/shop/product … 6700-01-rage-xl
pn 109-40200-20
https://theretroweb.com/expansioncards/s/ati- … bo-agp-w-tv-out

Discovered that OpenGL Multitexture is was not working faster with OpenGL 1091 at the moment,
this need more checking and dont use FastPerf.bat if it makes Games slower than default OpenGL
or change ATIDBG.ini and change EnableMTSGI=0 / EnableMTARB=0 to disable Multitexture now.

I will test this more! With MaxPerf.bat and others all good! MaxPerf.bat is fastest,
but it disables Bilinear and BenchMark is even faster for BenchMark runs mostly.

ATIDBG.ini

[OPENGL]
EnableMTSGI=0 (Disables Multitexture)
EnableMTARB=0 (Disables Multitexture)

Quake2 time / Multitexture disabled for now. I have used multitexture successfully before.
I will teturn to multitexture and Rage3 later! Same AMD K6-II+ PC as with 3DMark99Max

All Quake2 3.20 fps tests results with timedemo1

timedemo 1
map demo1.dm2

Quake2 3.20@Rage XL / MaxPerf-OpenGL setting
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 320x240 all default 34.7
Quake2 default OpenGL 320x240 all default 33.7
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 640x480 all default 32.2
Quake2 default OpenGL 640x480 all default 31.4
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 800x600 all default 24.4
Quake2 default OpenGL 800x600 all default 24.2

Quake2 3.20@RagePro / MaxPerf-OpenGL setting
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 320x240 all default 34.4
Quake2 default OpenGL 320x240 all default 33.3
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 640x480 all default 28.1
Quake2 default OpenGL 640x480 all default 27.8
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 800x600 all default 19.1
Quake2 default OpenGL 800x600 all default 19.0

----------------------------------------

Quake2 v3.20 @Rage XL FastPerf-OpenGL setting
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 320x240 all default 34.4
Quake2 default OpenGL 320x240 all default 33.4
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 640x480 all default 27.9
Quake2 default OpenGL 640x480 all default 27.6
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 800x600 all default 19.4
Quake2 default OpenGL 800x600 all default 19.4

Quake2 3.20 @RagePro FastPerf-OpenGL setting
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 320x240 all default 34.3
Quake2 default OpenGL 320x240 all default 33.3
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 640x480 all default 23.8
Quake2 default OpenGL 640x480 all default 23.7
Quake2 3Dnow ! OpenGL 800x600 all default 16.0
Quake2 default OpenGL 800x600 all default 16.0

3DNow! OpenGL renderer gain was more visible at lower resolutions vs default OpenGL renderer. All Quake2 settings are at default, only resolution was changed and MaxPerf.bat or FastPerf.bat OpenGL settings was used (FastPerf.bat mulitexture was disabled). FastPerf.bat without Multitexture is similar to default settings, but i return with Multitexture. For the soundcard it used ESS Solo1 and no OC, No Quake2 tweaks, just original Quake2 3.20 with and without 3DNow! OpenGL.

douglar wrote on 2025-10-31, 12:24:

I tested on a K6-3 400 w/ 256MB ram, L3 cache disabled because it wasn't stable under windows. […]
Show full quote

I tested on a K6-3 400 w/ 256MB ram, L3 cache disabled because it wasn't stable under windows.

installed the 5.40x2611x3D.7z driver.

I ran the MaxPerf batch file.

If a bench mark produced any unexpected result, I'd run it again to verify the result.

The attachment Untitled.jpg is no longer available

Douglar: K6-III should get bit better or at least same results with K6-II+. I can send my MVP3 driver package or add it here. VGA driver was the same 5.40x2611x3D.7z. Added 800x600 resulotion, i had no crusher map. Ideally Rage XL and Rage Pro also need bit faster cpus to get going even better. RageXL 8MB AGP (64bit) can go easly 1500-1600 points with faster CPU and RagePro limit is not at 1200 points @800x600x16 and 3DMark99Max.

If you get the 3DMark score up, then OpenGL gets also bit better i think. Almost at the limit with your K6-III @ 400Mhz and Rage Pro.

AMD K6-II+ 400Mhz/256MB/RagePro@1246p
download/file.php?id=230157&mode=view

I do not have 85hz monitor to check difference between 75hz and 85hz and Adapter default vs 85hz. Still with Adapter default i did get 0.1 - 0.2fps more now with quick testing, so 75hz is not best and all Quake2 tests i did today with 75hz, not at Adapter default! Is FPS limiter on, it does not want to go easly higher than 34.5 fps. Its was clean install, without Rage Tweaker and zero settings changes. Benchmark results should go higher and differences between some resolutions are very low with BencMark.bat.

I try do turn off VSync and look differnences then.